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Post by corsair67 on Mar 6, 2006 15:25:20 GMT 12
Bloody good news for the RAAF: but of course six C-17s would have been a better number than four. Maybe further down the track they will realise that a couple more will be handy to have.
This would also have to be the quickest decision ever made by the ADF! ;D
From Saturday's "The Weekend Australian".
ADF signs up for giant cargo plane
Steve Creedy, Aviation writer
March 04, 2006.
THE Australian Defence Force will get its first Boeing C-17 cargo plane - with four times the carrying capacity of the existing RAAF C-130 Hercules - by the end of the year.
The federal Government yesterday signed up for as many as four of the Boeing C-17 Globemaster III military planes at a cost of up to $2 billion.
The four-engine jet aircraft will give Australia the capacity for responsive global airlift operations it has previously lacked.
The speed with which Australia will get the plane - the Government hopes to have all four by 2008 - reflects problems the ADF has had trying to borrow and lease planes during deployments in Iraq and Afghanistan.
Australia will be the third country to take the aircraft, after the US and Britain. Defence industry insiders say they were surprised at how quickly the Government reached a decision.
The C-17 was pitched against the cheaper European Airbus A-400M, a turboprop with a similar cross-section but a smaller payload and shorter range.
But the Airbus aircraft is not available until 2009 and cannot carry the M1A1 Abrams tank Australia has agreed to buy from the US. It is understood the ability to carry the Abrams was a requirement of the new aircraft.
"This is the only aircraft currently in production which has a proven capability to meet ADF operational commitments in Australia, the region and globally," Defence Minister Brendan Nelson said.
"The C-17 has the load capacity and range that will allow the ADF to rapidly deploy troops, combat vehicles, heavy equipment and helicopters."
The plane can operate from runways as short as 1200m, and a range of almost 7000km means it can reach most of Asia without refuelling. Its cavernous hold can carry loads ranging from five bushmaster infantry vehicles to three Tiger helicopters.
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Post by Bruce on Mar 6, 2006 20:27:15 GMT 12
They had a very short "short list" and if the need is urgent, why waste time. A good sensible decision, like most aussie defence purchases (Aussies do get some things right...just dont tell them that! ) That would also give NZ a long haul heavylift option for deploying NH-90s and LAV3s, in terms of borrowing some of the Aussie capability, but that will depend on the general NZ - Aussie defence relationship. I think if NZ were to buy a herk replacement. the A400M would suit our needs better than the C17, and we don't have to carry M1A1 Tanks!. Interesting to see how it all pans out in the next few years...
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Post by Calum on Mar 6, 2006 21:43:57 GMT 12
Great decsion, although I wish they would stop inferring that they will ever carry the M1A1. They will need a C-130 to carry the tanks crew :-)
They will be really handy for moving the gear to the MEAO etc.
Another thing to note, the C-17 line closes (or was closing) this year, hence why the RAAF had to get in NOW :-)
I can't for the life me understand why the RAF hasn't got more than 1 extra. And why the USAF isn't buying more than 150...
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Post by corsair67 on Mar 7, 2006 14:53:31 GMT 12
Maybe the ADF is thinking that the M1A1 will need to be sent somewhere on operations in the not too distant future? If the war in 'Vietraq' drags on much longer, maybe we'll see the Australian tankies in action again? ;D The Aussie Army deployed Centurions to Vietnam, so I guess anything is possible! Calum, I don't understand the RAF either: they have been using the C-17s a lot more than they thought they would (and as a consequence, paying much higher leasing charges!) but they don't want to spend the extra money buying another 3 or 4 aircraft that the RAF could use extremely effectively. Blair's a goose!  |
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Post by Calum on Mar 12, 2006 10:31:11 GMT 12
The M1A1's will never leave Aussie IMHO, Although it's interesting to note the Army armoured units will be set up simialr to a USMC one, the Tanks will be virtually identical so they could quite concievely drop the solders straight into prepositioned US equipment.......
Reports here say the Brits want more Aussies in Basra, The governments has said no so far but it wouldn't be surprising to see them there. This will be putting a fair bit of strain on the army though. particularly as their is now an increased presence in Afghanistan
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Post by corsair67 on Nov 15, 2006 16:57:23 GMT 12
A couple of photographs of the RAAF's first C-17 in the US.   |
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Post by xr6turbo1 on Nov 15, 2006 19:45:23 GMT 12
Good on the RAAF, They are building a great force and they make us Kiwis feel a little bit safer with there large presence in the Pacific.
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Post by beagle on Nov 15, 2006 20:01:15 GMT 12
nice..
first pic I have seen of it flying. Seen the one of it in the paintshop last week.
They do look nice with new paint, and the insides, well, I can remember being on 40 Sqn and this , pretty sure it was either malaysian or singaporean herk came in with only 40 or so hours on it.
All the wall blankets and etc etc looked so clean and tidy, and the whole thing smelt like sitting in a brand new car in the show room.
Then again thats what our herks wll be like when they return after their upgrades.
As to the RAF and their ones, as most know now, they are going to buy them outright when the lease is over plus get an extra one or two.
A few of them have been out here to Whenuapai.
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Post by turboNZ on Nov 16, 2006 10:03:56 GMT 12
So now they're getting the Globies (and that is really cool !!), what happens with the old antique twin-engined STOL aircraft from Canada?
They in line for replacement?
(apart from the fact there probably is no real replacement)
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Post by corsair67 on Nov 16, 2006 10:26:57 GMT 12
Chris, the plan is for 36SQN to retire some of their C-130H models when the C-17s come on-line. I think I heard that up to six of the Hercs will go, but don't quote me on that!  38SQN will operate the Caribous for a while longer yet, but I believe that there is some talk about something like the C-27J Spatan replacing the Caribou; there's even a possibly that further Chinooks will be purchased to replace the 'Bou. The problem with the Caribou is that it is so good at its job of getting stuff into/out of small and rough dirt strips, that no other aircraft currently available can match all its performance capabilities. Long live the mighty 'Bou! |
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Post by turboNZ on Nov 16, 2006 10:38:15 GMT 12
Interesting stuff, Craig.
What's a camparison between a Chinook and a 'Bou like?
They would have similar load carrying capabilities, wouldn't they?
Mind you, with a combat range of 1300 miles and speed of 200 mp/h the Caribou would be better if the Chinook doesn't get air-air refuelling.
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Post by corsair67 on Nov 16, 2006 10:58:20 GMT 12
Yep, the Chinook certainly doesn't match up in the range stakes, that's for sure. I don't know how serious an option that really is, but I do know the Army would certainly like more Chinooks for themselves.
The other question is, if the Caribou is replaced by Chinooks then who would operate them - the Army or the RAAF?
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Post by turboNZ on Nov 16, 2006 11:08:08 GMT 12
I guess the C-27 Spartan would be a better match but I'll bet it doesn't even come close to the STOL and ruggedness of the DHC-4.
Aren't Buffalos essentially a turboprop Caribou? What are they like?
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Post by corsair67 on Nov 16, 2006 11:22:48 GMT 12
Chris, I don't know much about the Buffalo, but they certainly do look like a turboprop Caribou.
They were certainly used by a few African air forces, so they must have been pretty tough.
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Post by turboNZ on Nov 16, 2006 12:22:38 GMT 12
Hmmm,...I'm looking forward to seeing the 'Bou at Classic Fighters !!! Hey, wouldn't it be way cool if the RAAF brought one of the new acquisitions over too !!! |
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Post by corsair67 on Nov 16, 2006 12:41:13 GMT 12
Well, I'm hoping there will be an RAAF contingent at the RNZAF 70th next year at Whenuapai, so who knows what might happen? I'm sure that RAAF C-17s will appear in NZ at some stage: maybe to pick up the Bledisloe Cup or the Tri-Nations trophy?   |
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Post by turboNZ on Nov 16, 2006 12:56:11 GMT 12
I'm sure that RAAF C-17s will appear in NZ at some stage: maybe to pick up the Bledisloe Cup or the Tri-Nations trophy? Ummm,...excuse me,...you are a Kiwi aren't you Sounds very Ozzie supporting to me, not to mention extremely unlikely event (s).... ;D |
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Post by corsair67 on Nov 16, 2006 13:19:04 GMT 12
Maybe I should have added that this would mean that NZ wouldn't see the Aussie C-17s until 2030! ;D
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Post by beagle on Nov 16, 2006 20:31:00 GMT 12
Can a C130 get into Omaka
if so then a C17 will
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Post by corsair67 on Nov 17, 2006 14:50:46 GMT 12
Okay, this media release clears thing up a little, as I thought 36SQN was going to operate a mixed fleet of C-130H and C-17 aircraft.
CPA 305/06 Friday, 17 November 2006
ROYAL AUSTRALIAN AIR FORCE SQUADRONS CELEBRATE NEW ROLE
The future roles of the Air Force’s celebrated C-130 Hercules squadrons were formally acknowledged today with a parade held at RAAF Base Richmond.
The parade was held to farewell No 36 Squadron and signifies the merger of the Hercules operating units to No 37 Squadron.
In the lead up to the arrival of the Boeing C-17 Globemaster in December, No 36 Squadron will relocate to RAAF Base Amberley at the end of the year.
With the Air Force preparing to enter this new era in of Air Lift Capability, today’s parade gave Senior Air Force representatives, base and squadron personnel the opportunity to formally recognise the important work of the Hercules community and welcome new Commanding Officers for both Squadrons.
Reviewing Officer for the Parade, Chief of Air Force, Air Marshal Geoff Shepherd AO, said he was honored to be present at this historic event.
“36 Squadron has been a part of the local Richmond community and at the heart of Air Lift Group operations since the seventies and it is with mixed emotions that we farewell these men and women today,” Air Marshal Shepherd said.
“There is no doubt that the future will bring many challenges for both 36 and 37 Squadrons, but I am sure that the shared and on-going commitment to professionalism, dedication and hard work will see them continue to achieve outstanding successes, such as those we have seen over the past few years, be it at home in Australia or overseas on operations”.
Joining the Chief of Air Force at the parade were the Air Commander Australia, Air Vice-Marshal John Quaife, AM, Commander Air Lift Group, Air Commodore Glen Steed and Base Commander RAAF Base Richmond, Wing Commander Tracey Simpson as well as former Squadron Commanders and past and present personnel.
36 Squadron became the first RAAF unit to fly the Hercules when it accepted delivery of 12 C-130A models to Richmond in 1958. In 1978, the Squadron replaced the C-130A with the C-130H Hercules.
Today, 36 Squadron will formally handover its 12 C-130H Hercules to its sister unit, 37 Squadron, who will continue to operate the H-model with its existing 12 C-130J Hercules.
Under this merger, 36 Squadron Commanding Officer, Wing Commander Paul Nicholas, will take over as commanding officer of 37 Squadron. Wing Commander Linda Corbould, who has overseen the RAAF’s program to accept the new C-17, will today take over as Commanding Officer of 36 Squadron.
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