Harvard NZ1065 History and Logbook Entries Sought

[Dave Homewood]

Forum member Brett Nicholls has recently purchased Harvard NZ1065 (ZK-ENF) from Frank Parker, and he has asked me to look into its history as very little is known about the aeroplane's early days, especially from its arrival in NZ in October 1943 through till joining No. 1 (Auckland) Squadron, Territorial Air Force, in December 1955.

I have been looking through copies of logbooks and found very little, only some entries from 1955-57 with the TAF. It does not seem to have served with No. 2 SFTS or the two Fighter OTU's, nor Central Flying School. So where was NZ1065 based and who with during WWII, and in the immediate postwar years?

On the "Harvard Pile" thread member NZ1009 listed the following incidents fro its career:
NZ1065 27-Nov 1943 Karioi Forced landing, weather
NZ1065 27-Mar 1952 Wigram Wing tip hit ground
NZ1065 6-Feb 1953 Wigram Touched high hill
NZ1065 25-Oct 1955 Wigram Collision on ground with NZ1085

So which units were flying it at those times? I assume the latter three were PTS? But who was flying it in November 1943?

'65 went into storage at Wigram in July 1962, so where was it between No. 1 Squadron and storage? Was it with PTS/CFS?

So Brett and I would like to ask a favour. If you flew RNZAF Harvards in any period between 1943 and 1977, can you check your logbooks please and see if NZ1065 crops up as one that you flew? If it does, can you list the entries here with:
Date - Who was pilot and who was passenger/co-pilot - the unit and station/base attached to - duty during flight - time in the air

Thanks very much indeed. Any snippets from logbooks, ORB's or any other records would be most welcome.

[camtech]

Dave, just had a quick look at some of my data and can provide the following - I will look further and hopefully be able to provide some pilot details. Most of this info is derived from logbooks held by the Air Force Museum. Format is: the first sighting in a log book, unit the pilot was with at the time, last logbook sighting with that unit and by that pilot.

20 Nov 50 1FTS 2 Nov 51; 12 Dec 50 42Sqdn; 6 Jan 54 1FTS 7 Jan 54; 5 Feb 54 1FTS 19 Aug 54; 20 Mar 64; 31 Jan 66 MOCU; 7 Aug 68 CFS/PTS 30 Oct 68; 11 Feb 76 CFS/PTS;

This may assist with tracking the aircraft.

[Dave Homewood]

Thanks Les. Was No. 1 Flying Training School based at Wigram? I'm guessing that became PTS? I never realised they reverted to the pre-war unit name of 1FTS.

MOCU was the Maritime Operational Conversion Unit, wasn't it?

[camtech]

Correct, I believe on all counts, Dave.
Hobsonville/MOCU had a Harvard on charge for MCT of various pilots.
I guess David Duxbury will be able to confirm dates the nomenclature changed.

[Dave Homewood]

Thanks again Les.

[davidd]

Fellow forumites,
PTS (now 14 Squadron) became the name of the unit responsible for training new pilots for the RNZAF from about February 1966 onwards, a time when Wigram also became a "Base" rather than a Station. Prior to that it was known as "A" Flight of Flying Training School, Wigram, and prior to that again, it was FTS, and even earlier was known as 1 FTS. The 1 FTS name dated from 14/4/47, to coincide with the recommencement of pilot training at Wigram, utilising Tiger Moths, Harvards and Oxfords. This was more-or-less a re-naming of the existing CFS which since the end of hostilities had been responsible for the conduct of pilot refresher courses as well as certifying and giving refresher training to the instructors who were to form the core of 1 FTS when it was re-formed. CFS thereafter "disappeared" for about three years before popping up again as a separate unit in its own right in October 1950. However, just to confuse everyone, there existed between November 1947 and Oct 1950 yet another unit known as the Advanced Flying School (AFS) which incorporated (more or less concealed within) the old CFS, a Weather Flying School (formerly the Instrument Flying School), and a multi-engine conversion unit. However AFS did not last long and CFS popped up again as mentioned above, while the multi-engine task, which was briefly transferred to Ohakea, was returned to CFS at Wigram.
To make things a little more streamlined, a Flying Training Wing HQ was established at Wigram in September 1953 to control the three existing flying training schools at the station: 1 FTS (now known simply as FTS), CFS and ANS (Air Navigation School, name later [20/4/54] changed to Air Navigation & Air Signals School, ANASS). The Initial Training School (ITS), which had been formed at Taieri in August 1951 from the original "Taieri Flying Squadron", was finally transferred to Wigram in November 1955, to consolidate all aircrew training at this station. This unit, when at Taieri, was equipped with Tiger Moths to provide preliminary flying instruction and assessment for all aircrew candidates, but by the time it moved to Wigram, this type of flight grading (as it was called) had been replaced by synthetic flight aptitude testing.
A major reorganisation at Wigram in April 1958 saw the ANASS and ITS absorbed into FTS which now comprised six separate Flights: "A" Flight (air training of pilots), "B" Flight (provision of aircraft and instructors for air training of navigators and Signallers (Air); "C" Flight (pilot instruction, ground), "D" Flight (navigation instruction, air & ground); "E" Flight (Signals instruction, air & ground), "F" Flight (initial instruction, ground, officers and NCOs, also general service training for pilots, navigators and Signallers [Air]).

MOCU came about on 9/5/55, and later (1/4/62) it became MR&SU (for Maritime Reconnaissance & Support Unit). MR&SU was disestablished as from 31/1/65 when Lauthala Bay became (administratively) a detached flight of Hobsonville, with 5 Squadron HQ transferring from Fiji to Hobsonville, also effective 1/2/65.

Explaining the evolution of the RNZAF's training and support units over the postwar decades is not an easy task, as my feeble attempts above might well suggest. In fact I have had to greatly simplify the true story, which is a lot more nuanced than the above rather crude - these above notes should therefore be considered as "a work in progress".
David D

[davidd]

It would seem that the first allotment for 1065 was to Woodbourne, on 27/11/43, when with two other Harvards it was being ferried from Hobsonville (presume immediately after assembly) to Hamilton, Ohakea - and Woodbourne. So it was probably sent here for storage only (quite a few were stored here in 1944 as attrition reserves, including some Mk. IIAs with the wooden rear fuselages and tailplanes/fins). It was noted that these particular aircraft (wood-afflicted IIA's) had to be stored outside along with the other reserve Harvards, but their wooden components were given inside accommodation, so the hapless forward fuselages complete with wings attached were sat on their rumps, noses skywards - I presume they would have to have their heavy engines removed to perform this stunt! As the RNZAF was receiving Harvards from the manufacturers somewhat faster than they were being written off in service, there was a problem in finding good accommodation for the surplus airframes. Pilot on this delivery flight was F/O W D Smart, and receiving unit was given as 2 SFTS, but it seems that it was NOT used at this station by the SFTS. No damage was suffered in this forced landing, caused as was usually the case, by adverse weather. It may have spent rest of the war in this unproductive state, or it could have been later reactivated and sent to a station (where little flying was undertaken) for use as a "hack". At one stage (1943/44) all three surviving EFTS's in New Zealand had a station Harvard allotted to them, and they were used very sparingly, usually by only the CO and perhaps also by a few of his trusted lieutenants. There were also a few small Flights such as the A/A Co-op Flights and the Group Communications Flights which used a few Harvards between early 1942 and late 1944, although the Northern and Southern Group HQ units were combined with their respective A/A Co-op Flights (originally known as Nos. 1, 2 & 3, from North to South) in about February 1944, and the Central Group A/A Flight was combined with No. 42 Squadron at Rongotai in about December 1943. The A/A Co-op Flights initially used Tiger Moths and Vincents, with Harvards being used later to replace Vincents in some cases.
David D

[Dave Homewood]

It never ceases to amaze me how complex an answer to what seemed a simple question can be, and it also never ceases to amaze me how you are able to provide those in-depth and very interesting answers, David. Thanks very much indeed for the explanation of the different designations for the various flying training units.

Also thanks for that info on NZ1065,that would explain a great deal. Is it possible the aircraft might have been stored at Woodbourne all the way through till 1950 when it joined No. 1FTS?

[Dave Homewood]

Your mention of the possible removal of the engines makes me wonder about the photo I posted soe years back of radial engines in storage at Woodbourne taken on 15th of February 1945 here rnzaf.proboards.com/thread/11559/storage-woodbourne-awesome-photos

Could they be the Harvard engines perhaps?

[camtech]

Jun 17, 2017 19:33:23 GMT 12 camtech said:

Dave, just had a quick look at some of my data and can provide the following - I will look further and hopefully be able to provide some pilot details. Most of this info is derived from logbooks held by the Air Force Museum. Format is: the first sighting in a log book, unit the pilot was with at the time, last logbook sighting with that unit and by that pilot.

20 Nov 50 1FTS 2 Nov 51 L A R Hill - a navigator); 12 Dec 50 42Sqdn (Ross McVicker); 6 Jan 54 1FTS 7 Jan 54; 5 Feb 54 1FTS 19 Aug 54 (B O Harper as a student pilot); 20 Mar 64; 31 Jan 66 MOCU; 7 Aug 68 CFS/PTS 30 Oct 68; 11 Feb 76 CFS/PTS;

This may assist with tracking the aircraft.

Found 2 of the entries - both logbooks at Museum.

Re David's "twisted Tales' of RNZAF training units names, designations, etc, it was always a challenge for service people to keep track of, especially during the changes of '65.

[tbf25o4]

from the RNZAF Aircraft Accident Register:

File/date/aircraft/details

25/2/1184 27/11/43 NZ1065 forced landing Karioi due Weather
25/2/2850 25/10/55 NZ1065/NZ1085 Collision on ground Wigram
25/2/2861 7/3/56 NZ1065 Hit power lines near Whenuapai
25/2/3051 4/2/69 NZ1065 Forced landing Prebbleton Engine failure

[Dave Homewood]

Jun 17, 2017 19:33:23 GMT 12 camtech said:

20 Nov 50 1FTS 2 Nov 51; 12 Dec 50 42Sqdn; 6 Jan 54 1FTS 7 Jan 54; 5 Feb 54 1FTS 19 Aug 54; 20 Mar 64; 31 Jan 66 MOCU; 7 Aug 68 CFS/PTS 30 Oct 68; 11 Feb 76 CFS/PTS;

I am trying to get my head around this - have I got this right when put into this format?

At 1FTS between 20 Nov 50 and 2 Nov 51
At 42 Sqn on 12 Dec 50
At 1FTS between 6 Jan 54 and 7 Jan 54
At 1FTS between 5 Feb 54 and 19 Aug 54
At MOCU between 20 Mar 64 and 31 Jan 66 MOCU
At CFS/PTS 7 Aug 68 and 30 Oct 68
At CFS/PTS on 11 Feb 76

[Bruce]

Jun 18, 2017 1:50:23 GMT 12 Dave Homewood said:

Your mention of the possible removal of the engines makes me wonder about the photo I posted soe years back of radial engines in storage at Woodbourne taken on 15th of February 1945 here rnzaf.proboards.com/thread/11559/storage-woodbourne-awesome-photos

Could they be the Harvard engines perhaps?

Most of those appear to be Armstrong Sydney Cheetahs - Oxfords and Ansons.

[camtech]

Jun 18, 2017 12:42:36 GMT 12 Dave Homewood said:

Jun 17, 2017 19:33:23 GMT 12 camtech said:

20 Nov 50 1FTS 2 Nov 51; 12 Dec 50 42Sqdn; 6 Jan 54 1FTS 7 Jan 54; 5 Feb 54 1FTS 19 Aug 54; 20 Mar 64; 31 Jan 66 MOCU; 7 Aug 68 CFS/PTS 30 Oct 68; 11 Feb 76 CFS/PTS;

I am trying to get my head around this - have I got this right when put into this format?

At 1FTS between 20 Nov 50 and 2 Nov 51
At 42 Sqn on 12 Dec 50
At 1FTS between 6 Jan 54 and 7 Jan 54
At 1FTS between 5 Feb 54 and 19 Aug 54
At MOCU between 20 Mar 64 and 31 Jan 66 MOCU
At CFS/PTS 7 Aug 68 and 30 Oct 68
At CFS/PTS on 11 Feb 76

Correct Dave - It is my shorthand way of extracting data from logbooks. Other useful data is also added along the way.

[agile]

From my late Dad's logbook (acting Pilot Officer J Liggett):
27/5/70 - Self - PTS - Ex. 9, 10, 11g, 13, 14a, 17a, 18a-d - 1.15
29/5/70 - Self - PTS - Ex. 9a-e, 10a, 11a-d, 13, 14, 17a, 18a-d - 0.5
12/6/70 - Flt Lt Williams & Self - PTS - Ex. 15 - 1.05

He also has 1058 and 1080 in his logbook, which is a rather nice connection for me.

[Dave Homewood]

Thanks Alex.

[NZ1009]

According to the caption on the following photo it was stored at Wigram in mid-December, 1945.

Here are 2 photos of its ground collision at Wigram.



From other photos I would have thought NZ1065 was based at Wigram from 1954.

[felicityr]

"If it does, can you list the entries here with:
Date - Who was pilot and who was passenger/co-pilot - the unit and station/base attached to - duty during flight - time in the air"

from my late fathers logbook:

1955 - June 30 - FTS Wigram Pilot Self - take off /landing 35mins
- July 13 - " Pilot Fg Off Grigg 2nd pilot Self - stalling, spinning 50 mins
- July 18 - FTS Wigram Pilot Self - take off, landing, forced landing, aerobatics, VDF homing 50 mins
- Sept 5 - " Pilot P/O Hodge 2nd pilot self - Wigram, Darfiled Kurow Darfield Wigram 2hrs 10min
several more entries for Sept/ Oct
Nov 29 - Air Weapons Camp Birdlings Flat - Pilot Self Low level bombing 20 mins

1956 -
- Sept 23 - MOCU Hobsonville - Pilot Self 2nd pilot A/PO Patterson - duty Safety Pilot 1 hour
Sept 23 - " - Pilot Self 2nd pilot Flt Ltd Kirk - duty Safety Pilot 45 mins

[shells]

Hi
I read your post.
I'm not sure how much I can help but I have been going through my Grandads service journal from ww2 and I saw your comment and I had to have another look. In his journal he writes that he flew solo Harvard's after a couple of landings.
He doesn't say anything else but Harvard's, no numbers.
This was at a station where they where instructing and flying mainly Tiger moths.
The date of his entry about this is Monday 15th of March 1943.
His name is Raymond Farmer Wilson.
I found more info about the station where they were flying on the rnzaf website
Hope this helps some

[shells]

Will have the pilot log books and other book all scanned for you shortly Dave.
His writing is challenging but I have found it worth working it all out.
Hope it helps.
Shelley