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Post by planeimages on Nov 5, 2008 19:12:31 GMT 12
Why was the flight from Sydney to NZ in 1928 terminated in Christchurch rather than the originally-planned Wellington?
Runway length, surface strength, position, winds?
Please advise by email: peter@finlays.com.au
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Post by flyjoe180 on Nov 8, 2008 8:23:44 GMT 12
Because Christchurch had the only aerodrome with a runway sufficiently long enough to take the Southern Cross.
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Post by Peter Lewis on Nov 8, 2008 9:47:51 GMT 12
You're probably right there Joe, but I have had a good look at the city park in Suva where they landed the 'Southern Cross' during the trans-Pacific flight and that looked quite short to me. I would have thought that Rongotai, even in its early days, would have been larger. Mind you, the Suva park might well have been reduced in size over the years.
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Post by corsair67 on Nov 8, 2008 14:06:19 GMT 12
I thought that Wigram became the final destination because the weather at Wellington was too bad?
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Post by flyjoe180 on Nov 9, 2008 10:54:50 GMT 12
MacKersey's book mentions the Southern Cross flew around Wellington to cheers and people charging about in dressing gowns etc, before heading to land in Christchurch because the runway at Wellington was not long enough. I'll find a reference and get back to you.
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Post by flyjoe180 on Nov 9, 2008 11:02:26 GMT 12
Pg 183: From Wellington they flew south to CHristchurch, the country's only large aerodrome
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Post by planeimages on Nov 9, 2008 20:27:17 GMT 12
Dave gave me the answer. There was no airfield at Wellington at the time! QED. It would seem that CKS might have thought that Wellington was the right place to head for until he discovered that Christchurch was the destination.
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Post by corsair67 on Nov 9, 2008 20:56:25 GMT 12
It's odd that they went via Wellington as that must have added a bit of time to the journey?
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Post by shorty on Nov 9, 2008 21:25:09 GMT 12
Good PR to fly over the capital though
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Post by Dave Homewood on Nov 9, 2008 22:47:45 GMT 12
No, from memory they were caught in a storm that nearly killed them on the way over and blew them well of course. When they finally made land it was Wellignton. I think perhaps on that first flight they were aiming north of direct to Chrstchurch anyway to avoid crossing the Alps but they later did fly over the Alps no trouble.
I'm certain Wigram was always the intended destination because otherwise why would the NZPAF have sent out planes to meet them, why was the Christchurch radio station broadcasting from Wigram, why were thousands of people there waiting for the landing, and why else was the camera plane that filmed them landing there at Christchurch?
I do have to check some books and have promised Peter I would when i get a chance, but my memory of reading up on the Kingsford Smith flights to NZ are that Wellington was never meant to be a destination, it just happened to be a navigation point when they made land.
Wigram was the only proper aerodrome in New Zealand at that time, 1928. There were a few farm paddock strips and Hobsonville was under construction but nothing else capable of taking the Southern Cross. Woodbourne was constructed during the tour as an airfield made from a farm paddock, and those two airfields were the only places the Southern Cross could and did land then.
It was after their tour that kiwis set about making airfields properly.
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Post by planeimages on Nov 10, 2008 23:05:21 GMT 12
Dave,
Thanks for that explanation. However, Wellington was apparently stated as the original destination in publicity material before departure and then altered to Christchurch (probably when they discovered that there was no field at W.
See what we Aussies did for you?
They had plenty of endurance so the bit extra to CH was irrelevant. They hit Wellington bang on course after a night-time celestial fix despite the storm which had the Southern Cross diving 5500 feet in less than a minute at 150 mph.
BTW. Will you be getting a proper Air Force now that the woman has gone?
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Post by Dave Homewood on Nov 10, 2008 23:50:57 GMT 12
Surely that cannot be right. I cannot conceive that people like that crew, given that two kiwis were aboard, would have set off in the blind hope they'd find an airfield in Wellington without doing any research and planning, and then making a last minute decision to change course by several hundred miles. That just seems illogical. Litchfield and McWilliams must have been aware of the state of NZ airfields even if the Aussie crewmembers weren't.
It has just come to me from the back of my mind, and may be wrong, but they had a radio aboard and were supposed to be in contact with someone in NZ but the storm put their wireless out. I wonder if they were aimingat Wellington as that is where the receiving station was and perhaps they were homing on a signal from there? (if they could do that back then).
After they were sighted in Wellington the message was radioed to Christchurch and word must have been spread there on the morning wireless news report. 30,000 people turned up, and 5000 cars. Kids wre given half a day off school. Four Bristol Freighters were sent to meet it, which they did at Amberley and guided the old bus in. While they were away Captain Findlay went up in a grebe and did an aerobatic display to please the crowd.
It should be noted that at the time Smithy arrived, the NZPAF aircrfat at Wigram were the only significant aircrfat flying in NZ at the time and when they went away around the place they used paddocks, beaches and race courses as their runways. I cannot believe that Smithy ever intended to land at Wellington. I think it was a navigation point only and the radio probably has something to do with it. Wellingotn propbably had the best radio equipment then.
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Post by Dave Homewood on Nov 11, 2008 0:04:38 GMT 12
I have located an extract from Ulm's own log of the trip.
"At 5.00am (Sydney time) we saw what appeared to be two mountain caps and at 5.20am glided through the clouds to a very pretty harbour below us. We located this place as being the northern part of the South Island.
At 5.45am we were over Cook Strait and decided to call into Wellington. We flew over the city at about 1000 feet and at 5.55am we turned away over Cook Strait and down to Christchurch. At 7.50am (9.22 local time) we landed at Wigram Aerodrome to be greeted by the most enthusiastic crowd we had ever met."
And I think I have found the answer for why they aimed at Cook Strait. Ulm recorded this: "We cannot say enough in praise of Litchfield's navigation under particularly adverse conditions for both flying and air navigation. He set a course for a very small point, that is, Cook Strait, and brought us there most accurately. We had sad duties to perform in the dropping of two wreaths in memory of two gallant gentlemen, Moncrieff and Hood, who set out on the flight we have just completed."
So perhaps they wanted to drop the wreaths in Cook Strait particularly? It seems from his writing that flying over Wellington itself was an afterthought.
This information comes from the official 50th Anniversary souvenir booklet form the Wigram airshow that marked the flight.
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Post by Bruce on Nov 11, 2008 7:34:01 GMT 12
"Four Bristol Freighters were sent to meet it, which they did at Amberley and guided the old bus in." Fighters I think Dave...
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Post by Dave Homewood on Nov 11, 2008 9:07:22 GMT 12
I beg to differ ;D
Whoops. It was late, ok. They probably did a lot more freighting than fighting.
Peter I have gone through a lot of files here and located a lot of original newspaper articles that I copied about the second and third trips to NZ (which were of interest because I was trying to pinpoint when the Southern Cross landed at Cambridge but still cannot get a clear date). Unfortunately thoguh i read up on the first flight to NZ I don't have much about it, only the crew's tour of the North Island later by de Soutter, Bristol and car. If you're looking into the later flights though let me know.
I've still found very little on the two kiwi crewmen, Litchfield and McWilliam/s (every reference from the newspapers have no 's' on the end, and even the 50th Anniversary brochure has both spellings!)
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Post by planeimages on Nov 11, 2008 18:18:13 GMT 12
Many thanks Dave,
As I said, from what I have read here it was promoted that they were going to fly to Wellington initially. That could easily have been someone getting the story wrong in the office or in a newspaper.
Ulm's log is very illuminating and we have used that in the story. It is evident from that they intended landing at Wigram and just paid their respects to Wellington after honoring Moncreiff and Hood on the way.
It would seem that Tom McWilliams' name was spelled with the "s" if the probate record is that of him (TH) and their spelling is correct.
Do you have copies of the newspapers or have you looked them up in a public resource facility?
Anything you can send me in hard copy or email would be very much appreciated.
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Post by oldfokker on Nov 12, 2008 16:55:36 GMT 12
CKS described the Wellington overfly as a "nice gesture". Extract from 'My Flying Life' biography - The same book relates how McWilliams was recruited as a replacement wireless operator. 'We asked the NZ Govt to make available the services of a New Zealander, as we were flying to that Dominion, and they brought us in contact with Mr McWilliams.' Mick
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Post by planeimages on Nov 12, 2008 19:50:42 GMT 12
Many thanks
Peter
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Post by planeimages on Nov 13, 2008 20:59:25 GMT 12
Any idea who flew the other Bristols around the country with Smith and Ulm in 1928? Would Smithy and Ulm flown in one machine while RNZAF staff and perhaps a mechanic have been in the others?
Thanks
Peter
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ron
Squadron Leader
Posts: 110
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Post by ron on Nov 28, 2008 21:59:57 GMT 12
Ted Wixted's book "The Life and Times of Sir Charles Kingsford Smith" includes a reproduction of a programme from the Wellington Trotting Club which has been signed by all four crew of the Southern Cross. One signature clearly reads T.H. McWilliams (with an s) The programme is for an event on Sat 15 Sept.
The book also includes a photo of the SC surrounded by spectators at Christchurch on 10 Sep 28. The caption reads in part; "Because of an absence of suitable aerodromes for the larger-than-usual aircraft, the Southern Cross remained at Christchurch until September 28. The return flight was made from Blenheim on October 13 and took 23.5 hours."
Regards Ron
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