NZ Army Hat Survey - Flying Saucer??

[Dave Homewood]

This comes from the NORTHERN ADVOCATE, dated 22 December 1947. I am curious to learn what were the cheesecutter, the cap G.S. (British) and the cap G.S. "flying saucer" hats?

I know what a normal cheesecutter is but do not imagine the Army wearing them? Google found nothing on the G.S. caps.

'Lemonsqueezer' Most Popular NZ. Army Hat

THE absolute rejection of the “flying saucer” type of hat at present worn by troops in New Zealand and the election to first place in the hearts of soldiers of the traditional “lemon-squeezer” were the striking features of the hat poll recently concluded by Jayforce Times.

The “lemonsqueezer” received 42 per cent of the votes cast in the election, to gain a majority of 532 over the next most popular hat, the beret. The “flying saucer” received three votes out of the total of 4356.

SEVEN HATS
In all seven hats on which a vote was taken —“lemonsqueezer,” beret, “cheesecutter,” ski cap, cap G.S. (British), cap F.S., and cap G.S. (Flying Saucer”) — the-deciding factor in their election or rejection was the vote of the men of J Force.

Votes were taken on what hat should be used for all-purposes wear, for parades and duty and for walking out. The explanation for the popularity of the “lemonsqueezer” appears to be that though few of the men of J Force have worn it, the New Zealand soldier wants to retain the distinctive headdress worn by New Zealanders in two world wars. Among home servicemen, most of whom belong to the Regular Forces, the “cheesecutter” was the most popular hat. Details of the voting were:—

MOST POPULAR
On the result of the poll Jayforce Times comment was:—
“Lemonsqueezer: Most popular hat; first in all sections.

“Flying saucer: Most unpopular hat; the fair cow! Seventh and last in all sections. Poor, lop-brimmed, sagcrowned, over-sized, under-developed son of a sea cook’s unwed millinery offspring!”

The only informal vote cast in the poll came from a sergeant at Trentham, who crossed out all the entries on the form provided. The poll was taken at the request of Army Headquarters, where the result will be taken into account in future decisions regarding the design of army headgear.

WAR OFFICE INTEREST
Evidence of the wide interest it aroused is given by the fact that a cablegram was received by Jayforce Times from the War Office, London, requesting that three copies of the paper in which the poll was inaugurated be forwarded to the Ordnance and Clothing Section. At the request of Army Headquarters the NZRSA is cor,ddtung a similar poll in its January issue of Review as it is considered that the opinions of the veterans of two wars will be of value in determining what type of hat should be worn for duty, for walking out; or for all purposes.

	NZ	Japan	Total
Lemonsqueezer	489	1330	1819
Beret	339	948	1287
Cheesecutter	454	263	808
Ski Cap	133	86	219
Cap G.S. (Brit)	97	33	130
Cap F.S.	20	70	90
Cap G.S. (Flying Saucer)	3	0	3

[shorty]

Would they perhaps been referring to the US style of HBT caps with the all round brim as worn by some ground crew in the Pacific?

[30sqnatc]

Cap GS see kiwisoldier.wordpress.com/2015/11/page/3/

[Dave Homewood]

Ohhh. I have seen photos with guys wearing them and just assumed they were very worn out berets. Thanks Paul.

[davidd]

The so-called berets worn by our WAAF's in WW2 (and up to about 1950 I think) were often referred to as "Flying Saucers". Real berets, of course, are made from one piece of felted material, whereas the WAAF version was made of multiple pieces of woollen material sewn together. However I am not so certain when the term "flying saucers" became popular - was this a product of the UFO craze and the Roswell (spelling?) "event" in 1947, or were its origins of an earlier vintage?

Incidentally, the HBT "cap" referred to by Shorty (I myself would call it simply a round-brimmed fatigue hat) was certainly (at least in the RNZAF during the campaigns in the Pacific islands) NOT an item of uniform, simply working clothing available from the Americans through normal supply channels, as were the American-type sun helmets. I doubt that either of these items would have been permissible on parades, but then again, formal parades were not all that common when on "Pacific duty", unless greater events called for them, or medals were being presented "in the field", and at funerals, etc. There was another type of American fatigue hat issued too, it WAS a peaked cap, but be blowed if I can recall exactly what it looked like, try as I might (I even did a drawing of it for a reference book I helped compile for RNZAF Museum about a quarter of a century ago, actually held examples in my hands!)

Incidentally was surprised to see that the "Ski Cap" was mentioned in the list of contemporary head-gear, had not come across that one, but as I am pretty ignorant of Army headware generally, that is my problem. I really should get Barry and Matthew O'Sullivans matched pair of reference books on this subject - I have meant to commit myself to this purchase for 20 years at least!
David D

[Dave Homewood]

Jun 22, 2020 12:12:00 GMT 12 davidd said:

However I am not so certain when the term "flying saucers" became popular - was this a product of the UFO craze and the Roswell (spelling?) "event" in 1947, or were its origins of an earlier vintage?

Wikipedia says of flying saucer, "The term was coined in 1947".

This sees to be backed up by the fact hat the fist time it is referenced in Papers Past is 7 July 1947.

Looking at Elephind, which draws on loads of line newspaper archives from around the world, the first reference to "flying saucer" in terms of a UFO is 4 July 1947 here

There's a 1914 reference here to an article The Sport of the Flying Saucer, about trap shooting, so perhaps the shape of the UFO's was actually named after the shape of a skeet rather than something under a teacup?

[shorty]

Ski Caps were worn by RNZAF in the fifties and early sixties, often seen in photos of TAF personel and this guy
Hvds - Blenheim 1_zpscdswq7ez by Neville Mines, on Flickr

[davidd]

Shorty, Were the RNZAF ski caps very similar to the earlier NZ Army ones (apart from colour of course), or were they a totally new design. I believe some used to refer to them (in jest) as Afrika Korps caps.
David D

[shorty]

I'm not sure on that, my Dad was a ACH at 1 ED at Hobsonville around the late 50s early 60s and wore a ski cap but I don't recall examining it closely.I was a young teenager and more interested in other things

[Dave Homewood]

Something I did note was no mention of the slouch hat. The New Zealand Mounted Rifles units wore that from the 1800's and into WWI and well into the 1930's, and they still do wear them, but I'm guessing there was a gap where they were not worn in the 1940's? And when did they start wearing them again? I remember them being worn by the Waikato Mounted Rifles in the 1980's.