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Post by phil82 on Aug 7, 2006 20:33:55 GMT 12
I see the August Pacific Wings is saying the Government are looking at buying 4 or 6 Q200 Dash -8s for the RNZAF as transport and inshore surveillance for Customs, MAF, and Fisheries.
I haven't heard that rumour!
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Post by phil on Aug 7, 2006 20:43:21 GMT 12
I have, it's been going around for about a year. I've even heard it from a GPCAPT.
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Post by xr6turbo1 on Aug 7, 2006 20:43:53 GMT 12
Now that would be a great idea
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Post by Bruce on Aug 7, 2006 20:57:27 GMT 12
It does make sense, The Dash 8 has a good reputation on inshore patrol work, the Australian Coastguard use them in this role. This would save a certain amount of Orion and Hercules flying hours which would extend their useful life, and it would also reinstate the medium tactical transport capability (such as dropping an SAS unit etc, moving polititians around) that was lost with the retirement of the Andovers. Heavy maintenance can be handled by the likes of Air NZ as they have them in thier fleet (I know not everyone agrees with Civil contracts). The aircraft are economical to purchase and maintain and certainly provide a good "bang for bucks" ratio. however the fact that the NH90 purchase is over budget, the LUH contract hasnt been let yet and the requirement for these aircraft would not be a high priority would suggest that we won't see anything for a while (until the price has escalated expensively anyway!) heres hoping anyway.....
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Post by Dave Homewood on Aug 7, 2006 21:00:31 GMT 12
Buying?
Did you say buying?
If so, another step in the right direction! I hope this turns out to be true.
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Post by phil on Aug 7, 2006 21:02:01 GMT 12
If we get them I think (unless there is yet another change in policy) that they will be maintained by air force, at least at OLM and possibly ILM level.
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Post by Dave Homewood on Aug 7, 2006 21:06:26 GMT 12
Ooh, could this be the return of No. 1 GR Squadron? I hope so.
So, where would they base them? There'll be no room at Ohakea. Hey, Whenuapai would be a great idea...
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Post by phil82 on Aug 7, 2006 23:19:34 GMT 12
Sorry, same report reckons maintenance and heavy engineering will be contracted out to Air New Zealand at Nelson.
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Post by Calum on Aug 8, 2006 0:12:59 GMT 12
Interesting..... Can understand the ILM/DLM maintenance being contracted out though. Despite most people thoughts here it really is the way to go for cost effectiveness
Wonder what equipment/sensors they'd carry?
Also I wouldn't be surprised to see these leased. But it does make sense to use these instead of C-130 hours in particular.
As for basing.. it can only be Ohakea... after all isn't that where everyone will end up.
Join the RNZAF ... Spend 20 yrs in the Manawatu :-)
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Post by Dave Homewood on Aug 8, 2006 0:31:21 GMT 12
I see sense in heavy maintenance being done by Air NZ - after all the RNZAF has never done its huge maintenance jobs by themselves, Air NZ and SAFE have long been involved in the modern era, as have PAC. It would be nice to think that they staff the squadron with RNZAF staff though. The RNZAF needs building back up.
As for purchase versus lease, I wonder if they would lease aircraft and also if they'd use civvies to maintain them at line level if they had high tech sensitive equipment? I mean in security terms. I know the Orions have lots of secret things that they won't let just anybody see or touch. It may be more secure to own the planes and do the work yourself? I'm not sure. I know SAFE handle the Orion maintenance but then most of them were ex-RNZAF anyway in my day.
They couldbe based at Woodbourne. That's apparently scheduled to expand too. I don't think there has been an operational squadron based there since 1941 though (No. 2 GR Squadron) and even that was just a detached flight. 1939- 1940 saw the whole of 2GR there.
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Post by Calum on Aug 8, 2006 10:22:31 GMT 12
The ADF lease several aircraft. The VIP 737's which are flown buy RAAF aircrew but maintained by Civy LAME's.
The RAAF and Army lease King airs. 2 of the Army King Airs are full of secret listening stuff and are maintained by Army personnel, these guys have to be LAMEs making those positons pretty popluar.
It's certainily not hard for Civy's to get sercuity clearances for senistive equipement, AFAIK the form /checks you have to go through for the higher levels are the same regardless of with whether you are a serviceperson, Public servant or Contractor.
If these aircraft are to be used for tactical transport then the RNZAF should be doing OLM at least. If they are just going to be coastwatch, MAF, fisheres etc then I'm not so sure.
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Post by flyjoe180 on Aug 8, 2006 11:12:01 GMT 12
The Dash 8 looks a rather sinister looking aircraft in dark Military colours Makes sense to use aircraft that are common types in and around NZ. For the same reason, one can't help but think the ex-Air NZ B767's would have been better than the 757 option.
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Post by xr6turbo1 on Aug 19, 2006 12:37:04 GMT 12
Maybe the government should do a deal with origin for the jetstreams. The larger ones that is
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Post by Dave Homewood on Aug 19, 2006 13:26:39 GMT 12
How much would 4 - 6 Dash 8's cost? Does anyone know? I wonder if they'll be new or second hand.
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Post by beagle on May 22, 2018 20:40:08 GMT 12
Well I think that idea got squashed pretty quickly. Although they use them in Australia for a bit of coastal patrol.
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awol
Flight Sergeant
Posts: 21
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Post by awol on May 23, 2018 22:11:52 GMT 12
Any reason for a 12 year old necropost Beagle?
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Post by planecrazy on May 24, 2018 8:08:49 GMT 12
Here's an Australian Customs Dash 8, sorry for the quality copy of a slide.
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Post by baronbeeza on May 24, 2018 9:33:48 GMT 12
Here's an Australian Customs Dash 8, sorry for the quality copy of a slide. I did a number of years working on that machine in Darwin. A great aeroplane. I have worked on similar machines around the world, F-27, Reims 406, Islander, Dornier 328 and the King Airs. The best, and most efficient, operation would be the Dash 8's. I worked on the Ansett ones also but the National Jet team had their operation humming.
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Post by horicle on May 24, 2018 12:51:48 GMT 12
If we are to introduce a lower level MPA I would not pick the Dash 8 for NZ use.
First on price since that drives all Government spending.
Shopping at Wikipedia you can get a (basic) Dash 8 for $32M. I would put that up against a (basic) C-295M at $28M. The tricky bit is how much you pay for the electronics (and the galley, please note that ANY MPA designed without a galley is a crap MPA). Turning the C-295M into the Persuader MPA version seems to double the price. I have not found a cost for the equivalent Dash 8. But you would get what you paid for.
A second consideration for a small operator is what else can you use the same basic airframe for. With the C-295M it is a capable short field transport. The Dash 8 is a passenger aircraft which we really do not need. Also note that the Persuader still has the rear ramp and some cargo space and easy air/ground delivery of items.
I would like to think we only need this class of aircraft if we drop out of serious deep water MPA, - or buy so few P-8s that we need MQ-4cs and Littoral MPAs to cover the gaps.
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Post by kiwirico on Jun 6, 2018 21:29:26 GMT 12
So... any thruth about the DASH 8 for RNZAF? Or just another smoke on the Horizon?
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