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Post by Dave Homewood on Dec 20, 2009 14:20:46 GMT 12
Was anyone here at Ohakea in 1959 when the Vulcan crash-landed after it's ground strike at the opening of Wellington Airport? There's a frustrated conversation going on at the PlaneTalk Forum and I think it would be interesting to hear other eye-witness accounts forum.planetalk.net/viewtopic.php?t=8900 |
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Post by mumbles on Dec 20, 2009 17:42:19 GMT 12
Well I wasn't there in 1959, but have read the thread you linked to, and do have some knowledge of the incident and the aircraft. While not casting doubts on the integrity or sincerity of the topic starter or his sources (which I am sure are genuine), certain aspects of the story he relates appear to have been perhaps inaccurate to start with, and perhaps embellished / exaggerated, or otherwise affected by the passage of time. There also appears to be some confusion between this and other Vulcan visits to NZ. That's not intended as an insult, just an observation based on the facts as I know them. Some things related as facts by (or told to) the poster are either highly unlikely or actually impossible. Reading between the lines, had the thread conversation been conducted face to face instead of on line, I am sure the resulting acrimony would not have ensued (some conversational cues seem to have been missed or misread  ). |
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Post by shamus on Dec 20, 2009 18:45:36 GMT 12
Here is a photo of the Vulcan either entering or leaving the hangar at Ohakea. Am not sure why the front leg is on the trolley if it has been repaired, so possibly entering hangar for repair. Have other photos somewhere of it after landing at Ohakea but can't put my hands on them at the moment.  |
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Post by mumbles on Dec 20, 2009 18:54:08 GMT 12
Am not sure why the front leg is on the trolley if it has been repaired, so possibly entering hangar for repair. At a guess I'd say it was leaving looking at the people in the picture. The nose leg had to be raised to tilt the tail back far enough for the fin to clear the hangar door opening, hence the trolley. |
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Post by shamus on Dec 20, 2009 18:59:38 GMT 12
Yes. Makes sense. Thanks for that mumbles.
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Post by phil82 on Dec 20, 2009 19:33:35 GMT 12
Mr Child is very much mistaken in his assertions on the Vulcan incident. That photo Shamus, shows the aircraft probably being taken out because it has a canopy, the original was jettisoned! The people are also all RAF; note the Berets, and RAF-issue cold weather jackets.
The pilot was one Sqn Ldr Tony Smailles, very experienced, and a Sqn Ldr, not the inexperienced chap claimed by Mr Child.
That Vulcan was not a Blue Steel carrier: note the bomb bay area, which is unmodified; Blue Steel was carried partially externally, and that aircraft clearly isn't one of them.
Tony Smailles was not killed with his crew: the accident referred to by Mr Child occurred three years before Wellington; Mr Smailles left the RAF as a Wg Cmdr and is very much alive as far as I know.
The crew door was fully functional in the hangar, so why anyone would have to enter the cockpit via the roof escapes me. There is also ample room for the aircrew to climb into their seats: I've been in a Vulcan many times, and flown in a Vampire T11 [with the late Barry Reid], and the comparison is ridiculous!
The equipment removed from the Vulcan was not sent back to the UK by sea, but on an RAF Transport Command Britannia which brought AVRO and RAF techs out to effect repairs. The RNZAF had no responsibilty for repair whatsoever, although no doubt a few of our blokes got involved.
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Post by angelsonefive on Dec 20, 2009 20:12:56 GMT 12
Mr Child also makes the claim that a barrage balloon was used as an air bag to jack up the wing.
This is the first suggestion that I have ever seen that the NZ Forces had any barrage balloons.
As for the feasibility of using one to lift the weight of a 37,000 kg aircraft, well, I have to say I have my doubts.
And as for a company of the Parachute Regiment providing security ?
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Post by shamus on Dec 20, 2009 20:52:32 GMT 12
Two photos of the Vulcan at Ohakea about to be moved. The first one has some distortion but the second shows clearly the airbag used to raise the wing.   |
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Post by shamus on Dec 20, 2009 21:05:27 GMT 12
Looking at it now ( the second photo) I think it is reversed. I will correct it but at the moment Telecom internet is giving me so much trouble it may take some time.
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Post by shamus on Dec 20, 2009 21:19:43 GMT 12
Here it is. Hope its right this time.  |
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glycol
Squadron Leader
Posts: 103
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Post by glycol on Dec 20, 2009 21:28:37 GMT 12
I was there at the time. I understood the RNZAF had no gear capable of lifting the aircraft off the side of the runway. They built a platform of railway sleepers under the Vulcan and used Globemaster salvage bags lent by Deep Freeze under the wings to lift her. The aircraft sat for sometime between the 42 Squadron hangar and what used to be the Central Servicing hangar. I don't recall any guards but if my memory serves me correctly, there may have been some engine inhibiting done by RNZAF people. The Vulcan was later moved to the 75 Sqdn. hangar for repair.
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Post by Dave Homewood on Dec 20, 2009 22:20:17 GMT 12
Interesting stuff coming out. I hope the people form the PlaneTalk forum are reading this.
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Post by phil82 on Dec 21, 2009 7:32:10 GMT 12
As I have said, the Vulcan was not modified to carry Blue Steel. What Mr Child is adamantly claiming his father saw removed would be the radar; "Blue Silk" or whatever variation of blue was current for Vulcans in 1959. Blue was the generic code name for a number of British projects, including Blue Steel and, famously, Blue Circle for the block of cement fitted to some aircraft because the radar wasn't ready. Blue Circle is a British cement manufacturer.
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Post by 14liney on Dec 21, 2009 11:50:11 GMT 12
Shorty. Do you have any photos of the Vulcan in your stash?
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Post by skyhawkdon on Dec 21, 2009 20:17:04 GMT 12
Great photos guys.
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Post by oj on Dec 21, 2009 21:33:44 GMT 12
My elder brother was based at Ohakea at the time, and I was fortunate to to be taken to see the Vulcan under repair in the hangar (No. 2 Hangar) whilst still a schoolboy visiting him during holidays; a great thrill!
I remember him describing how, when the aircraft was made ready to tow it from the grass where it had landed, the Army Scammel brought on base for the purpose was not up to the task, and the aircraft was eventually moved to the hangar by being towed by one of the RNZAF Leyland Hippo tankers.
Perhaps Shamus or Glycol could comment on that?
OJ
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Post by baz62 on Dec 21, 2009 21:53:46 GMT 12
Wow I just read the plane talk thread. That chap just doesn't want to face facts! Lucky he didn't try it on the WIX site (Warbirds Information Exchange) they would have shot him down with a SAM and nuked the remains! I always try to be very careful when I post as I know a lot of you chaps know way more than me (probably cos you are all old...................  ) I'd never post anything as gospel unless I was very very sure of my facts. And even then I'll take someones take on it and check it out further. |
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Post by Bruce on Dec 21, 2009 22:34:29 GMT 12
I suppose the Hippo could have been driven by the Engineering officer-R&Q Clerk-Photographer and his son.... Walter Mitty lives on..... |
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Post by shamus on Dec 22, 2009 9:16:58 GMT 12
oj, I was not present at Ohakea at the time so cannot comment on what was used to tow it off the runway. My collection of photos from that time are on many discs and I have to go through them all to see what I can find. I believe I have more but time at the moment seems to be hard to find. Will make an effort tonight to see what else their is and post them.
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Post by Dave Homewood on Dec 22, 2009 11:53:24 GMT 12
Thanks Shamus.
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).
) I'd never post anything as gospel unless I was very very sure of my facts. And even then I'll take someones take on it and check it out further. 