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Post by lemuel on Dec 2, 2017 18:27:35 GMT 12
This is my first attempt at creating a thread here so apologies if I screw it up. I collect historical ephemera and thought this find might be of interest to some of you. This is an inflight information sheet from a NAC flight. I presume this was before there was a reliable inflight intercom system. The flight crew filled in the details and the passengers handed it to each other. I'd love to hear from anyone who has any similar inflight info sheets. I suspect most ended up in the bin at the end of the flight. I found this one in a secondhand bookshop in Dunedin. It survived all these years by being used as an ad hoc bookmark! Image: Lemuel Lyes Collection Image: Lemuel Lyes Collection There is no date on the sheet but I used the cricket score at the bottom to figure out that this must've been used on 21 March 1955. I'm sure there are experts here that will know a lot more than I do about the Pakara, but from what I understand it was a DC-3 that was transferred from the RNZAF to NAC and registered as ZK-AOZ, flying for NAC through until 1963 when it was given an overhaul and leased to Polynesian Airlines. It was later in Darwin and was effectively destroyed by Cyclone Tracy in 1974. The undercarriage doors are at the Queensland Air Museum. There are plenty of photos of the Pakara around, I've seen some posted on these forums before. Here is another photo in the National Library. The MCC went on win their cricket match by 187 runs.
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Post by planecrazy on Dec 3, 2017 6:23:32 GMT 12
Fantastic I have one of those somewhere will dig it out, interesting how Cricket was so important, as you say the 1955 version of an intercom, don't know if you would get that sort of announcement these days but I may be wrong!
Perhaps underarm bowling would have been up there enough to get a run?
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Post by delticman on Dec 3, 2017 7:13:26 GMT 12
Fantastic I have one of those somewhere will did it out, interesting how Cricket was so important, as you say the 1955 version of an intercom, don't know if you would get that sort of announcement these days but I may be wrong! Perhaps underarm bowling would have been up there enough to get a run? I can remember the noise in the pre Skyliner days. It was either notes or flags for communication.
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Post by davidd on Dec 3, 2017 9:59:08 GMT 12
I note that the aircraft captain was P J O (Peter) Buck, DFC, a well-known name in NAC and probably also Air NZ. However he only uses his first two initials here. He served in WW2 in the European theatre as a Wellington and Stirling captain with 75(NZ) Squadron over period Sept 1942 to May 1943, first as a Sgt, then as a P/O; died in Wanganui 1992. His general appearance was so similar to one of Christchurch's mayors (Vicki Buck, 1980s or 90s?) that I immediately suspected she was his daughter, but I stand to be corrected! The First Officer I am having a bit more of a problem with, but his initials (D W) are very clear, looks like Bowen or Bower or similar. Interesting to see that the "prefix" RMA is still used in connection with the aircraft name. I always liken these prefixes to the honorifics used for people holding official positions, or even the ones used by polite society in addressing other people privately, as in "Hullo Mister Brown", or "Good bye Miss Caruthers" (not heard very often these days, too formal, but still often used in letters, etc.) David D
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Post by errolmartyn on Dec 3, 2017 13:15:50 GMT 12
David,
The 'DW' man would appear to be Douglas William Bowden who joined Union Airways on 23 Oct 45.
Errol
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Post by planewriting on Dec 3, 2017 13:47:25 GMT 12
I note that the aircraft captain was P J O (Peter) Buck, DFC, a well-known name in NAC and probably also Air NZ. However he only uses his first two initials here. He served in WW2 in the European theatre as a Wellington and Stirling captain with 75(NZ) Squadron over period Sept 1942 to May 1943, first as a Sgt, then as a P/O; died in Wanganui 1992. His general appearance was so similar to one of Christchurch's mayors (Vicki Buck, 1980s or 90s?) that I immediately suspected she was his daughter, but I stand to be corrected! The First Officer I am having a bit more of a problem with, but his initials (D W) are very clear, looks like Bowen or Bower or similar. Interesting to see that the "prefix" RMA is still used in connection with the aircraft name. I always liken these prefixes to the honorifics used for people holding official positions, or even the ones used by polite society in addressing other people privately, as in "Hullo Mister Brown", or "Good bye Miss Caruthers" (not heard very often these days, too formal, but still often used in letters, etc.) David D Hi David
Please stand!
Had a quiet chuckle at your comments. It just so happens that one of my co-volunteers at Archives Classic Flyers is the ex daughter in law of Captain Peter Buck and she is working at the next workstation while I type this. She categorically states Vicki Buck is no relation to her Buck family.
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Post by lemuel on Dec 3, 2017 15:30:40 GMT 12
I note that the aircraft captain was P J O (Peter) Buck, DFC, a well-known name in NAC and probably also Air NZ. However he only uses his first two initials here. He served in WW2 in the European theatre as a Wellington and Stirling captain with 75(NZ) Squadron over period Sept 1942 to May 1943, first as a Sgt, then as a P/O; died in Wanganui 1992. His general appearance was so similar to one of Christchurch's mayors (Vicki Buck, 1980s or 90s?) that I immediately suspected she was his daughter, but I stand to be corrected! The First Officer I am having a bit more of a problem with, but his initials (D W) are very clear, looks like Bowen or Bower or similar. Interesting to see that the "prefix" RMA is still used in connection with the aircraft name. I always liken these prefixes to the honorifics used for people holding official positions, or even the ones used by polite society in addressing other people privately, as in "Hullo Mister Brown", or "Good bye Miss Caruthers" (not heard very often these days, too formal, but still often used in letters, etc.) David D This is great info - thank you very much!
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Post by davidd on Dec 3, 2017 23:17:29 GMT 12
Peter, many thanks for the correction, I did ask for comments, and now we have what sounds to me like a gold-standard answer! Mind you, the two did look VERY similar in many ways, so just couldn't keep quiet about it. David D
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Post by Dave Homewood on Dec 4, 2017 10:52:01 GMT 12
Peter L, does Peter Buck's daughter happen to have his flying logbook/s? That could be an interesting read!!
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Post by planewriting on Dec 4, 2017 18:35:40 GMT 12
I don't know Dave I will ask her next time I see her. They may well be with another family member. I agree, they would be an interesting read. I will try one or two folk who may recognise the co-pilot's signature. We have some of these info sheets at Classic Flyers.
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Post by pjw4118 on Dec 6, 2017 14:52:13 GMT 12
Looking at the sheet , Wataroa is a bit of a mystery to me , what is its current name ? Also was the Haast link served by a contract company or Mt Cook ? Paraparaumu seems to have been dropped .
Re Peter Buck , there is a well known photo of his Stirling rear turret being inspected by Dick Broadbent and Hawkeye Wells after it was shot up , killing the RG.
Love the cricket score , it brings back times of life in the slow lane , steam radio , butchers sawdust and the sound of flies ; when every aircraft type could be picked by the sound of its engines .
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Post by Dave Homewood on Dec 6, 2017 15:02:01 GMT 12
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Post by kiwithrottlejockey on Dec 6, 2017 15:33:08 GMT 12
The correct spelling is actually Whataroa.
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Post by Dave Homewood on Dec 6, 2017 16:17:27 GMT 12
Like so many Maori place names, it seems to be both. The whole 'h' debate thing gets old.
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Post by kiwithrottlejockey on Dec 7, 2017 14:42:27 GMT 12
Every map I've ever seen has the spelling as Whataroa.
Even that America site you linked to, although they mis-spell it as Wataroa, the map they have on their website shows Whataroa.
I'm inclined to wonder if that NAC Inflight Information Sheet had a mis-spelling that wasn't picked up during proof-reading.
And as for saying you are sick of spelling issues, I could just imagine the furore of lots of people started mis-spelling Cambridge has has been happening to many Maori names for more than a century.
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Post by planecrazy on Dec 7, 2017 14:55:44 GMT 12
Not New Zealand civil aviation nor NAC but an ex TEAL boat so put it here.
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Post by Dave Homewood on Dec 7, 2017 20:56:33 GMT 12
Every map I've ever seen has the spelling as Whataroa.
Even that America site you linked to, although they mis-spell it as Wataroa, the map they have on their website shows Whataroa.
I'm inclined to wonder if that NAC Inflight Information Sheet had a mis-spelling that wasn't picked up during proof-reading.
If you put Wataroa into Papers Past, you get 8,644 returns, all referring to the Westland district, valley and river of that name. When you put Whataroa into the same search engine you get 1,886 returns, almost all of them seem to be referring to a race horse of that name. There was also the Wahtaroa Estate at Te Kuiti, a portion of land known as Whataroa in the Wanganui district, and another near Wairoa, and other sundry uses of the word not relating to the Westland district. When you narrow it down to search just the West Coast newspapers, where you'd like it most likely to appear, there are 58 hits. 56 of them seem to be about the race horse of that name. One is about the Wairoa place. And the last seems to actually refer to Wataroa in Westland and is spelled wrong. I call that evidence enough to conclude that the place was spelled Wataroa at least into the 1950's, including at the time when the card was printed. This would never happen as the town of Cambridge is named after a man, and it was named by people with a log tradition of writing the language, who worked for that man. If the Maori people mis-spelled the name when they first wrote it down, and it has been changed to correct that, fine. So long as people don't start pronouncing it with an 'F' sound as that was not the case in the South Island. Or most of the North Island. But it was correctly spelled on the NAC form.
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Post by errolmartyn on Dec 7, 2017 21:11:49 GMT 12
Wises New Zealand Guide (1979 ed) does not have an entry under Wataroa, but under its entry for Whataroa it states 'Originally known as Wataroa until 1934. Name means lit.: whata: elevated stage: roa: long or tall.'
Interestingly, there are no name entries at all for a place name spelt Wata...
Errol
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Post by Dave Homewood on Dec 7, 2017 21:46:15 GMT 12
The Lilliput Maori Place Names book by A.H. Reed (1962) lists Whataroa as meaning Long Store House. Google Translate does not recognise "Whataroa", but for "whata roa" it gives "how long". And for "wata roa" it translates it to "a long time". And maoridictionary.co.nz found zero matches for all three iterations. Like all things with the Maori language, it's open to wide interpretation and variation.
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Post by Dave Homewood on Dec 7, 2017 21:51:42 GMT 12
'Originally known as Wataroa until 1934.' Errol Papers Past brings up 592 hits for Wataroa between 1935 and 1949. Papers Past brings up 9 hits for Whataroa between 1935 and 1949. Not one of them refers to the West Coast district. Therefore if the name was changed in 1934, no-one in the media was informed.
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