General Service Hands

[beagle]

Who have been the characters of this trade.
What do members recall of these sort of behind the scenes men and ladies that quenced our thirsts and filled our hungry tummies at Joe Times, and the worst part, cleaning up after us.

[beagle]

ok, don't be shy, I'll go first.
At ARS in the 80's we had the infamous 'Haggis" who used to plod away to the cafe each morning on his tredly to bring bck our piping hot pies. Woe betide if someone had short changed him.

in Auckland at te S&S/SEMS/MT hangar we had ex Navy chef 'Nobby" Clark who was a specialist in making scones from cans of lemonade.

Then at Wigram I had the memories of knowing the one and only Joe Burns. A true Air Force character. I am pretty sure he has since passed away, but he certainly made ya laugh.
"hey sonny"

[phil]

Bert Anscombe from Woodbourne, worked in the ATS flight store. He always gave a talk on Alcoholism to the new trainees, since he was a recovering one. He'd been in all three services, starting in the Navy in the 50's when he was 16, served in Vietnam with the army, had been in the police and ended up in Woodbourne. He was a keen runner and was to be seen running most days.

Back when I was on Basic Engeneering ('96), in the days before the OSM and Timor gave every man and his dog at least three medals, it was rare to see anyone with more than just a LSGCM, or perhaps rarely a GSM. Bert had a couple or rows of medals!

Alan Peck is still at Ohakea at 70. He works in he lecky bay, and has a contract through to 2025! He's hoping he wont have to keep working until then though. He still lives in barracks, eats in the mess. He had a couple of heart attacks last year but seems ok now. I know he used to enjoy working the weekends at the Ohakea museum, and was pretty disappointed at the way the closure was forced through, with the associated spin (read: lies) that were put forth by Wigram.

[skyhawkdon]

Yes Joe Burns has long since passed away. A street in the new Wigram subdivision is named after him (Joe Burns Place). I first met him as a young ATC cadet at Wigram in the early 80's when he was my SQN LDR Uncle's Batman at NATS! There is an interbase rugby trophy named in his honour too I think.

[sniff]

Not taking anything away from the other GSH's, but Joe Burns was the stand out:

"G'day, you young buck!" was a standard greeting.

He was always involved in sports team visits, the strapper for the Wigram rugby team, if I remeber correctly.

He lived in the "single men's" quarters behind the water tower, and always rode his distinctive bike.

I believe he passed away in the late 80's (?)

There is a street named after him on the old Wigram base, about where No 2 Mess was.

[sniff]

Snap, Don!

[Dave Homewood]

The worst character in the Air Force I ever met was a drunken Scots GSH who worked in the Mess at Hobsonville. A nasty character who used to get drunk with his cat in the Airmens Club each night.

The best was Jim Copeland who was GSH on NATTS when i worked in the same hangar from 1991-93. He was a real character and a good man. He also ran lots of schemes, raffles and things, and supplying cheap pies, etc.

[beagle]

admin said:

The worst character in the Air Force I ever met was a drunken Scots GSH who worked in the Mess at Hobsonville. A nasty character who used to get drunk with his cat in the Airmens Club each night.

I think you are referring to the guy called 'Howie"

Pretty sure he was an ex Tin Basher.
He apparantely was also a competition boxer of some repute.
The cats name was 'Oscar" who from memory had a special fund set aside for pet food and medical treatments. I am pretty sure I was at a AGM of the baggies club when they had to vote to spend some money on an operation for him..the cat that is.

as for getting drunk in the airmens club, I though he was continousely drunk.
Mind you I have been off my face many a time in the old club.

[the_flying_surfer]

Ron Hales, an ex Gunnie, who worked at ESIS (Explosive Storage and Inspection Section) at Hobsonville till it shut. He had bowel movements that you could set an atomic clock to. Every day just after Joe time he would bomb the loos rendering the whole entire building u/s. He wasn't a GSH - just a civvy worker now I think about it.

[beagle]

one other GSH character was this guy at Auckland . I remember him from the 90's.
Last i saw him he was working in the stores section of the base hospital, but I remember him most for being on the gate at Hobby. If you went through the gate in the early hours of the morning, you could park up and sit around with a few quiets and listen to him play the saxaphone and get into a bit of a sing a long..

[Dave Homewood]

The Scots GSH I referred to was continuosly drunk/hung over yes, but not called Howie. I think it was mac or something like that. Unless you mean Howie was his real surname? I'm sure we've discussed him before and Phil remembered him.

[gunplumber]

One person that is missing from this discussion is 'Turk' Whiteman of Ohakea. For approximately 20+ years Turk manned the Slave Quadrant at Raumai Range as well as doing assorted duties in the E&R Flt. As a young skin going to the range with Turk we had to drive past "Dick", Turks so called race horse. Turk always saluted his horse and wished him a 'very good morning DICK!'. A keen follower of horse racing Turk sudden fell ill one day. His illness wasn't that bad as he was seen on the TV broadcast of the races to be helping on the start barrier at the Wanganui races. The Tech Adj loved asking Turk about his "illness' when he was at work the next day.

[StuArmourer]

I remember Turk he was a great guy taught me the old pretend to back off the hill at the slave tower and shoot forward over the cliff in the toyota scared the piss out of those who were unknowing.

[davidd]

My experience of GSH's was during my (continuing) long "career" as a volunteer at RNZAF Museum since about 1986. I can only recall two genuine GSH's although there were almost certainly others with the Museum over these years. The first I knew was Bill Bell, who worked in the HQ as filing clerk/telephones/all round administration. Bill was very capable, sharp as a tack, and great all round guy. His sudden death several years ago (probably more like 15/20 years ago) was a great shock to the museum, greatly missed.

The other GSH I remember (we did not have that many!) was Alex Leeden (or Leden?) A hell of a nice guy, came from the Army from that mysterious Corps known as REME (Royal Corps of Electrical and Mechanical Engineers), but his main problem was that he was so interesting and so chatty that when he was around, we never got any actual work done! He also died very suddenly about 10/15 years ago, also greatly missed.
David D

[crewdog]

The Scottish GSH Dave and Beagle have mixed up was 'Jock' Carrick. He worked at the Hobby airmans' mess an drank heavily at the baggies bar - a lot! From memory he drove a big brown valiant around base and I believe he introduced it to one of the Palm trees near 3 Sqn hangar one night. Howie was a thin Maori guy who also lived in the Hobby baggies bar and drank like a fish. The cat from memory was called 'Oscar' - maybe wrong on that and was looked after and fed better than most of us. I also remember the Maori Hobby gate Guard who used to play his guitar and sing etc, an ex MOT officer who always glanced a knowing eye on us as we headed off to Henderson late at night for an "Uncles burger" run.
There was also a guy at Whenuapai early '90s as Base runner - thin wiry guy called Paul? anyway he stammered a bit and on a rainy day would always say " ni ni nice day if your a d d d duck". GSH's the backbone of looking after young airmen!

[Dave Homewood]

Yep, Jock was the chap I was thinking bout all those years back when I made the post above. He always looks so hung over in the Mess serving our food.

[beaufighter4]

Just to reflect on GSH Joe Burns, I heard him before I met him. Wigram 1970 I was rostered as Fire Piquet (I think that's how you spell it). I was asleep in the room where the key press was and at about 4.30am plus or minus 10 minutes, I heard the door open and bang against the bed I was sleeping in and then "Don't wake up son, I know where the mess keys are son, so don't wake up son". I was then wide awake till breakfast.

[baronbeeza]

Joe was my GSH at the time of his retirement in 1983. With Wigram being a training base he would have seen many come and go over the years.
We have all laughed at the way he treated senior officers, they were still all only 19 year old's in his eyes.

Don's uncle was OC NATS at the time and Joe's Squadron Leader boss. Those two went back to Dave's earliest years in the mob and rugby days.

Anyway the Squadron Leader made it quite clear that this was going to be no normal send off and that he personally would be arranging the affairs, well at least on the social front.

Joe's replacement was Ross Gibson who made the move from the camp store.

*** EDIT ***
We must have an earlier thread on this. I am sure Joe had a wartime history and I had a feeling he was on a ship sunk in the Med.

[baronbeeza]

From the Wigram; Old and New thread of Nov 2011.

That would leave Joe Burns Place smack in the middle of the area you describe. It would be about where the Wet Canteen and SNCO's Mess used to be.
I can remember Joe retiring in about 1984, possibly a touch earlier. I had a go at writing his leaving testimonial but my boss had been a keen rugby player and he made it quite clear he wanted to be involved.

I just wondered if the residents of that Place know who Joe was.

I think he had a complicated background. I remember him being in the Army during WWII and getting sunk off Crete.

Does the Museum have a history of that identity ?

Dave Crooks was an Air Officer but in Joe's mind he was still a Cadet..... yep, - he got the ' G'day Son ' treatment as well.

Wigram; Old and New
1 Dec 2011 at 20:27 Post by baronbeeza on 1 Dec 2011 at 20:27
I am not sure where to start with the Joe Burns story Dave.

His son Phillip had some aircraft on loan to the museum in the early days so some may know Phillip from there.

Joe was a Serviceman but would have been a career LAC I am guessing. In my day he was an aircraft hand and did the jobs for NATTS out of 6 Hangar at the time of his retirement.
He would have loved it, he got to cycle about Base doing the mail runs, doing whatever chores the guys wanted done basically. He was replaced by Ross Gibson who had graduated from the Camp Store.
He had an army background but very few would have known that. He was a Batman in one of the Officer's Messes. He knew every senior officer and vice-versa. I am thinking he must have been in 2 Mess in the early to mid-Fifties. Perhaps 1 Mess a little later.
I did read his PF and I know it was one of the larger ones. I just wish I could remember more of it.

I would be interested in the story as to how the street was named after him. It really does seem that the street runs around where Joe basically spent his RNZAF career.

He was treated a little like a living mascot towards the end of his service. The museum surely must have some biographical details.

rnzaf.proboards.com/thread/14868/wigram-old-new

[classicman]

In the excellent Gary Danvers photo thread I spotted FSGT R Elvy kneeling in front of a Bristol Freighter in Vietnam 1972.

I would get to know GSH Elvy during the late ‘80s when he worked the Wigram main gate during the late shift. He was the only one of the GSH’s on the gate we young’uns were a little wary of as he could be a bit gruff as we filtered back onto base in the wee hours.