Joining the RNZAF

[dpdouglas]

The thing about what I said was " They all basically offer the same thing". What I meant , just to clarify is that they all offer basically the same benefits. As in the all offer a good enough pay, they all offer the oppurtunity to go up the ranks and they all say No day is the same so what could possibly make the choice to sign the dotted line. Can anyone help me out here in this department? If there is anyway to do a taster for all three anyone please tell me.

[dpdouglas]

Post Script:Also Im looking into a super seasprite pilot for the RNZN but no other Navy trades.

[phil82]

They may well offer similar 'benefits', but the way they go about what they do is as different as chalk and cheese. I appreciate it is a huge and momentous decison for someone your age to decide on doing what may be a vocation or a millstone around any future career prospects, but I'll try and give you something more to think about! Just remember, the difference between an 18-year-old's thinking of what is 'cool' is usually vastly different from that of a 20-year-old for the simple reason that the learning and experience curve at that age is almost vertical! All three, Police, Army and Air force, are people-eating organisations. They take you in. mould you. use you, and at the end they spit you out and start the process all over again to maintain their reason for being! When I was 18 I thought I knew it all, and when I was 20 I thought 18-year-olds wer a bit childish, and when I was 25, I thought 20-year-olds were likewise! It happens to all of us! You won't like me saying it, but at 16, you are very young, and in the next two years your views will change enormously on just about everything. Still, you sound like a sensible guy!

First, play to your personal strengths. Identify what really blows your hair back and how good you are at doing things, and use those factors as a pointer to whatever you can gain from the job you opt for. Don't hesitate to ask "what are the benefits to me?", because you need to know the answer!

Secondly; I've done some close work with the NZ Police, and they are, almost to a man and a woman, a wonderful, caring bunch of professionals. They do , however, end up clearing all the crap society produces, and I would doubt very much if an 18-year-old would welcome being thrust into some of that. Most of the cops I know started out after doing something else, and so were in the mid-twenties. Cops have a very "black" sense of humour, and believe me, it's not without cause. They have a high turnover of people!

Thirdly; the Army. It offers some great life experience if you're the outdoor type, very good man-management skills, plus some good career prospects in the right branch. I've worked with some excellent Army officers in my time, and without a doubt they are the sort of people you want alongside you when the ordure hits the rotating parts. Again, sort out what is the best benefit to you in the long term. You will need to be very, very fit at the beginning of anything you do! The Army is a band of brothers just like the police and the air force, and that reliance on one another is character-forming for the rest of your life.

Finally; the RNZAF, the recruiters will have all the information you need based on what you can do according to your qualifications. The air force is, still, a superb training organisation for those essential skills in thinking for yourself. There are quite a few ex-service people on this site, who left for a variety of reasons, but all of them are, in some way or another, using the slkills they learnt, even if it's only getting on well with their fellow men! If you want to fly, [and who doesn't?], then there is no better place to learn it. Nobody does it better. If Navy flying is your penchant, you still have to go to the air force to do it. The selection process is very, very tough, and never stops!

I left , after 25 years,because I wasn't getting the laughs I used to, and while that may sound flippant, there is a message there. Whatever you opt for, be prepared to enjoy it to the full. Life's far to short to waste any of doing something you don't like any more!

[I/we have three adult children by the way, so I've been there done that and have a drawer full of t-shirts!]

[Dave Homewood]

One suggestion I have Darren is that perhaps a few years of Armed Forces service before deciding on a police career will certainly give you a huge advantage. That way you may decide as you mature that the police isn't what you want to do.

I had several friends in the RNZAF who all did around five years service then got out and became police - all these were my tarde, Safety and Surface, a small trade and their expertise that was lost left quite a gap I'd imagine. I think from what I've heard all are still cops - Vaughn McAllistar, Mark "Frankie" Taylor, Jason "J's Cubed" Stewart and Lizzie Henderson.

There was also a chap on my recruit course who did the course and then got straight out, because he was to become a policeman and had been told by their recruiters that some military service stands a police application in much more stead. His name was Phil Hayson, but I never heard from him again and don't know how well he succeeded.

I originally wanted to join the NZ Army and went through the recruiting process to a certain point when I had an accident and injured my back - and the Army recruiter told me that I would not pass the stringent medical but the RNZAF would have me so I changed my career option. To this day I am so grateful for that painful injury in the gymnasium at school! Had i joined the army I don't know where I might have ended up - I was only interested after reading countless books on the NZ Army and LRDG, etc in WWII, and numerous Commando comics, etc. I was 16 and 17 when i was going through the recruitment for the army and do not think I was anywhere near mature enough to understand what it entailed.

Having subsequently lived and worked with army guys when I was in the RNZAF, I know I made the right choice for me. The army (infantry, signals and drivers at least) seemed to ahve a whole different culture and it's not like the RNZAF, a lifestyle that suited me well. I think that there would have been less scope for development into different areas of learning and workplace if I'd become a grunt. Don't get me wrong, i have a lot of respect for them and what they do, it's just not what I expected and not my cup of tea.

Another thing too about the RNZAF, if they still have it - I'm not sure, but in my day Whenuapai and Ohakea had a special force called the Ground Defence Force (GDF). This was a voluntary organisation made up of airmen of any trade or rank who wished to take part, and was an after-hours unit that you partook in after your normal day's work. They are like Territorials for the RNZAF, or almost like Home Guard as they are designed to protect the base and the aircraft from attack or saboutage in time of confict, and they train accordingly. One of my good mates was a Supplier by day (one of the least interesting jobs) and GDF by nights and weekends. He used to go out on camps in the field, do repelling from the 40 Squadron hangar, helicopter rides, etc, all that army stuff. They learned bushcraft and jungle warfare and all those warry things the grunts do. So, if this still exists you can experience both RNZAF and Army lifestyles. GDF also got a lot of deployments overseas as aircraft guards. I guess Air Security may have superceded them in this role now? I know several GDF chaps went to the Gulf War specifically in the GDF role, with No. 40 Sqn's Hercules aircraft.

So, there's an option if GDF is still around these days.

One thing to consider too is police work is almost guaranteed these days to put you in a situation where eventually you will be in mortal danger, and even shot at. The military has had this risk significatly reduced. So if you like life and sanity, I'd chose the RNZAF.

I hope this has been useful to you mate.

[tibor]

admin said:

Another thing too about the RNZAF, if they still have it - I'm not sure, but in my day Whenuapai and Ohakea had a special force called the Ground Defence Force (GDF).

As an aside to the original topic, GDF's are long gone now Dave, this role having been taken over by the Air Security trade. These guys (along with the Aviation Refuellers and drivers) would have to be the most travelled trade in the Air Force - they go on pretty much every operational deployment going.

In saying that though, I know in East Timor, the Air Security trade was bolstered by taking in pers from other trades to boost numbers and increase the range of skills. When I was there we had a PTI, a medic and a couple of wooden-heads, as well as a couple of air security people as our "Air Security" deployment.

I don't think we have anything close to a real GDF capability now though, certainly nothing like the RAAF/RAF.

[Dave Homewood]

Thanks for clarifying that Tibor. It sounds like another vital cog has disappeared. Those guys were almost like a ready reaction force, ready for any eventuality, and I know they were very serious about their roles.

I actually got roped into the GDF one Friday afternoon when vandals had been breaking into the base at Whenuapai from the golf course side. GDF was called out to undergo weekend surveillance around the clock to try to capture these repeat offenders. One of my colleagues was in GDF but unavailable so they ordered me to take his place to fill in the numbers - usual Air Force logic. he's the same trade and rank so he'll do. I didn't have a clue what GDF was till that moment!

So, with my weekend plans ruined, I got transport across to their secretive HQ at Hobby after work, walked into this very military style briefing and realised I was the only one in Air Force blue and not camouflage greens. No-one had bothered to tell me that I needed to get camo gear for the job. And Camp Pack Up was by then closed of course. So, I got sent home!

I wasn't unhappy - especially when I heard those poor guys spent all weekend in foxholes around the airfield eating from ration packs and not a single vandal was spotted!

[phil]

We now have the BCF, Base contingency Force, but their focus is on emergency responce, SAR, USAR etc, and they supply a pool of manpower for crash sites and anything else of a similar nature. The days of defending the airfield are gone though, as was mentioned above, the Air Security trade do this now. Unfortunately it is a trade very badly let down by cetain levels of it's command chain. After all, it is a combination of the old GSI and the old Provo trades!

I had a similar lucky ecape with the Army due to my asthma, and am very glad I ended up in the airforce. Havig worked with all levels of the army during my time as a photographer, I can quite honestly say they are a little odd and tend to take things just a bit too seriously for my airforce liking!

If you want to fly Seasprites, our 3 sqn pilots do tours on 6 sqn, I'm not sure how many places there are for airforce pilots, or if they maintain specific airforce slots or just fill them as required, but there have been airforce pilots on 6sqn for some time now.

I was looking at our HR site on Friday, the breakdown of the three services by age group was interesting. The bigest age group in the army is 18-24, and it falls after that, while the airforce had quite even numbers from 18 right up to 34. With slightly more on towards the 34 end. The biggest group by far when it came to length of service in the army was only 2-4 years, while the airforce's biggest group was the 5-8 year group, again with a much more even spread.

This tells us that more people outgrow the army culture and leave sooner, while the airforce remains attractive much longer. The Army, and Navy too, are much more lifestyle choices, that really do affect your lifestyle in and out of work. You will find the airforce is not the same, with much more emphasis placed on having a real life outside the service, especially after the first couple of years.

[Dave Homewood]

I'm sure we had Base Contingency Forces when I was in too, the name rings a bell and I think perhaps that is what Wigram had rather than a GDF. I never had any involvement but seem to recall notices in BRO's about training days or whatever.

I guess the RNZAF retains better because the trades such as Aircraft Mechanic and Avionics are useful for future careers in aviation. So people would want to complete the training while they're being paid well for it ratehr than going to polytech and incurring a huge debt. And they have a return of service after Techs Course (or is that gone too?), plus the 8 year mark in the Suoerannuation which makes your payout jump significantly. All factors in the longer retention I guess.

Some army trades must be great for future careers too, but I'm not sure that infantry is the choice of career if you wish to go on in life after the army in a similar field. I guess they make good security guards, but I can't think what else they could do that is much like being in the army. Whereas a sailor in the Navy can carry on on civil shipping, and an RNZAF pilot, navigator, technician etc can carry on in their field in civil aviation fairly well with their air force training.

[phil]

There are definately still returns of service, actually they were increased a couple of years ago for most trades.

[Dave Homewood]

Cheers. That makes sense.