The B-17 Flying Fortress in New Zealand

[Dave Homewood]

How many B-17 Flying Fortress bombers visited New Zealand in WWII?

I know he B-17D "Swoose" was based here for a little while as transport for a US General. It still exists today in the USA and is the oldest surviving of the breed.

And the 'Texas Tornado' which crashed at Whenuapai was another one. Does anyone know of others coming here during the war?

There's one pictured in a Woodbourne photo on this earlier thread, not sure whetehr it's one already mentioned or another one.
rnzaf.proboards43.com/index.cgi?board=Wartime&action=display&thread=1322

Did any actually visit NZ before the Pacific war? The USAAC had them in Hawaii I think, I know some were arriving there on December 7th, 1941, but were others already based in the Pacific?

Also back in about 1994 or 96 there was talk in magazines that the Warbirds Over Wanaka team were hoping to get a B-17 to NZ for the airshow. Does anyone know which one they tried to get? I think it was one of the CAF ones.

With Liberty Belle currently touring the UK after crossing the Atlantic last week, seeing one in NZ is still not within the realms of impossibility, if the money could be found. Wouldn't it be amazing?

[smithy]

It would be good if the WoW crowd could get hold of a Fort for the show. Though personally due to our connection with it, I'd rather see a Lanc. So many Kiwis served and many gave their lives on them, it just seems right for one to be in the skies of NZ.

[alanw]

Hi Dave

Have some answers to your questions

B17 in Pacific area:

Up till Dec 8 1941 some 35 B 17's were based in the Philippines,
1/2 were lost in the initial bombing by the Japanese
(USAAF considered Philippines as South West Pacific, at least until SEAC was formed)

The Bureau number for the B 17E Texas Tornado was 41-2667
crashed on take off May 1942

Interestingly enough I discovered Ardmore was originally built by the USAAF to take B17's but, due to the war being a little more fluid in the Pacific, it never eventuated

[fletcherfu24]

Interestingly enough I discovered Ardmore was originally built by the USAAF to take B17's but, due to the war being a little more fluid in the Pacific, it never eventuated

I was told the same thing about Waharoa airfield,obviously at some time plans were well advanced for bombers to be based here,especially when the Japs were closing in on Australia.

[shorty]

And of course Te Pirita.

[Dave Homewood]

Ardmore, Waharoa and Te Pirita were all built by the New Zealand Public Works department, with the intention of being emergency bomber bases for heavy bombers should the need arise. All part of our Allied co-operation. It's a myth that the USA built them.

[alanw]

Today Dave wrote

Ardmore, Waharoa and Te Pirita were all built by the New Zealand Public Works department, with the intention of being emergency bomber bases for heavy bombers should the need arise. All part of our Allied co-operation. It's a myth that the USA built them.

Interesting!!!! It makes you wonder then where this myth perpetuated.

Whenuapai, Dave was this upgraded by USAAF or similar
to Ardmore etc and done by NZ Public works?

[shorty]

Or was it the PWD did the work and the US paid the bills?

[flyjoe180]

I was under the impression Ardmore was going to be a medical base with a hospital etc, but that changed when the war situation improved and the fighting moved further north in the Pacific.

[steve]

From my research Ardmore was intended originally as a auckland fighter defence base and seagrove as well however all changed as the war progressed quickly. The runways at ardmore were not long enough for a fully laden b17. The dispersal field was Te Pirita north of ChCH for heavey US bombers. The myth that ardmore was built by the American forces comes i believe from the fact that a second main road south was completed by US forces from Manurewa near the regional gardens. ( forget the road name) which finished in Papakura and passing ardmore. The american built this road as they believed that with only one Gt South Road an invasion would lock out movement south to reorganise the forces in case auckland was taken like Singapore. (They did calculate that Japan would need 6 divisions to take Auckland) How many B17s visited NZ is a very good question. my guess would be no more than 20 or so. The air movements log books from Whenuapai must be on record somewhere.

[Dave Homewood]

The following comes from War Economy (an Official History book)
www.nzetc.org/tm/scholarly/tei-WH2Econ-c9-28.html#n231

‘In September 1939, the only two Air Force stations which were occupied and functioning as such were the Flying Training School at Wigram and the depot at Hobsonville. Other stations at Ohakea, Whenuapai, Blenheim, and Taieri had reached varying stages of completion. The building programme necessary to meet
the requirements of the War Training Organization was comenced, and soon afterwards had to be revised to cope with the needs of the Empire Air Training Scheme.

‘By March, 1941, the construction to the requirements then visualised had been completed, or was in hand, at the following fourteen stations, at a total approximate cost of £4,448,000. New Plymouth, Whenuapai, Hobsonville, Ohakea, Levin, Woodbourne, Harewood, Wigram, Taieri, Omaka, Tauranga, Nelson, Waipapakauri, and Rongotai.

‘The expansion necessary to meet the Japanese threat, and the need to accommodate the large numbers of United States air units which it was proposed to base in this country, necessitated a further drastic increase in the building programme in 1942. By March, 1943, some 37 RNZAF stations were in operation in New Zealand, the total construction costs being £11,470,000.

‘The improvement in the Pacific war situation from the end of 1943 onwards resulted in a progressive diminution in the number of stations.’

Nearly all the construction work for the United States forces occurred in the two years 1942–43 and 1943–44. Some exceptionally fast work was done, including the initial camp at McKay's Crossing, Paekakariki, and the hospital buildings in Auckland.1 A Public Works Department report says:2 ‘In the Wellington district the most noteworthy achievement was the erection within less than six weeks of camps in the Paekakariki area for over 20,000 US Marines. Other camps were built in and around the city, in the Hutt Valley, and at Masterton. Huge blocks of stores sprang up along the Wellington waterfront, in the Hutt Valley, and at Paekakariki.’
The same report says:

‘… in the Auckland district, camp and barracks accommodation was built for 29,510 personnel, containing 4,421 buildings covering a total floor area of 1,113,316 square feet. Three hospitals provided beds for 4,500 patients, in 251 buildings of an aggregate floor area of 1,005,000 square feet. New blocks of stores in and around Auckland were made up of 174 buildings of a total area of 1,733,467 square feet, of which 1,624,760 square feet was storage space.

‘Corresponding figures for the Wellington district were: camps and barracks for 26,542 personnel in 2,505,925 square feet of tents, buildings and huts; hospital beds for 2,340 patients in 59 buildings and 115 huts covering an area of 151,341 square feet; and 752,480 square feet of new storage space.’

All these figures are exclusive of a very considerable area of existing accommodation made available to the Americans.

1 See also p. 241.
2 Official War History of the Public Works Department, Vol. I, p. 44.

New Zealand built a lot of bases either for the US to use (like Anderson Prak which when they'd finished with it transferred to the RNZAF) and Te Awamutu which they decided they didn't want and never used, and the RNZAF got it.

Seagrove was built by NZ for Auckland's fighter defences but also had US Marine units there so some people think the yanks built it. Same with Ardmore, built by NZ and proposed for use by the USA if they needed it but in the end only used by the RNZAF.

[Dave Homewood]

Anyway, interesting as it is, back to the B-17's. Other than Swoose and Texas Tornado, does anyone know of specific B-17's that visited NZ, as in serials, crews, nose arts, etc?

Was it ever revealed why Texas Tornado was in NZ when it crashed? I know they wouldn't let any of the very interested kiwis near it, even when they offered to fix the crook engine which spelt their doom. Was it on a special or secret mission?

[alanw]

Hi Dave

I have checked through the USAAF operations for the month of May 1942 and can't find any mention of B 17 operations from
NZ
paul.rutgers.edu/~mcgrew/wwii/usaf/html/May.42.html

There is no way of knowing if all the info for May is there
but I did find in the April report that the US Navy Admiral CINC Pacific assumed command for all USN/New Zealand Air operations
except for land defense of New Zealand.

Now I know B 17E Texas Tornado 41-2667 was fully bombed up before it started take off. USAAF Bombers would not have landed at Whenuapai with a full load of bombs (would have dumped them at sea) So what was it doing?

Interestingly enough most B 17 missions were flown from Australia (South Pacific region or later Guadalcanal-Henderson field).

Further research also show that during 1942 a good number of B 17E's (all starting with the prefix 41-) crashed/blew up etc.

Others were converted into transports for VIPs as B 17F's became available.

So I find it a fascinating enigma, as to what bomber (B17/24) operations did take place from NZ?

[Dave Homewood]

After a lot of searching I have finally found an article in Wings on the crash of Texas Tornado which will hopefully solve a few mysteries. I have quickly photographed it for you all to see.









And these follow ups were published in February 1994



and March 1994

[alanw]

Dave,

That's an excellent find. Thanks for posting it.

I find it interesting about the engine and oil build up at the bottom of the crank.

I have two doco's one being Target for Today and The Memphis Belle. Both have many shots of B 17's being serviced, and it really appears that the Wright Cyclones were maintenance heavy, and the part about turning the props back wards to disperse the oil
is shown, especially prepping for flight.

Also interesting is that mention of the crew firing up the engines and taking off.

In the above two doco's the ground crew it appears do the pre-flight engine warm ups and the crews jump in and head off.

Perhaps the crew that fateful day decided to do that or were just
plain impatient???

Guess we'll never know for sure

[yak2]

"I find it interesting about the engine and oil build up at the bottom of the crank".

Probably means hydraulic lock, which is a feature/peculiarity of radial engines. Oil drains into the lower cylinders after the engine is shut down, and must be cleared (generally by pulling thru a number of revolutions) before restarting. Failure to do so can bend con rods etc., and is a bad thing.

This is an interesting mystery. Why was the aircraft bombed up for what appeared to be a communications flight to RAAF Laverton?

[Dave Homewood]

Both those documentaries were filmed much later in the war, almost a year later in Memphis Belle's case. Perhaps such accidents brought in more stringent guidelines on starting procedures. Hopefully.

I have talked to a lot of people who were at Whenuapai at that time and many of them have mentioned this crash. Some of them being mechanics on No. 1 GR Squadron, or other units there, have stated independently of each other that the crew were indeed having an engine problem and had been trying to sort it out - as mentioned in the article. I don't know if it was removed and refitted though, I've only heard that from the article. Several of them offered assistance and were refused bluntly I'm told. They didn't want the kiwis anywhere near the bomber.

It all seems a little bit odd. The accounts above and those I've been told are in some ways at odds with each other, I guess some memories were playing tricks, but also it may be a case of different people saw different things over the days they were on station.

The account that it parked over by Hobsonville Road the entire time is possibly wrong as you can clearly see it sitting on the edge of the apron next to a Harvard in the photo. However if it did go to Ohakea as purported in the caption of the photo below, it may in fact be the apron there.

But one guy states it arrived in NZ and never flew elsewhere so that is at odds with the photo caption which says it's in the hangar at Ohakea. Studying the photo the number on the tail is that of the Tornado's, so it was certainly in one of the hangars at either Whenuapai or Ohakea.

Perhaps the apron photo is indeed Ohakea as there is a Kittyhawk and two Harvards of what look to be a fighter squadon, probably No. 14 Squadron in June 1942? Was there a fighter squadron at Whenuapai in early June 1942, I'd have to check. They may of course be visitors like the B-17.

Also odd is if that's the aircraft is in a hangar next to Kiwi planes and clearly getting maintenance, conflicting with stories that it neer got maintenance. It's also conflicting with the many accounts I've heard that kiwis were not welcome to go near it, as they would have to have been working alongside it here. Not only that but the tarmac apron shot clearly shows kiwis and yanks milling around beside the big beast, without anyone trying to arrst them. Note the guy in the lemon squeezer, must be USMC?


My theory is that perhaps it visted Ohakea where these photos were taken and security was at a low level. Some engine work was done. They then flew to Whenuapai, received orders for a high security mission, bombed up, encountered engine problems, and refused kiwis of their assisatnce as they were on a high security mission. Perhaps they were carrying a secret radar unit or a VIP, who knows.

The funeral description of six trucks, one coffin on the front and two each the others accounts for eleven coffins, but only ten men were mentioned as arriving in the plane. Did they pick someone up? They were buried, and then moved twice, so we cannot go look at headstones to see who was in the graves either.

I wonder if the Whenuapai movements records for that week reveal anything?

A closer shots of the photo, is this a Whenuapai or an Ohakea hangar, can anyone tell?

[Dave Homewood]

Another closer look, RNZAF and US uniforms right next to the bomber!

[shorty]

The one in the Hangar is 41-4430 whereas the Texas Tornado is 41-2667 so they are different aircraft.

[Dave Homewood]

Well spotted Shorty, both the hangar and the tarmac apron shots are 41-24430. So what was the mission with that one?