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Post by Dave Homewood on Dec 6, 2008 14:27:14 GMT 12
That is a good suggestion to check with the kindergarten for old photos, also check the local museum. They may have taken photos at Christmas parties there, etc. maybe you could track down kindergarten teachers from that era too who might know where it went. Perhaps an appeal in the local newspaper would be worthwhile, someone out there will know about it.
It has always seemed odd to me that the RNZAF brochure from that 1964 airshow mentioned two Avros were sold, but there may be some truth in it.
Don't be fooled into thinking the AHNZS journal is the be all and end all of history, I have found numerous mistakes and ommissions in old articles I have from the journal, despite them being generally very good.
Hinds never had three cockpits, but it is another slim possibility.
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Post by shorty on Dec 6, 2008 19:50:18 GMT 12
I agree with your comment about the older AHSNZ journals but around that time they were basically the only show in town when it came to old aircraft and us silly oicks who went chasing around the country looking for them. And yes, I know the Hind crew numbers but there is a slight possibility that an extra seat was added for tyhe kids. Not very likely but a distant maybe.
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Post by fletcherfu24 on Dec 7, 2008 12:09:04 GMT 12
Isnt Google streetview fun... While cruising the streets of Takapau looking for a likely location of the Harvard in the playground that started this thread I found the the mysterious green building in the background of the photo. maps.google.co.nz/maps?hl=en&q=takapau&ie=UTF8&ll=-40.025265,176.346638&spn=0,359.986267&t=h&z=16&iwloc=addr&layer=c&cbll=-40.027573,176.347484&panoid=7qZowqQ7Dq9x5FjRSLWZPg&cbp=12,284.37498766561447,,0,-5.457527692226997 And if you compare it with the Masonic Lodge down the road at Ormondville, maps.google.co.nz/maps?hl=en&safe=off&q=ormondville&ie=UTF8&ll=-40.096327,176.260099&spn=0,359.972534&z=15&g=ormondville&layer=c&cbll=-40.10805,176.260107&panoid=7wsCLR8TNat2nOb6nG289Q&cbp=12,285.3040052995695,,0,5theres no doubt it was a Masonic lodge. But as the background to the current Takapau location doesnt match the original photo the takapau lodge was obviuosly shifted.
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Post by kiwithrottlejockey on Dec 7, 2008 14:00:44 GMT 12
Isnt Google streetview fun... . I tried using Google Streetview to see if I could peer into the Mahora Kindergarten grounds (you never know, although the possibility is extremely remote all these decades later that the aeroplane hulk could still be there, it was worth trying to take a look), but no luck. Although it is a backsection, I was trying to see down between the houses into the corner of the kindergarten grounds where I remembered the fuselage to be, but the photographs of Rangiora Street were taken when the sun was in the wrong place, meaning you are looking straight into the sun in that direction. I did however confirm that the kindergarten is still at the same location, because you can see the Mahora Kindergarten sign at the entranceway and peer down the access driveway. It's just a pity they photographed Rangiora Street in the late afternoon.
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Post by shamus on Dec 8, 2008 11:46:21 GMT 12
Unlikely to be a Hind, Shorty. The Hinds had only 2 cockpits, pilot, and in the trainer one for the instructor, and in the bomber, one pilot and one for the gunner. No room for a third one at all.
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Post by Dave Homewood on Dec 8, 2008 15:20:16 GMT 12
I recently added a page to my website detailing the RNZAF Lockheed Hudson survivors as a place to gather information collected from here, there and everywhere. I would like to now collate a similar page to gather as much information, memories and photos relating to the many and varied RNZAF aircraft that ended up in playgrounds around the country. Is it ok to please use the photos of the different Harvard slides that have been posted here on this thread? The permission to use them from the various posters here would be appreciated please.
Also does anyone have info or photos of other playground aircraft such as the Avenger that was alledgedly at Rotorua, and the Vampire mentioned here, and others?
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Post by philip on Dec 8, 2008 15:32:21 GMT 12
I remember playing on the aircraft at Kuirau Park Rotorua but not what it was. If I recall it was mounted tail down, nose high, quite a climb to get up through it to the cockpit. My hazy memory says you entered it's tail in a form of turret and it had a "proper" side-by-side cockpit up front but thats not an Avenger so I'm wrong on that count. I seems every playground in NZ had an aircraft in those days
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Post by fletcherfu24 on Dec 8, 2008 16:26:44 GMT 12
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Post by Peter Lewis on Dec 8, 2008 19:26:20 GMT 12
Dave, the following ex-RNZAF airframes make it on to my (not guaranteed complete) list of playground aircraft. You may use any of my images in your webpage. Harvard NZ918 - Sold by to Bennett Aviation Ltd, Te Kuiti. Sold to Jaycees, to playground at Pahiatua Nov63 Harvard NZ946 - Sold by tender to Horrell Company, Ashburton, to Jaycees for playground at Methven 1967, major components to Ed Billman of Auckland Harvard NZ980 - Sold by tender to Bennett Aviation Ltd, Te Kuiti. To Jaycees for playground at Tauranga Feb63 , removed 1979 and sold Asplin Supplies, scrapped 1980 Harvard NZ1100 - Sold by GSB tender number 7078 to Bennett Aviation Ltd., Te Kuiti. Purchased by Jaycees and installed in childrens playground at Takapau in August 1963. To store at Ardmore with R. Jowitt. To Southair Aviation, Timaru with NZ1102. Sold by receivers of Southair to the Canterbury Flight of the Confederate Air Force. Swapped with RNZAF Museum in exchange for parts to return NZ1040 to airworthy condition. In storage at RNZAF Museum early 1990s. Fuselage stored at Omaka awaiting restoration Harvard NZ1102 - Sold by tender from Hobsonville in August 1965 in unairworthy condition and used in childrens playground at Morrinsville. Purchased by R. Jowitt mid 1985 and stored at Ardmore. To Southair Aviation, Timaru. Sold by receivers of Southair to the Canterbury Flight of the Confederate Air Force. Swapped with RNZAF Museum in exchange for parts to return NZ1040 to airworthy condition. In storage at RNZAF Museum since early 1990s. Avenger NZ2505 - Sold to Waitomo Aviation 23Sep59, to playground at Opunake Beach 1964. Removed to Wellington for restoration 1972, storage at RNZAF Museum Wigram, on loan to Gisborne Aviation & Preservation Society from Oct99 Avenger NZ2527 - WFU Ohakea Jun59, Sold to Bennett Aviation 23Sep59. To ZK-CBO, playground Kuirau Park, Rotorua, Oct. 1964-1969 then eventually MoTAT; on loan to CAF at Dairy Flat, returned to MoTAT Avenger NZ2539 - Sold Waitomo Aviation 23Sep59; resold to Hastings Jaycees, arr 24Aug65 for Havelock North playground, to K Jacobs of Auckland Vampire NZ5701 - WFU - sold 2May63 by tender #8241 of 9Feb63 to Dwen Distribution Co., Auckland, ex-Woodbourne. To display in Redwood playground at Blenheim. Fate? I also have pics of NZ1102 & NZ2527 but not actually at the playgrounds:
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Post by shorty on Dec 8, 2008 19:35:02 GMT 12
There was also a Vampire at Woodbourne in the playcentre (in the MQ area)
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Post by Dave Homewood on Dec 8, 2008 19:37:15 GMT 12
Thanks Peter, much appreciated information.
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Post by kiwithrottlejockey on Dec 8, 2008 20:15:44 GMT 12
Also does anyone have info or photos of other playground aircraft such as the Avenger that was alledgedly at Rotorua, and the Vampire mentioned here, and others? I just remembered another old aeroplane that used to be in a playground in Hawke's Bay. There was a Grumman Avenger in the playground in the park between Te Mata and Napier Roads in Havelock North (next to the swimming pool) and it may even have still been there in the 1980s. There was a slide from the nose (where the engine used to be) to the ground in front of the aeroplane. I think (although I'm not 100% sure) access to the aircraft may have been via a ladder into the bomb bay, with access from there into the crew spaces/cockpit and into the engine nacelle and the top of the slide. Presumably it was an ex-RNZAF Avenger?
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Post by shorty on Dec 8, 2008 20:33:22 GMT 12
Also does anyone have info or photos of other playground aircraft such as the Avenger that was alledgedly at Rotorua, and the Vampire mentioned here, and others? I just remembered another old aeroplane that used to be in a playground in Hawke's Bay. There was a Grumman Avenger in the playground in the park between Te Mata and Napier Roads in Havelock North (next to the swimming pool) and it may even have still been there in the 1980s. There was a slide from the nose (where the engine used to be) to the ground in front of the aeroplane. I think (although I'm not 100% sure) access to the aircraft may have been via a ladder into the bomb bay, with access from there into the crew spaces/cockpit and into the engine nacelle and the top of the slide. Presumably it was an ex-RNZAF Avenger? That was NZ 2539, now in the care (??) of Ken Jacobs.
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Post by shamus on Dec 8, 2008 21:28:43 GMT 12
The aircraft at Kuirau Park , Rotorua was definitely an Avenger. I was with the team from Motat preparing it for its road journey to Auckland. I know i have either a photo or a 8mm movie of it before it left for Auckland but can't lay my hands on it at the moment. Will post it as soon as it comes to light.
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Post by Dave Homewood on Dec 8, 2008 21:43:39 GMT 12
Thanks everyone. Great info.
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Post by harvard1041 on Dec 9, 2008 1:15:41 GMT 12
Ah yes - recall the Vampire in the playground at Woodbourne (next to the Gym now) -about 1971- and the one at Redwoodtown...think they both ended up in a shed in Renwick. Here's the two Harvards you might want to use - Dave. ...surely the Harvard on the pole at Wigram should count ?..can't be that many aircraft up poles ?...Wigram, Harewood spring to mind.
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Post by philip on Dec 9, 2008 7:55:26 GMT 12
Yeah I can see with the avenger how it was set low enough to climb in through the underbelly opening, would have resembled a turret to a 5 year old! There was a tank there too and the obligatory traction engine. Loved that place.
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Post by Dave Homewood on Apr 14, 2009 9:49:51 GMT 12
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Post by 7gcbcpilot on Apr 19, 2009 19:07:26 GMT 12
This is the first time I had seen the original post with the photo of the Harvard in the playground and my reaction was "wow.... thats Takapau.... I used to play on that as a kid". My grandparents were farming south of Takapau and we often visited for a week or so. This was in the early to mid 70's so I was pretty young and everything looked bigger then but I remember it being a long way down from the plane. The playground in Takapau is next to the Grocery Store (4 Square now... not sure what it was in the 70's) and you can still see it in the pictures from Google maps.... although no Harvard. I was very disappointed when I went back to Takapau in the mid 90's to find it missing. This photo shows the view towards the playground from Charlotte Street (the main street in Takapau). If you look at the original photo notice the distinctive building behind the Harvard. Notice also that there is actually quite a bit of empty section between the Harvard the building. I think the playground has moved and in the 70's it was closer to the 4 Square building. Using Google Maps if you go to Walter Street (which runs parallel to Charlotte) you find the following building in a direct line if the original playground was closer to the 4 Square. which is the one shown in the original photo. It's great to see the photo again. Really brings back memories. Andrew
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Post by Dave Homewood on Apr 19, 2009 19:28:16 GMT 12
Thanks. Working now so I deleted my post
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