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Post by corsairarm on Dec 23, 2012 13:39:16 GMT 12
I was there alright. I have posted some photos of the unloading and transport of it on the MOTAT thread.
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Post by Dave Homewood on Dec 23, 2012 13:40:58 GMT 12
Do you recall who else is there in the group?
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Post by corsairarm on Dec 23, 2012 13:56:12 GMT 12
Two of the faces are familiar, each side fo the crew member, but I can't remember their names.
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Post by Peter Lewis on Dec 23, 2012 17:01:58 GMT 12
In the early 1990s there was an interest in acquiring a servicable Catalina and operating the aircraft as a warbird within New Zealand. A group formed, and was successful in raising enough backing to acquire Consolidated Vultee 28-5ACF Catalina N5404J, at that time operational in the USA. Preparations were made to ferry the aircraft across the Pacific to New Zealand. The first leg of the trans-oceanic flight, from LA to Hilo in Hawaii 14Jan1994, was successful. The next leg was from Hilo to Papeete, Taihiti the following day. En route, engine problems forced the crew to divert to Christmas Island. The engine failed completely during that diversion. Weighed down by its remaining 1000 gallons of fuel, the Catalina progressively lost height until a forced landing had to be carried out mid-Pacific, damaging the hull in the process. The aircraft sank four hours later. All 7 crew members were rescued later the same day. The stranded N5404J shortly before sinking, 150NM north-east of Christmas Island 15Jan1994Recovering from this setback, the group were able to obtain another Catalina, Consolidated Vultee PBY-5A Canso Z-CAT. This Canadian built aircraft had served in the RCAF before adopting a civilian identity as CF-JCV (later C-FJCV) from mid-1956 until moving to Africa with Catalina Safaris Zimbabwe (Pvt) Ltd., Harare in mid-1990. Z-CAT arrived in New Zealand on 25Oct1994, and became ZK-PBY with The Catalina Company NZ Ltd., Auckland on 23Mar1995. The aircraft was initially operated in a colour scheme that reflected the companies that were the major sponsors of the club: Mainfreight Transport, Resene Paints and Wings Magazine. ZK-PBY at Ardmore 1995Well know throughout New Zealand over the following years, with appearances at many airfields and air displays, the Catalina was later finished in the RNZAF colours of NZ4017, a PBY-5 Catalina and carried the squadron markings XX-T ZK-PBY in RNZAF markings Unfortunately, due to structural issues, the aircraft is currently grounded at New Plymouth. Work is required to remove corrosion from parts of the wing although apparently the spars are intact. Major work will be required to rectify the situation. The owners are investigating the most feasible way of restoring the aircraft, which includes possibly obtaining parts from a 'donor' Catalina. We certainly all wish them well in their restoration project, and hope to see PBY back in the air again in the future. ZK-PBY at New Plymouth 5Aug2012
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Post by Dave Homewood on Dec 23, 2012 19:17:49 GMT 12
Dumb question time, but has that Catalina that is seen about to sink in the mid-Pacific got its wheels down? If yes, why?
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Post by baldrick on Dec 23, 2012 20:09:50 GMT 12
Dumb question time, but has that Catalina that is seen about to sink in the mid-Pacific got its wheels down? If yes, why? Hullo Dave, this probably wont answer your question - I don`t know why they would be down in the middle of the Pacific Ocean. But, the HARS crew lower their gear after they have safely alighted, because it steers better, is more controllable on the water. The old girl handles like a pig on the water - if there is the slightest wind it "weathercocks". Simmo
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Post by suthg on Dec 23, 2012 20:15:53 GMT 12
I was just checking out Philip Treweek's photo gallery and yes it had PBY at the 1995 Easter Airshow in Hamilton in its Mainfreight and Peter Stuyvesant sponsorship colours: Other images hereMany thanks to Philip for his avid photography and planespotting and website display. I remember seeing it there that weekend - I must find the photo of Dave and Sir Tim Wallis talking over the fence!! It might not have been Dave but I'm keen to find out!!
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Post by Dave Homewood on Dec 23, 2012 21:06:12 GMT 12
OK, thanks Simmo.
Sir Tim let me sit in his Spitfire when I had a chat with him that day. That was cool. It was at his suggestion too.
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Post by hairy on Dec 23, 2012 21:23:25 GMT 12
Another post-war Catalina visitor to NZ was PBY-5A (c/n 933) F-BCJH "New Caledonia" of the French Noumean airline TRAPAS as seen here at Whenuapai.......... With the demise of TRAPAS with the advent of Air France operations in the South Pacific F-BCJH became B-1403 and then B-825 in Formosa/Taiwan. More info here (in French).......... cansonet.free.fr/Utilisateurs/Compagnies/body_compagnies.html
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Post by Peter Lewis on Dec 24, 2012 8:00:02 GMT 12
Ha! Thats great Marcus. I have been scratching the grey brain cells about that photo for some days. I knew I had seen it somewhere, but where? Searching the Whenuapai and Hobsonville books did not turn up anything. Now I know - your place. Thanks, you have saved me from a couple more sleepless nights. Dumb question time, but has that Catalina that is seen about to sink in the mid-Pacific got its wheels down? If yes, why? Hullo Dave, this probably wont answer your question - I don`t know why they would be down in the middle of the Pacific Ocean. But, the HARS crew lower their gear after they have safely alighted, because it steers better, is more controllable on the water. The old girl handles like a pig on the water - if there is the slightest wind it "weathercocks". Simmo True. I can recollect that the SeeBee air guys used to often water-taxii the Widgeons and Goose with the wheels down. Gives more control apparently, as they act like a keel or centreboard on a boat. Also it would of course lower the centre of gravity of the whole machine. In the ocean swell that would reduce the risk of a capsize.
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Post by Peter Lewis on Dec 24, 2012 16:20:40 GMT 12
When you operate a Catalina you are always on the lookout for spare parts. The local Consolidated Aircraft parts dept closed years ago. Therefore when the Catalina Club heard of two Cat hulks were about to be auctioned at Ephrata, WA, they put in a bid and secured the remains of PBY-5A c/n 1696 ex-BuAer48334, N74821 and N9535C. This airframe had been bought from The Bird Corporation (creators of the Bird Innovator four-engined version of the Catalina) by a repair shop in 1975 so that the tail section could be used to repair another Catalina that had been damaged in a ground accident at Stockton CA. The remainder of the fuselage arrived at Ardmore in 2001 and was then stripped of any useful parts. At Ardmore 2002The airframe then sat outside at Ardmore for some time until it was removed to Tauranga in August 2007. At Classic Flyers Museum, Tauranga, 20Oct2007As the Catalina newsletter has reported: " At Tauranga, volunteers set to with initial focus on rebuilding the bow section which had been removed some years before in the USA. Progress was rapid and by the end of Winter 2009 the entire hull had been tidied up and painted as a San Diego-based US Navy Catalina with the hull code '204'. The project group had previously decided that no attempt would be made to obtain wings and a tail section to replace the missing originals. Instead, the intention is that the hull will in due course become a 'walk in' exhibit once the interior has received further attention. On Saturday, March 7th 2009 the hull was lifted and positioned on a raised stand inside the museum hangar at Tauranga. This has been a superb example of a dedicated team taking a seemingly wrecked artifact and turning it into a really unusual and interesting exhibit. Well done to all concerned." My sentiments exactly. Classic Flyers Museum, 8Apr2012
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Post by Peter Lewis on Dec 25, 2012 10:28:26 GMT 12
Some extras for Christmas day: Unknown (probably post-war) Catalina taxiing in the Waitemata Harbour. Obviously taken from the accompanying RNZAF tender. The code seems to be PA, but is otherwise illegible. Formal parade at RNZAF Hobsonville May 1946. Of interest is the collection of surplus Catalinas that have been dragged up from the hard and stored on the airfield. Surplus wartime aircraft stored on the non-operational side of Hobsonville. From the left, a Douglas C-47, one of the four Sunderland MkIIIs, and a number of Catalinas. The front row of Cats include NZ4029, NZ4014 and NZ4026 so this would date the photo as around 1951 - 1952. So that's it for the Cats, folks. Nicely timed to finish today. Consider it my Christmas present to you. (My thanks to Marcus, Don, Jim and David). We still have the mystery of PA-P and PA-R to solve, but I'm sure the answer is out there somewhere.
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Post by agalbraith on Dec 25, 2012 13:26:15 GMT 12
Thanks guys, that was a cracker thread, most enjoyable indeed.
Thanks again Anthony
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Post by Dave Homewood on Dec 27, 2012 17:14:17 GMT 12
Here are a couple more shots form the Graeme Cossgrove Collection, originally from the Alf Gee collection Halavo Bay, Florida Island, Solomon Islands. Mess Hall in background. May 1944.
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Post by agalbraith on Dec 27, 2012 17:52:16 GMT 12
Thanks Dave!
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Post by davidd on Dec 31, 2012 11:50:35 GMT 12
I have not visited this thread for a week or two, so a lot to catch up on. However one thing I can throw some light on is the PBY now at Wigram, ex Auckland and Australia (and formerly Hong Kong!) This airframe was almost completey re-skinned (for obvious reasons) at RNZAF Base Auckland by some very keen types before it came to Wigram, so the latter cannot really be credited with this work! However you would be best advised to e-mail Wigram for the name of the reskinning team at Auckland, as well as its present status. Needless to say the re-skinning process removed all trace of the original undercarriage arrangements. Incidentally the RAAF converted a number of their Catalinas from "Landcats" to "Seacats" at some stage, and the RAF, like the RNZAF, was loathe to accept any of the "Landcats" as, rightly or wrongly, the "Landcats" were considered to be operationally less useful than the original pure flying boats, probably because they had to haul around quite a lot of "useless ironmongery and hydraulic equipment" (read tricycle undercarriage) which cost a lot of the original range/endurance. New Zealand was offered three PBY-5As to complete our Lend-Lease allocation of 25 Catalians for 1943 and turned them down flat, although they did eventually accept two "slightly used" Seacats to reach the 22 ultimately delivered. The RAF did not use any Landcats apart from 12 PBY-5As which were used exclusively for returning ferry crews to the USA. However the US Navy and USAAF were rapid converts to Landcats and used them extensively. Although lacking a bit of operational radius, they could be operated from normal airfields without the risk of bad weather and/or floating debris upsetting sea-based operations, and in the Aleutians they were able to operate all throught the winter by using the land runways, the available sea being denied them by solid ice fouling the pitch. David D
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Post by Peter Lewis on Jan 2, 2013 21:47:12 GMT 12
Somewhere in the shoebox I have a photo of the VH-SBY restoration in the hangar at Whenuapai, taken during an open day there. Yes, I understand that a considerable amount of hull restoration was done around that time, prior to the move south.
However, Australian sources seem to be fairly definite that the landcat to seacat conversion was done during its operational life with TAA.
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Post by Dave Homewood on Jan 2, 2013 22:05:11 GMT 12
Here are some photos I took in, I think, late 1989, at Hobsonville of the Catalina waiting to head south to Wigram.
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Post by harrysone on Jan 10, 2013 9:22:06 GMT 12
The Wigram Cat of course is VH-SBV, actually a Canadian Vickers built OA-10 built for the USAAF. She is a sister to ZK-PBY having come off the same production line in Cartierville, Quebec. 'SBV is CV592 and 'PBY is CV357. Its interesting to note that the even numbered serial no.s of the Canadian production went to the USAAF and the odd serial no.s went to the RCAF as Cansos. Here are a couple of shots of ZK-PBY which I have in her previous lives: CF-JCV with Austin Airways. This photograph is taken at Moosonee in Northern Ontario about 1971. And the other Z-CAT with Pierre Jaunet's "Flying Boat Safaris" about 1990. She was popular back then: The BBC made a doco called "The Last African Flying Boat" which retraced the route of the old Empice boats down the Nile. Bill Gate's name actually appears in one of the entries in her log book, so he must have taken a 'cruise'. Some of her colorful history can be seen here... www.michaelprophet.com/News_articles/News_articles2012/PSTravel.htmland just to correct Peter, the paint makings she wore when she first started flying in NZ bore no relationship to her sponsors (Mainfreight) at the time. They were the company colours of Peter Stuyvesant, the tobacco company which sponsored the Atlantic Odessey in 1993 (while still owned by Jaunet...see above link) and she wasn't the only Catalina to wear those markings (as you can see).
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Post by Dave Homewood on Jan 10, 2013 13:04:21 GMT 12
Back in the early 1990's there was a superb British television programme on Our World that followed ZK-PBY in its previous role in Africa as it flew tourists down the Nile. I taped it at the time and have subsequently lost it, wiping over it perhaps, or maybe loaned to someone and it never came back. Does anyone know what this was caled? Or have a copy?
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