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Post by Mustang51 on Dec 10, 2021 7:56:57 GMT 12
This from the ABC. Australian Defence Minister is to announce the replacement of the entire fleet of MRH-90 Taipan with up to 40 off-the-shelf Blackhawks. This comes ten years earlier than expected and on the back of the type's poor availability and fleet-wide groundings. It also follows the US announcement in October that it had approved the sale of 12 Sikorsky 'Romeo' Seahawks to replace the 6 RAN MRH-90 Taipans. The Taipans had been listed as a "Project of Concern" and earlier this year the Defence Department revealed that it had been spending more than $37mil to hire civilian helicopters in Townsville to maintain capability while it dealt with long running problems with the Taipans. The ABC reporter indicated that, ".. Defence industry figures say the decision to scrap the Taipans, which were assembled in Australia using a European design, signals the government is determined to prioritize defence capability over all other considerations, including local manufacturing".
Watch this space for more Australian Defence Department procurement announcements in addition to the reports of potential C-130 acquisitions.
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Post by typerated on Dec 10, 2021 8:24:46 GMT 12
I heard 40 Blackhawks 24 C-130Js and some KC-130s
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Post by Mustang51 on Dec 10, 2021 9:30:02 GMT 12
I think that there may be more than 40 Blackhawks in total
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mroz
Flying Officer
Posts: 59
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Post by mroz on Dec 10, 2021 17:04:10 GMT 12
Best possible news....the Blackhawk and Apache deliver the goods and are another example of why Oz should never embrace "sexy platforms" that we have little to no engagement with. Buy Yank for combat proven capability!
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Post by vultee43 on Dec 10, 2021 18:19:05 GMT 12
Except for the F35. No proven capability yet.
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Post by typerated on Dec 10, 2021 19:24:49 GMT 12
Except for the F35. No proven capability yet. You are a couple of years out of date! |
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Post by typerated on Dec 10, 2021 20:33:07 GMT 12
Best possible news....the Blackhawk and Apache deliver the goods and are another example of why Oz should never embrace "sexy platforms" that we have little to no engagement with. Buy Yank for combat proven capability! You are mixing up two points: Balancing procurement between proven mature systems and new capability is something Australia has been spectacularly awful at! Thinking US gear is better than European might be true in this case but I can assure you it is not a universal rule - far from it! |
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Post by Mustang51 on Dec 11, 2021 0:21:15 GMT 12
typerated.....agree and understand however, the devil you do know in combat is better than the thing you know has major problems.
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Post by vultee43 on Dec 11, 2021 19:08:01 GMT 12
Except for the F35. No proven capability yet. You are a couple of years out of date! I remain to be convinced they will not be Australia's biggest defence white elephant. Along with the Spartans, Taiwan's and numerous Army and Navy projects, we seem to be purchasing based on romantic notions, not practical solutions. |
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Post by kiwiruna on Dec 11, 2021 19:28:43 GMT 12
According the War Zone website the RAN NH90s are also to be sold.
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Post by typerated on Dec 11, 2021 20:11:37 GMT 12
You are a couple of years out of date! I remain to be convinced they will not be Australia's biggest defence white elephant. Along with the Spartans, Taiwan's and numerous Army and Navy projects, we seem to be purchasing based on romantic notions, not practical solutions. I share your dislike of the machine. The concept of essentially one aircraft for conventional, carrier and VSTOL operation was flawed and has both compromised the performance of resulting aircraft and made it far from the cheap mass produced fighter that was imagined. it’s an amazing engineering achievement – but it’s far from the aeroplane it should have been and excels at a limited set of capabilities The USAF is well aware this is not the aircraft it had hoped but has boxed itself into a corner by planning to buy over 1700 airframes and is pretty desperate to wriggle out of this – Partly with the F-15EX and also trying to speed the next generation of fighter into service. But the F-35 it is cleaning up on sales around the world. Why? It’s the only 5th generation, stealth fighter available – if you want to be flying and fighting over hostile territory on day 1 this is the aeroplane to buy. |
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Post by madmac on Dec 12, 2021 13:29:24 GMT 12
According the War Zone website the RAN NH90s are also to be sold. Cool another cheap Seasprite replacement from Oz, that they can't make work but we can (yes the fix for this one isn't quite as simple realistic expectations of technology, but ones got to have a dig at the Ozzies). I see they are transport config only and use a fleet pool for Army and Navy helicopters, so probably not. |
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Post by richard1098 on Dec 12, 2021 19:30:11 GMT 12
According the War Zone website the RAN NH90s are also to be sold. Cool another cheap Seasprite replacement from Oz, that they can't make work but we can (yes the fix for this one isn't quite as simple realistic expectations of technology, but ones got to have a dig at the Ozzies). I see they are transport config only and use a fleet pool for Army and Navy helicopters, so probably not. By the time they do get replaced, they'll have seen around 20 years service (the first delivered are already nearing 15 years), so not sure what you want to replace with them. Does the NZDF have any 40 year old helos that need replacing? |
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Post by vultee43 on Dec 14, 2021 20:35:55 GMT 12
I remain to be convinced they will not be Australia's biggest defence white elephant. Along with the Spartans, Taiwan's and numerous Army and Navy projects, we seem to be purchasing based on romantic notions, not practical solutions. I share your dislike of the machine. The concept of essentially one aircraft for conventional, carrier and VSTOL operation was flawed and has both compromised the performance of resulting aircraft and made it far from the cheap mass produced fighter that was imagined. it’s an amazing engineering achievement – but it’s far from the aeroplane it should have been and excels at a limited set of capabilities The USAF is well aware this is not the aircraft it had hoped but has boxed itself into a corner by planning to buy over 1700 airframes and is pretty desperate to wriggle out of this – Partly with the F-15EX and also trying to speed the next generation of fighter into service. But the F-35 it is cleaning up on sales around the world. Why? It’s the only 5th generation, stealth fighter available – if you want to be flying and fighting over hostile territory on day 1 this is the aeroplane to buy. I guess the reason sales are so good is there is no other Western 5th Generation 'Fighter' on the market. The Griphen is an immensely capable platform but only 4th Gen as is the new Hornet. The Eurofighter and Rafael are better option but still miss our needs. My big question over the F35 is its combat readiness percentage which is woefully low. The Russian and Chinese aircraft are better in their designated roles but obvious questions remain over their quality. |
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Post by snafu on Mar 16, 2022 8:13:34 GMT 12
According the War Zone website the RAN NH90s are also to be sold. Cool another cheap Seasprite replacement from Oz, that they can't make work but we can (yes the fix for this one isn't quite as simple realistic expectations of technology, but ones got to have a dig at the Ozzies). I see they are transport config only and use a fleet pool for Army and Navy helicopters, so probably not. RAN NH90 come from pool aircraft and that they have no ASW capability, they were a replace for the Sea King in the utility role The Sea Sprites we’re replace with MH-60R in which we have ordered 12 additional aircraft |
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Post by snafu on Mar 16, 2022 9:11:02 GMT 12
You are a couple of years out of date! I remain to be convinced they will not be Australia's biggest defence white elephant. Along with the Spartans, Taiwan's and numerous Army and Navy projects, we seem to be purchasing based on romantic notions, not practical solutions. On paper Taipans are the better utility helicopters for the ADF but the reality is they have fundamental flaws which all aircraft have to some degree or another. In this case it’s cost per flight hours and sustainment, it’s really the one area that the Europeans do not do well as they just do not have the same numbers that the Americans have. Spartans were a replace for Caribou which in the current context it too would not meet the requirements of the RAAF, from what I understand it’s the EW self protection suite that is letting down the Spartan for what ever reason. People forget that the Spartans are just a smaller version of the C130 it use the same cockpit architecture the same 6 blade Rolls Royce engines of the C130J,so it cannot be sustainment in those areas otherwise we would be having problems with the Hercules's fleet The Spartans came with a comprehensive self protection suite so I am puzzled why the RAAF have done it 12 Electronic Warfare Self Protection Suites; 12 AAR-47A(V)2 Missile Warning Systems; 12 ALE-47(V) Threat Adaptive Countermeasures Dispensing Systems; 12 APR-39B(V)2 Radar Warning Receivers; 13 AN/APN-241 Radar Systems; 44 AN/ARC-210 Warrior Very High Frequency/Ultra High Frequency Communication Systems; 12 KY-100 Units; 12 HF 9550 Radios; 12 APX-119 Identification Friend or Foe (Mode 4); 14 Blue Force Trackers; www.dsca.mil/press-media/major-arms-sales/australia-c-27j-aircraft-and-related-supportCompared to the CH-47F The Government of Australia has requested to buy four (4) CH-47F cargo helicopters with customer-unique modifications; eight (8) T55-GA-714A aircraft turbine engines, five (5) AN/AAR-57 Common Missile Warning Systems (CMWS); eight (8) Embedded Global Positioning System (GPS)/Inertial Navigation Systems (INS/EGI) +429; and two (2) EAGLE+429 Embedded Global Positioning System (GPS)/Inertial Navigation Systems (INS/EGI). www.dsca.mil/press-media/major-arms-sales/australia-ch-47f-chinook-helicopters-0It could be that the C27J could not accept the same C130J Large Aircraft Infra-Red Counter-Measures under AIR 5416 Phase 4B2 and the RAAF are just not comfortable with putting the aircraft in that situation Spartans were bought in to sit between the CH-47F and C130J it has more options to where it can operate from its faster than CH-47F |
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Post by snafu on Aug 6, 2023 3:28:51 GMT 12
1st new Blackhawk arrives down under.
Very low-key arrival under the circumstances
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Post by 11SQNLDR on Aug 6, 2023 13:02:47 GMT 12
Yep, first of 40 UH-60M's. Any they can't get here quick enough  I loved the old scheme from the S-70 days but it seems 'US Army Helo Drab FS 34031' will be it for these and the AH-64E fleets   |
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Post by Mustang51 on Aug 6, 2023 14:44:19 GMT 12
Don't be too sure yet
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Post by snafu on Aug 6, 2023 18:02:13 GMT 12
Agree i think we are getting them earlier of US Army run and hence the paint job. I reckon once the go in for a planned maintence period they will come out with a new paint job. It's a pity we could not remanufactor the ealier Blackhawks to M spec and zero timed. that would give us 67 aircraft to share the burden with. or dedicated LHD fleet helicopter and replaced with V-280 Valor once the bugs are ironed out |
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