Some heavy visitors to NZ

[Dave Homewood]

Here are a few photos of heavy four-engined visitors to NZ during the war, from the Bill Edhouse collection (a couple are Air Force Museum Official):

This DC-6 (?) has an RAF serial which appears to be NL980 (?), and I think this is at Whenuapai



Bill reckoned this was the Liberator that brought Mrs Roosevelt to NZ, but the second photo which is official is dated 10 Apr 1944 so unless she visited twice I'd guess this is a later visit by a Liberator transport?





And lastly a Lancaster, which I assume is the RAAF's Queenie VI

[baz62]

Interesting that the Lancaster doesn't have the Mid Upper turret installed? Weight saving measure perhaps?

[Peter Lewis]

The Douglas is not NL980 - that comes up as a Tiger Moth. Could be KL980 - see below.
Probably an RAF Douglas C-54 (DC-4 in later life).

From Pprune:
"1 x C-54B(43-17126), 1944-1945, personal transport for Winston Churchill. Assigned RAF s/n: EW999.
22 x C-54D, 1945, aircraft in service with the RAF. Assigned RAF s/n: KL977 to KL986 and KL988 to KL999.

Apart from the US Armed Forces, only the RAF had Skymasters in squadron service and this only during the last year of the war. The first in British service was EW999. Delivered in the autumn of 1944 the aircraft was operated by the VIP Flight of No.246 Squadron. Twenty-two C-54Ds were delivered to the RAF beginning in February 1945 and served with Nos.232 and 246 Squadrons, No.1332 Heavy Conversion Unit, No. 1 Ferry Unit, and Air Command, South East Asia.

Being Lend-Lease aircraft, these aircraft were returned to the United States at the end of the war. No further Skymasters were operated by the RAF."

[phil82]

I've flown in a DC4! in 1971 Qantas maintained a single aircraft for the Auckland -Norfolk Island run, which is wher I took my wife on a delayed honeymoon in 1971 [married 1970!].

Here it is on the approach to Norfolk.

[camtech]

Peter, I would agree that the C54D serial is almost certainly KL980. Even on a web shot, it looks very much KLis the prefix.

[hairy]

I would agree that it is KL980.
I have several shots of C-54 KL979 at Whenuapai in December '45, maybe there was a regular RAF C-54 run to NZ.

[Peter Lewis]

Jan 26, 2010 15:24:53 GMT 12 phil82 said:

Qantas maintained a single aircraft for the Auckland -Norfolk Island run

From memory, the DC-4 operated as a Qantas flight Sydney-Norfolk, then became a TEAL flight for the Norfolk-Auckland-Norfolk leg before returning to Sydney as Qantas! At that time, the field was grass and marsden matting.

[bobgod]

An interesting piece of trivia---the DC-4 ,unpressurised,had round pax windows.
The DC-6 -pressurised, had square pax windows.
Opposite to what one would expect.

[Dave Homewood]

Thanks for the response. That serial makes sense, thanks.

In another thread I posted a photo from another No. 1 (BR) Squadron chap's collection of a C-54 at Guadalcanal and he told me that the aircraft used to bring milk up from Australia every day or so to replenish the station. Maybe this was a milk wagon too?

[phil82]

Apart from the obvious window shape, the differences between the DC4 and DC6/7series were vast; the DC had the lineage but that was about it. Having flown in that Qantas DC4 to Norfolk Island and back, and having flown half-way around the world in an RNZAF DC6, I can tell you that the latter was a gentlemen's flying club! Not that fast, but very quiet and comfortable [the RNZAF DC6 fitout was exactly as received from TEAL], with leisurely daily legs, and absolutely no jet lag.... the way travel used to be before they decided to hurtle you around the world in the back of an aloominum tube!

[shamus]

Referring to the two photos of the Liberators (which are not really Liberators but C87 transports),
I believe they are two different aircraft. The second photo matches up to the one posted below with the Ford V8 car in it. This one has 'My Everloving Dove' on the nose which the other one does not. Also no Cessna Bobcat? in the picture.
And just as an aside, neither of them is the C87 that crashed with the Japanese interns aboard which was 41-124027. It shows we must have had a few visits from this type of aircraft.

[hairy]

Feb 4, 2010 9:43:51 GMT 12 shamus said:

Cessna Bobcat?

US Legation C-45 (Beech 18).

[baz62]

Is the Lancaster photos taken at Wigram? Or is that Woodborne?

[Dave Homewood]

One of them is at Whenuapai I belive Baz, and the other Wigram I think because I doubt you'd get a Lancaster into Woodbourne, or out.

[shamus]

Thanks, Hairy, I wasn't sure what it was.

[baz62]

Cor a real live Lancaster at Wigram. Must ask my dad if he saw it as he lived nearby Wigram during the war.

[Dave Homewood]

Shamus, your C87 seems to be missing the logo that is on the one in Bill's photo. I cannot work out the first two words but the rest seems to say "TRANSPORT COMMAND - US ARMY AIR FORCE" Here's close up of it.

[Dave Homewood]

In late 1944 and through 1945 and the postwar peiod there was a regular military airline service provided by the RAF, which flew a several times a week called the British Military Air Service. This was an air route linking Australia-NewZealand-Canada-England.

The transport LB-30 Liberator that had previously been Churchill's private aircrfat (AL504 "Commando" which was converted from a Mk II twin-tail bomber to a single tail transport for the PM) was one of the aircraft in the service, and the first to inaugarate the route.

The RCAF also operated a Pacific transport service with C-87's (Liberator C.VII's) from December 1944 flying from Sydney to Auckland to Fiji to Canton to Honolulu to San Francisco to San Diego to Montreal. This was a thrice-weekly service.

So I don't think the appearance of these large transports (at Whenuapai and Ohakea at least) was a rare thing in those latter war years.

There's a lovely photo in Contact in December 1944 of that ex-Churchill Lib flying low near Ohakea when the service began.

This site has a photo of an RAAF Liberator at Ohakea too.
www.wings.net.nz/abates.html

[shamus]

Dave, the one in the photo you posted with the logo is not the same C87 as the one I posted with 'My Ever-Loving Dove' on it. I believe the second C87 front-on in the photo with the Ford V8 in it is the same C87 as in my photo and is not related to the one with the logo on.

[Dave Homewood]

Yeah, sorry I should have worded that clearer, I was backing up what you were saying. And also adding some detail ofthat artwork.