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Post by saratoga on Feb 16, 2020 14:41:56 GMT 12
I think they have only selected the C-130. Have to wait and see what LM comes back with as a package before contract signing.
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Post by 30sqnatc on Feb 16, 2020 15:00:24 GMT 12
Wait for the budget to be announced then we'll see whats left for defence.
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Post by Calum on Feb 17, 2020 13:33:08 GMT 12
I think they have only selected the C-130. Have to wait and see what LM comes back with as a package before contract signing. Aren't buying FMS? if so it will be the USAF that actually supplies the aircraft/equipment
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Post by gibbo on Feb 17, 2020 16:40:05 GMT 12
I think they have only selected the C-130. Have to wait and see what LM comes back with as a package before contract signing. Aren't buying FMS? if so it will be the USAF that actually supplies the aircraft/equipment I think most of us are well aware it's only 'selected' at present, not ordered. Definitely FMS... doesn't concern the USAF. www.dsca.mil/major-arms-sales/new-zealand-c-130j-aircraft
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Post by nighthawknz on Feb 18, 2020 20:13:32 GMT 12
Suppose to happen sometime this year...
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Post by tbf25o4 on Feb 19, 2020 8:19:57 GMT 12
FMS or Foreign Military Sales is controlled by the State Department, so while the aircraft being purchased may or may not come from existing USAF stocks or orders, the actual process is very much a higher political affair
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chis73
Flight Lieutenant
Posts: 85
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Post by chis73 on Feb 19, 2020 10:47:01 GMT 12
One never fails to be amazed at the ineptitude of our government. So, they have had approval to buy 5 since late November. It's now two-thirds of the way through February and still no order. According to Ron Mark this is supposedly "the highest priority" project for Defence. The poor availability rate of the current C-130Hs is well known (usually 2/5). Does one have to literally fall out of the sky before someone will act? C'mon you muppets, enough already - get it done! Meanwhile, the US placed an order for 50 more ( link) just after Christmas. We'll probably have to sit in the queue behind them now, or pay more to get bumped up. Not sure if there are many (if any) C-130J-30s in the US order, maybe that's a problem? P.S. to further illustrate my point, here's Ron Mark in Parliament last week (13 Feb - link): Yep, broke down ... again.
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Post by Calum on Feb 19, 2020 13:51:00 GMT 12
FMS or Foreign Military Sales is controlled by the State Department, so while the aircraft being purchased may or may not come from existing USAF stocks or orders, the actual process is very much a higher political affair Cheers for the correction. I knew FMS are purchased direct from the US government not the actual manufacturer, just wasn't sure of the agency. I do know it's not uncommon for FMS customers to get aircraft from closer to the head of the queue though. They does seem to a few here willing for failure, I assume this is suit their politics (I assume they have forgotten the P-8 )
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Post by ErrolC on Mar 31, 2020 14:34:25 GMT 12
boeing.mediaroom.com/2020-03-30-Boeing-Receives-1-5-Billion-P-8A-Poseidon-Contract-From-U-S-NavyARLINGTON, Va., March 30, 2020 — The U.S. Navy awarded Boeing [NYSE: BA] a $1.5 billion production contract for the next 18 P-8A Poseidon aircraft. The contract includes eight aircraft for the U.S. Navy, six aircraft for the Republic of Korea Navy and four aircraft for the Royal New Zealand Air Force. The Republic of Korea Navy and Royal New Zealand Air Force acquired the aircraft through the Foreign Military Sales process and will receive the same P-8A Poseidon variant designed and produced for the U.S. Navy. The Royal New Zealand Air Force is expected to begin receiving aircraft in 2022 and the Republic of Korea Navy is expected to begin receiving aircraft in 2023.
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Post by gibbo on Mar 31, 2020 20:20:37 GMT 12
boeing.mediaroom.com/2020-03-30-Boeing-Receives-1-5-Billion-P-8A-Poseidon-Contract-From-U-S-NavyARLINGTON, Va., March 30, 2020 — The U.S. Navy awarded Boeing [NYSE: BA] a $1.5 billion production contract for the next 18 P-8A Poseidon aircraft. The contract includes eight aircraft for the U.S. Navy, six aircraft for the Republic of Korea Navy and four aircraft for the Royal New Zealand Air Force. The Republic of Korea Navy and Royal New Zealand Air Force acquired the aircraft through the Foreign Military Sales process and will receive the same P-8A Poseidon variant designed and produced for the U.S. Navy. The Royal New Zealand Air Force is expected to begin receiving aircraft in 2022 and the Republic of Korea Navy is expected to begin receiving aircraft in 2023. So why would a contract from the US Navy include the RNZAF order? Do we deal thru USN as part of FMS? Or is USN acting as a 'gate' for sensitive intellectual property?
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Post by tbf25o4 on Apr 1, 2020 8:00:07 GMT 12
The normal reason for including our FMS purchases against the parent US service that has a production run of a particular type of aircraft is twofold: 1. It streamlines production runs and ensures that the aircraft coming off the production line are standard. 2. It enables us to fit into the USN supply chain for ongoing spares and modification updates as we are treated as another USN unit operating the P8A
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Post by kiwirico on Apr 2, 2020 0:08:16 GMT 12
Well well... congrats to the RNZAF with just four Patrol aircraft. Shame...
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Post by Dave Homewood on Apr 2, 2020 8:01:55 GMT 12
Why shame?
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Post by Calum on Apr 2, 2020 13:27:50 GMT 12
Well well... congrats to the RNZAF with just four Patrol aircraft. Shame... Still 4 is better than the 6 we have and better than the none we'd eventually have if we 'd not ordered the P-8
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Post by madmac on Apr 2, 2020 15:27:10 GMT 12
The normal reason for including our FMS purchases against the parent US service that has a production run of a particular type of aircraft is twofold: 1. It streamlines production runs and ensures that the aircraft coming off the production line are standard. 2. It enables us to fit into the USN supply chain for ongoing spares and modification updates as we are treated as another USN unit operating the P8A You missed the big IF, which is only if we keep up the the USN upgrade programs & don't use any local mods, particular as they are increasing cost recovery from foreign operators, and we are facing a much reduce economic prosperity.
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Post by gibbo on Apr 2, 2020 15:28:40 GMT 12
The normal reason for including our FMS purchases against the parent US service that has a production run of a particular type of aircraft is twofold: 1. It streamlines production runs and ensures that the aircraft coming off the production line are standard. 2. It enables us to fit into the USN supply chain for ongoing spares and modification updates as we are treated as another USN unit operating the P8A Ah I see thx, makes sense.
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Post by gibbo on Apr 2, 2020 15:43:05 GMT 12
Well well... congrats to the RNZAF with just four Patrol aircraft. Shame... In the DCP there is a complimentary project to provide a 2nd tier maritime capability which covers options such as fixed wing, UAV or satelite coverage, which I'm sure has been mentioned on here. Yes it will almost certainly be an unarmed platform but the overall picture is not quite as bad as just 4 P8A... it reflects a growing maturity in understanding what our Maritime capability should be...two tiered, which makes sense given the huge cost of the P8A program. The concept is that P8A will focus on higher-end tasks including 5-eyes interaction, whereas the complimentary capability will avoid using valuable large airframes & crews for more mundane closer in MPA & SAR tasks. Also with a set of P8A simulators (each focused on different core operational tasks) they won't have to burn nearly as many airframe & crew hours to teach newbies in circuits around Ohakea. Yes I did grumble about 4 x P8A but the other capability will make a big difference... however having said all that... COVID-19 has probably just shot down the Defence budget for 4-5 years, so no complimentary capability. That will also probably include a deferment of C-130J-30 purchase which was to also include L3 Wescam MX-20HD Electro-Optical/Infrared Imaging System which would've boosted their use in long-range SAR work (in cases where they know where to start looking in the first instance).
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Post by tbf25o4 on Apr 3, 2020 9:09:41 GMT 12
From the presentations I have seen by CAF and MOD on the P8A programme, my understanding is that apart from the incorporation of the low-level SAR drop mods that the RAAF have ordered, our P8As will be stock standard, and the intention is "to remain standard with other operators for maintenance and ongoing support"
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chis73
Flight Lieutenant
Posts: 85
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Post by chis73 on Apr 3, 2020 16:34:54 GMT 12
Given the extent of the COVID-19 crisis on the economy, there is only one response to that:
"Tell 'im he's dreaming!" (in your best Aussie accent)
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Post by nighthawknz on Apr 5, 2020 8:19:25 GMT 12
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