|
Post by davidd on Jan 24, 2021 12:52:26 GMT 12
RNZAF stopped using Tigers for training in 1955, replaced by synthetic training (whatever that means) and Actual flying training started on Harvards, so Taieri ceased to be a flying training station, but still accommodated the TAF Mustang Squadron (soon to be just a Harvards squadron, then disbanded in 1957). It then became a non-flying station for RNZAF although it had civilian flying going on there still I think, then RNZAF closed down at Taierie in 1959. Somewhere I have the dates that the Taieri Tigers were flown north for storage.
Forgot to mention these courses, conducted at Taieri between 1950 and 1955 were NOT like the typical WW2 EFTS courses, which could include 50 or more hours of instruction and solo flying, but were instead modelled on the late WW2 "PNB" syllabus, and was called Flight Grading. The flying element included some 12 hours (mostly dual), and in fact Taieri itself was converted from the original No. 1 EFTS (which handled about 70 pupils per course, new course every 4 weeks), and became known as the Grading School, and operated as such till end of war. It was NOT part of the regular wartime ITW/EFTS/ITS/ATS sequence as such but came BEFORE this right near beginning, to test flying aptitude of all pupils prior to grading than as pilot, navigator, or "Bomber". The School at Taieri from 1950 was designated as the Initial Training School (not to be confused with the wartime ITS = Intermediate Training Squadron), and had (I think) about 20 Tiger Moths, although may have had more. Originally "Regular" and CMT pupils were trained in separate courses, but later these were combined into the one course. David D
|
|
|
Post by Dave Homewood on Jan 24, 2021 13:07:41 GMT 12
Synthetic training would be Link trainers, I'd think?
|
|
|
Post by davidd on Jan 24, 2021 13:21:12 GMT 12
No, although the Link Trainer was originally designed ayd intended to teach people to fly (and thus prevent numerous deaths, as well as reduce costs substantially), it was rapidly realized that "flying" a Link was absolutely nothing like the real thing! Fortunately for Mr Link (Yes that is really his name), his "Trainer" was adopted by the US Military, then RAF as a device for training pupils in accurate instrument navigation, particularly over long routes with many changes of course, etc. That was the only real role for the LT in the service of militaries around the World, at least so far as I know. Hopefully a "Brains Trust" will now come to our aid. David D
|
|
|
Post by pjw4118 on Jan 25, 2021 15:51:22 GMT 12
Thanks David , exactly what I was wondering about. I have flown a Tiger Moth but never a Harvard and it seems to be quite daunting to start flying training in a Harvard with their power , wing loading and speed. Perhaps a Harvard man could comment.
|
|
|
Post by Dave Homewood on Jan 26, 2021 20:41:05 GMT 12
David D, regarding the synthetic training post-1955, I was curious so asked on the RNZAF Past & Present Facebook page if anyone there had learned to fly in that post-1955 period with the RNZAF and could they explain what it was.
AVM Robin Klitscher kindly posted the following in response:
|
|
|
Post by davidd on Jan 28, 2021 10:26:54 GMT 12
Dave, here is the brief description of what actually changed in August 1955. "Tiger Moth aircraft withdrawn from use at Initial Training School at Taieri following cessation of flight grading on 1st August 1955, replaced by synthetic flight aptitude testing coupled with limited air experience on Harvard aircraft." This was including in the Annual Report of Air Department for year ending 31st March, 1956, as well as news releases and internal RNZAF documents of this time. This signalled the end of Taieri as an RNZAF flying training station, but as Taieri was also a joint military/civilian airfield, frequented by the Otago Aero Club as well as the National Airways Corporation, not to forget the HQ of No. 4 (Otago) Squadron, Territorial Air Force, civilian flying training goes on to this day. However not so certain of the exact make-up of "synthetic flight aptitude training", but you could probably make a fairly good guess as to what that entails! I am certain that a modernised version of this continues in use up to the present day. David D
|
|
|
Post by camtech on Jan 28, 2021 20:54:52 GMT 12
I can recall quite a few years ago being called to service a device that I believe was referred to as a synthetic testing device for aircrew applicants. It was a sphere with traffic lines and a light behind that was controlled by a control stick. The object apparently was to keep the light in the middle of the sphere. Primarily a mechanical device, I can remember it being a tricky little beast to manage (and to service), and was one of a range of devices used to assess potential aircrew. This would have been in the late 60's/early 70's at Hobsonville.
|
|
|
Post by michaelknott on Feb 1, 2021 22:07:00 GMT 12
First post on here. I just saw that ZK-BAH is no longer on the register (late 2020-early 2021). Does anyone know what's happened with this Tiger Moth?
|
|
|
Post by planewriting on Feb 1, 2021 22:36:18 GMT 12
First post on here. I just saw that ZK-BAH is no longer on the register (late 2020-early 2021). Does anyone know what's happened with this Tiger Moth? Hello Michael. Welcome to the forum. I have just looked on the Civil Register and can confirm that ZK-BAH is on the register. Go to www.aviation.govt.nz/aircraft/aircraft-registration/aircraft-register-search/ then in the second field, which is ZK-Registration, type in the required rego; in this case BAH and then click on the magnifying glass and you should get a result showing the aircraft details. Hope this reveals it is still owned by J C Baynes who has owned it since 19 March 1990. Good luck.
|
|
|
Post by michaelknott on Feb 2, 2021 15:04:47 GMT 12
First post on here. I just saw that ZK-BAH is no longer on the register (late 2020-early 2021). Does anyone know what's happened with this Tiger Moth? Hello Michael. Welcome to the forum. I have just looked on the Civil Register and can confirm that ZK-BAH is on the register. Go to www.aviation.govt.nz/aircraft/aircraft-registration/aircraft-register-search/ then in the second field, which is ZK-Registration, type in the required rego; in this case BAH and then click on the magnifying glass and you should get a result showing the aircraft details. Hope this reveals it is still owned by J C Baynes who has owned it since 19 March 1990. Good luck. Thanks for clearing that up. Weirdly enough, if you search for ZK-BAH specifically, you'll find it (as you said). However, when you search for "De Havilland DH 82A Tiger Moth" (the only dH Tiger Moth variant on the register) in the "Aircraft Model" field, ZK-BAH doesn't show up. Turns out it's the same story for ZK-BAA, unless you search for it specifically, you won't see it. At least we can get the zip file of all the aircraft, thanks for the help!
|
|
|
Post by planewriting on Feb 4, 2021 18:05:02 GMT 12
I investigated as to how the anomaly occurred. I discovered that on the CAA website that there are two listings for DH82a aircraft. One is; there are De Havilland DH82A aircraft and the other is De Havilland DH82a Tiger Moth aircraft and this is what led to Michael's anguish. I have drawn this to the CAA Registrar's attention and she in turn has contacted their WEB and I T people to correct the anomaly. I'm pleased to say she was most appreciative.
|
|
|
Post by Dave Homewood on Mar 29, 2021 20:23:47 GMT 12
What is the status currently of NZ847 (ZK-AKC)? it was flying in 2019 apparently, but now the registration comes up as Null on the CAA site. Is it still around?
|
|
|
Post by Luis 'ᚭᛋᛒᛁᛅᚱᚾ' Rozas on Mar 30, 2021 13:38:24 GMT 12
What is the status currently of NZ847 (ZK-AKC)? it was flying in 2019 apparently, but now the registration comes up as Null on the CAA site. Is it still around? Still shows up for me. Technical difficulties perhaps?
|
|
|
Post by Dave Homewood on Mar 30, 2021 13:56:05 GMT 12
You're correct. I don't know what went wrong yesterday. Thanks.
|
|
|
Post by McFly on Sept 9, 2021 10:04:15 GMT 12
Something to ponder over: We are told that ag operations started in New Zealand with Pritchard's seed-sowing efforts in the Whitney Straight, and that the breakthrough came with the RNZAF Ohakea and Masterton trials in 1948 & 1949. Browsing through the ADF serials RNZAF Tiger Moth pages (looking for something else) I came across the entry for NZ713/ZK-AKJ which reads "Issued free to Marlborough Aero Club from No.42 Squadron on 04 September 1946 and entered the New Zealand Civil Aircraft Register as ZK-AKJ on 31 July 1946. Crashed and destroyed by fire near Omaka on 01 December 1946 while sowing trace elements."So the question is, is this useage accurate? If so, how did they spread the trace elements? A spaghetti tin over the side? Or was there Tigers fitted with hoppers long before Airwork's trials with ZK-ASO? The aircraft does look to be in normal two-seat config, and had a very short civilian life. Food for thought. Reviewing the accident files, the accident in ZK-AKJ didn’t happen during spreading of trace elements, but during an impromptu tail chase with another Tiger Moth when control was lost resulting in an involuntary spin off a tight turn with insufficient altitude to recover. The pilot was Ronald Marcel Arthur, who as a Flight Lieutenant in the RNZAF, flew Catalina’s in the Pacific during the war and was reported to have over 4000hrs. He was employed by the Marlborough Aero club and was an experienced pilot and instructor. The other pilot involved was P.D. Reid (Patrick Davies Reid) who was a fighter pilot in the war. Scene of the accident at Omaka, Blenheim. Group. No. 20 General Reconnaissance course, Navigation and Reconnaissance School, RNZAF Station New Plymouth. 29/7/1943 (NpG624-43) NB: Names in no particular order. Officers in front row: RM Arthur, DL Bade, DWA Faulkner, RM Naysmith. NCOs: WG Cowie, RW Gilbert, CG Hamilton, AL Hickinbotham, K Jackson, LF LeLievre, ASS McCurdy, JJ MacIlree, RA Naylor, CL Organ, CF St John, BD Stewart, FR Thompson, AH Trewavas, FB Williams.
Ronald Marcel Arthur - 1946
|
|
|
Post by Dave Homewood on Sept 9, 2021 10:38:10 GMT 12
That is very sad.
|
|
|
Post by tbf2504 on Sept 9, 2021 11:19:46 GMT 12
"There are bold pilots and old pilots, but very few bold/old pilots" A sad outcome of some fun by two wartime pilots
|
|
|
Post by Peter Lewis on Sept 10, 2021 13:35:16 GMT 12
Thank you for that corrected info.
|
|
|
Post by Dave Homewood on Jan 8, 2022 12:38:30 GMT 12
Peter Wheeler just sent through these two photos. They are from the collection of the late bomber pilot Allan Mayfield, kindly made available by his daughter Kristin Post. He went topdressing postwar. Looks like ZK-AOC. ZK-AOC was a James Aviation aircraft and crashed at Whakamaru on 06 August 1955 seriously injuring pilot Colin Hale. Looks like a really nasty crash.
|
|
|
Post by planewriting on Jan 8, 2022 16:49:03 GMT 12
Reverting to McFly's Group No 20 G R Course has anyone noticed that included in that course photo is D L "Laurie" Bade of C-47 NZ3501 incident fame. Is that him (the tall chap) seated on the extreme left of the front row?
|
|