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Post by Dave Homewood on Sept 24, 2013 19:37:39 GMT 12
A post today by Eng about a CMT trainee in the Anonymous Techo Blunders thread prompted me to start this thread.
I don't know much at al about the RNZAF CMT trainees. How did the system work?
If you were called up in the ballot did you have a choice between serving in the Army, Navy and Air Force? Did you perhaps have to pre-register your preference in case you were called up?
And once a trainee was joining the RNZAF under the scheme, what did they do? Were there certain trades they could pick from to join? Were all trades available? Could they choose to maybe become a pilot or something like that?
Or were the CMT trainees all kept as unskilled or semi-skilled workers? Perhaps helping out in sections like General Service Hands??
How long did the CMT service period last, was it a year?
And how did regular RNZAF employees view the CMT trainees? Were they treated as just another airman? or were they looked down on as a nuisance or as second rate citizens?
What years did the RNZAF actually take in CMT cadets?
Did many CMT types decide to stay in the RNZAF as a career?
Lastly are any members here ex-CMT?
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Post by camtech on Sept 24, 2013 19:42:54 GMT 12
Igot called up for CMT, but declined as I was already a member of HM Forces. Had to get my OC to write and explain why I couldn't take up their kind offer.
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Eng
Flight Lieutenant
Posts: 81
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Post by Eng on Sept 24, 2013 19:59:12 GMT 12
Haha Same with me I joined regulars and was posted to Cyprus (14 Squadron)after my Mechs course. 18 months later I recieved a letter from Air Department saying I would not be accepted as I had failed to provide a urine specimen ! I tried to bottle up my emotions of disappointment ! :-) ( It WAS a little bottle !)
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Post by shorty on Sept 24, 2013 21:42:06 GMT 12
I also got called up in the birthday ballot and was doing my Air Force medical and my CMT medical the same week. Was due to go into the Army one month after I began training at Wigram
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glycol
Squadron Leader
Posts: 103
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Post by glycol on Sept 24, 2013 22:02:42 GMT 12
I had enlisted as a regular and entered through the CMT scheme. The three month course including all the basics and limited training in your speciality. At the end of the three months you were graded AC2 U/T which is about as low as you can go. You were then sent to a base to await a further course. I was allowed to do basic work in the power plant bay as an engine man.You still had to have the qualifications to be a pilot but it seemed that most trades were available. TEAL apprentices were also on my CMT course and later did a full six month engine mechanics course with us. Regulars treated us pretty well.
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Post by Dave Homewood on Sept 24, 2013 22:19:21 GMT 12
Thanks everyone. It's interesting to hear about this almost forgotten chapter of RNZAF history.
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Post by shorty on Sept 25, 2013 10:17:05 GMT 12
As well as TEAL apprentices it used to be that Air Traffic Controllers did a stint in the mob as well (well they did in '67), not sure for how long or what courses they did, definitely the recruit course phase.
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Eng
Flight Lieutenant
Posts: 81
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Post by Eng on Sept 25, 2013 14:59:32 GMT 12
In all my twenty years in the RNZAF i don't think I ever heard a word of complaint re the CMT scheme. There were a lot of friendships formed during that initial 3 months they served and they also looked forward to re-meeting once again for the occasional refresher.Many decided to join the Regular force. Of course there were quite a few fellows who were torn away from the comfort of the mums apron strings . Didn't have a clue as how to co exist but soon found out ! . No room for an odd man out! One of the trainees who had an aversion to soap and water was forcibly shoved into the showers for valet treatment and scrubbed with a yard broom.Back turned septic. Bad call. I always had a good laugh at the clothes lines draped with a mixture of Bluegrey woollen sox and matching Jockey underwear (originally white)all having been boiled together. Ghastly sight!!:-) It was a pity the scheme folded . The change in those fellows after 3 months was something to behold.
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Post by Dave Homewood on Sept 25, 2013 15:42:12 GMT 12
So the time they spent in the Armed Forces was just three months? They run a similar scheme now don't they, or at least the Army and Navy do I believe, not sure if the RNZAF is involved. Usually it's long term unemployed or naughty boys and girls sent there by the courts, I think? It's just on a much smaller scale than it used to be.
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Eng
Flight Lieutenant
Posts: 81
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Post by Eng on Sept 25, 2013 16:08:44 GMT 12
Google Compulsory Military Training .Explains a fair bit .
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Post by phil on Sept 25, 2013 17:10:40 GMT 12
So the time they spent in the Armed Forces was just three months? They run a similar scheme now don't they, or at least the Army and Navy do I believe, not sure if the RNZAF is involved. Usually it's long term unemployed or naughty boys and girls sent there by the courts, I think? It's just on a much smaller scale than it used to be. That's the LSV scheme, which is run by the tri service Youth Development unit, although like most 'tri-service' things, it is very army centric. There is a YDU operating out of Hobby, as well as Trentham and Burnham.
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Post by Dave Homewood on Sept 25, 2013 17:30:05 GMT 12
OK. Cheers.
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Post by shorty on Sept 26, 2013 7:22:52 GMT 12
In a similar vein who how many people here are old enough to remember school cadets? Compulsory in my day and uniforms like sandpaper.
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Post by phil82 on Sept 26, 2013 9:04:04 GMT 12
In all my twenty years in the RNZAF i don't think I ever heard a word of complaint re the CMT scheme. There were a lot of friendships formed during that initial 3 months they served and they also looked forward to re-meeting once again for the occasional refresher.Many decided to join the Regular force. Of course there were quite a few fellows who were torn away from the comfort of the mums apron strings . Didn't have a clue as how to co exist but soon found out ! . No room for an odd man out! One of the trainees who had an aversion to soap and water was forcibly shoved into the showers for valet treatment and scrubbed with a yard broom.Back turned septic. Bad call. I always had a good laugh at the clothes lines draped with a mixture of Bluegrey woollen sox and matching Jockey underwear (originally white)all having been boiled together. Ghastly sight!!:-) It was a pity the scheme folded . The change in those fellows after 3 months was something to behold. Quite right.CMT never did anyone any harm and conversely did a lot of people a lot of good! I don't know a lot about CMT though I gather, like National Service in the UK, most inductees went to the Army because it took too long to train them for RAF trades to get any benefit out of them. In my time in the RAF from 1957-62 I came across very few National Servicemen though I knew a few who opted to sign on for the minimum REgular engagement of three years because it was a relatively large boost in pay! My second career after the RNZAF was in Education and I worked very closely with teachers who, as a group, can sometimes be a bit ..err...radical in their thinking, but even there I found the odd one or two who had done CMT and despite being ant-military would quietly acknowledge that the experience was a positive one in the end!
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Post by camtech on Sept 26, 2013 16:04:07 GMT 12
Yes Shorty, I can well remember school cadets. In my 3rd form year, they made it voluntary, but still with barracks week in school time. Scratchy uniforms, teachers as officers (some with what seemed to be rows of medals). We had an Army company with 3 platoons and an ATC squadron with 3 flights.
After 4 years, I made it to Warrant Officer, then got made RSM as I was the most senior twerp available. Sad thing was when I said I was not going back for a 5th year, they closed it down as they didn't have enough senior pupils to act as NCO's
I can remember doing NCO courses at Burnham during the holidays - great fun.
A few of us even joined the air force afterwards.
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Eng
Flight Lieutenant
Posts: 81
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Post by Eng on Sept 27, 2013 15:04:24 GMT 12
- In 1951 at Wigram we (Draft 47) acquired the services of a delightful Drill Sergeant one "Fanny McLean " To look after us . A real gentleman whom we respected greatly. Unlike many other drill Sergeants of that era I never once seen or heard him losing his rag. His formal instruction on how to iron a shirt was a masterpiece and should have been standard fare for any British Music Hall entertainment. When dressed in his khaki shorts and wearing large highly polished boots his legs being about the circumference of matchsticks gave rise to many concerned comments regarding "his lack of visible support." When inspecting one's rifle after porting arms he would, on peering down the barrel comment " that there appeared to be more sand in that hole than in the Sahara Desert" Another favourite command of his was "AAAAAAT the Haaaalt on the Leeeft........Form your own conclusions."
Long gone probably but well remembered .
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Post by avenger on Oct 1, 2013 8:45:29 GMT 12
There's a book recently released "Fit To Fight,", Compulsory Military Training and National Service in New Zealand 1949 - 72. Authored by PDF Cooke and available in our libraries, I currrently have a copy on loan. I was in an area where usually CMT's were infantry but I was made aware there were all service choices possible and many trades so applied for RNZAF flight grading. Was interviewed by two NCO's from Ohakea at the local small town library and accepted. Deferred start time to fit with farm activities. Completed the three month period at RNZAF Taieri where the 12 hours of Tiger Moth time were completed. Not required for further training as lived outside of the four main centres. My CMT period mid 1955. But joined as a regular some two years later and due to the elapsed time was required to re-do that similar initial training.
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Post by Dave Homewood on Oct 1, 2013 12:43:48 GMT 12
Interesting, thanks for that Avenger. It is great to see the stories coming out about the CMT RNZAF chaps.
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Post by rone on Dec 24, 2013 16:50:32 GMT 12
I did my 3 months at Hobsonville, went in about January 1956, had 1 annual camp of 2weeks before Govt. scrapped CMT for Airforce and Navy. Posted to Reserve until 1965. Originally opted for aircrew training but after waiting a while was informed flying training was being stopped, I was given the choice of LAA or the Army,so I took lAA
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Post by beagle on Dec 27, 2013 16:41:17 GMT 12
bring back CMT for 12 months those that don't get sorted out deport back home
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