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Post by John L on Sept 19, 2016 13:54:25 GMT 12
I lived in Motukarara south of Christchurch in the mid 80's. My enduring memory of F27's, is driving home one afternoon,along Tai Tapu Rd and there ahead of us, was an airforce Friendship in an 80-90 degree steep turn, it's wingtip about 50 ft off the ground! There was a row of quite tall Poplar trees not far ahead and half the bloody airplane disappeared behind them as it went around. My wife was having a panic attack next to me, convinced she was going to see a fireball ahead but, he straightened up and headed back towards Wigram. Quite spectacular when your're not expecting it......
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bae
Flying Officer
Posts: 67
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Post by bae on Sept 19, 2016 22:34:23 GMT 12
A long time ago I remember reading about NAC F27's with Taubmans radar! The story went that not all of the aircraft were fitted with radar but had the nose painted to match the one's that did. Any truth in what I read?
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Post by denysjones on Sept 20, 2016 9:12:08 GMT 12
There is a basis to your recollection.
I recall reading somewhere that Fokker offered the radar as an option and that there was a different (longer) nosecone for the radar ones to accomodate it. The story then went that there was a supply issue of the longer noses initially and so although we'd ordered that version the first deliveries were fitted with the shorter nose. I can't recall where I got this gen from though.
I just had a quick look at Paul Sheehan's book on the a/c of Air NZ and certainly reges as far as BXD had the short one at some stage (early by the colour scheme in the shot) while BXG has the longer one now. You can tell the difference by looking at the nose gear doors which in the case of the shorter nose give the visual effect of protruding beyond the end of the nose when open, while with the longer nose they look to finish at the rear edge of the fibreglass tip for the radar. Compare BXD on page 80 with BXE and NAA on page 81
Based on this I'd say that unless they were later fitted with longer nose cones the early deliveries would never had radar. Perhaps someone can confirm this?
hth
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Post by baz62 on Sept 20, 2016 9:26:23 GMT 12
Quite spectacular when your're not expecting it...... I recall hearing that a certain Air Force pilot who used to be involved with the Avenger at Wigram wouldn't sign out a pilot as rated to fly the Friendship unless he could demonstrate a wingover...........
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Post by planewriting on Sept 20, 2016 10:59:21 GMT 12
Referring to Denys' comments about the long and short nose Friendships; as per page 291 of the NAC book, the first four NAC Friendships BXA - BXD were of the short nose variety. BXE - BXI arrived with the lengthened nose and radar. Over time, the first four, plus the four ex Aer Lingus Friendships, were brought up to the same standard.
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Post by aerofoto on Sept 20, 2016 21:35:55 GMT 12
"YES" .... there is/was "a tonal difference" between RR DART engines and their prop combinations. That associated with both the F-27 and HS-748 (and probably the HERALD and YS-11 too though I´ve nevre heard these latter 2) was "quite shrill/ear piercing" .... whereas that associated with both the VISCOUNT and ARGOSY whilst ear piercing too exhibited a lower/"more mournful" (I think is probably the best way to describe it) tone. I´ve been associated with a small group of FS specialists working with real world recordings of RR DART type engine/prop combinations and for F-27, HS-748, ARGOSY , and VISCOUNT simulation projects .... and the differences between them, when compared, are really "quite distinct" .... in terms of both their idle and high power pitch. Certainly one of the most distinctive , if not classic, sounds in world aviation .... definitely the most distinctive turboprop sound Mark C HJG BOG/CO & AKL/NZ simviation.com/hjg/
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Post by beagle on Sept 21, 2016 21:37:54 GMT 12
I remember catching a NATS Friendship from WP to Wigram after the 1983 WP air show. I was sitting at a rear observer window fitted with headphones and mic. After a while I heard the pilot telling other that a young fella came up into the cockpit and asked how many Japanese he had shot down.
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Post by Dave Homewood on Sept 22, 2016 0:25:08 GMT 12
Hilarious!!! ![:)](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/smiley.png)
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Post by thegrandvizier on Oct 7, 2016 20:01:37 GMT 12
In a previous life at an F27 operator I was able to take jump seat rides. Here are a couple of videos from PST20 ex Wellington taken a while ago.
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Post by johnnyfalcon on Oct 8, 2016 18:03:31 GMT 12
Cool videos - cheers!
Would it be fair to say that from what the F-27 pioneered in the way of design, the Q300 and ATR have risen? (in terms of concept I mean) Because, from my observer's armchair it appears that the similarities are more than coincidental. Would that make the F-27 the mother-Fokker of these others?
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Post by kiwithrottlejockey on Oct 8, 2016 21:09:47 GMT 12
Actually, I would regard the Douglas DC-5 as being the ultimate ancestor of the F-27 Friendship, so perhaps the DC-5 should be the mother of the Q300 and ATR. Unfortunately, the Douglas DC-5 was the right aeroplane at the wrong time. If it hadn't been for WWII, the DC-5 would possibly have been at least as successful as the DC-3/C-47 was. ![](http://i378.photobucket.com/albums/oo227/Kiwithrottlejockey/Aviation/DC5ps_zps1x0fjiq3.jpg~original) ![](http://i378.photobucket.com/albums/oo227/Kiwithrottlejockey/Aviation/DC5ss_zpsk8ic2ral.jpg~original)
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Post by Dave Homewood on Oct 8, 2016 23:08:52 GMT 12
How do you figure the "Douglas DC-5 as being the ultimate ancestor of the F-27 Friendship"?
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Post by kiwithrottlejockey on Oct 9, 2016 0:11:26 GMT 12
The Fokker F-27 Friendship was the same general structural layout and aimed at the same market as what the earlier Douglas DC-5 was aimed at.
It's just that the Douglas DC-5 was probably a bit ahead of its time and because of WWII ended up being at the wrong time.
One of the books I've got has quite a bit in it about the DC-5 being designed to fulfil a role which eventually ended up being fulfilled by the F-27, with both aeroplanes having a lot of structural and layout similarities.
I cannot recall off the top of my head exactly which book it is, but it is parked in a one of the bookcases in my place.
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Post by johnnyfalcon on Oct 9, 2016 7:13:19 GMT 12
That's interesting KTJ. My remark was really only a passing observation on the type's design similarities to the two major players in our yard
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Post by Dave Homewood on Sept 21, 2017 20:16:29 GMT 12
Fokker Friendships - For HARS
HARS·THURSDAY, 21 SEPTEMBER 2017 The last few years at HARS have seen a revolution. 2015 was the year everything changed, with the arrival of the Mirage and then OJA, our record breaking 747-438. With OJA's arrival, our history collection really took off. Then last year saw the arrival of DC3 "Hawdon", TAA's first aeroplane and the one that flew its first service. The number of projects has grown and with that, the demand on our resources. There is the line of thought that we should "cut our cloth" to match our finances, however we also have to realise that aviation history is perishable, and that something on offer now may never appear again and will be lost forever. With that in mind, I'm reminded of a photograph from our time in Wonderboom, taken from the Tower, and showing in the distance the fire training aid, a derelict F-27 Friendship. One commenter on the post opined that wouldn't it be wonderful to have one of them for presentation. So yes, we have been offered two F-27 500 aircraft. The catch is that they do need some maintenance work before we can fly them in, and of course we need the fuel as well. Where, I hear you ask would two be found? This newspaper article will explain all. www.stuff.co.nz/marlborough-express/news/77017500/end-of-the-line-for-marlborough-mail-planeNew Zealand Post have replaced their fleet and so the two Friendship 500 aircraft are looking for a home. ZK-PAX and ZK-POH are poised, with some effort on our part, to make their final destination Australia. Those of you that know the Friendship will remember that many airlines in Australia used the 500 series so I'm sure a suitable paint scheme could be found to honour one of them. Here, to the best of my knowledge at the moment are some specs: ZK-PAX 1980 cn 10596 RR Dart 528 F-27-500 41 seats ZK-POH 1984 cn 10680 RR Dart 532 F-27-500 freighter Fuel capacity - 1339 us gal 8971 lb fuel. about 4 tonnes. How much will this cost? Well the fuel will probably be about $10,000 per aircraft and with other costs, we are looking at needing money in the $100,000 to $150,000 range. What will we do with them? Well, hopefully we will be able to get both back to HARS and we are thinking of HARS Parkes and perhaps Wagga as bases for them, with visits all around. An estimated arrival time - well that is way too early to think of at this stage - one thing at a time. Your support for this project will have one or maybe even two Fokker Friendships flying in Australia in Historic Airline Colours, displaying our Aviation Heritage. Photo - Daniel Tanner hars.org.au/donations/fokker-friendships/Whilst we here at HARS have all the people needed to maintain and fly the aircraft, with so many projects on the go .. well .. we would hate for this part of the World to lose the opportunity to preserve some history. Over to you www.facebook.com/notes/hars/fokker-friendships-for-hars/878646612294139/
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Post by planewriting on Sept 22, 2017 13:24:10 GMT 12
Interesting comments about HARS involvement with these two F-27s. Classic Flyers (through the management board) too are interested in these aircraft and have put in an offer for their acquisition. One way or another it looks like these aircraft have an assured future life."
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Post by vultee43 on Sept 22, 2017 23:39:07 GMT 12
They'll be looked after here. We'll even let you come and visit.
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Post by Dave Homewood on Sept 23, 2017 15:30:21 GMT 12
They'll be well looked after at Classic Flyers too. They're a superb museum.
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Post by scrooge on Sept 23, 2017 16:14:54 GMT 12
There's 2, have 1 each...
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Post by kiwithrottlejockey on Sept 23, 2017 20:21:39 GMT 12
There's 2, have 1 each... Australia had considerably more Fokker Friendships flying around in their country than we had in NZ. So what happened to all of their Fokker Friendships? Is this yet another example of our Aussie cousins trying to claim Kiwi stuff as their own? ![:)](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/smiley.png)
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