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MOTAT
Sept 13, 2017 20:37:54 GMT 12
Post by shorty on Sept 13, 2017 20:37:54 GMT 12
or any Cessna!
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MOTAT
Sept 13, 2017 20:54:24 GMT 12
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Post by planecrazy on Sept 13, 2017 20:54:24 GMT 12
I spent the best part of a decade meeting and interviewing ex Ansett Flyingboat crew on Lord Howe Island and would like to support the kiwithrottlejocky statement. I would also like to add these, flying boat people, border on aggression when you call a Sandringham a seaplane, they also don't like you saying flying boats land they don't they alight! NZ 4115's cousin NZ 4108 when she first crossed the Tasman to become VH BRF "Islander."
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Post by errolmartyn on Sept 13, 2017 20:57:56 GMT 12
Try telling that to one of the two surviving ex-TEAL flying-boat pilots. He is absolutely insistent that there is a difference....ie, a seaplane is a land-plane on pontoons or floats, whereas a flying-boat puts its hull in the water and uses either sponsons or outboard floats for balance while on the water. He asked me if I knew the difference while I was talking to him via Skype recently, and I obviously gave him the correct answer, because he was happy with my answer. And I happen to agree with him. Insistent you both may be but, at the risk of repeating myself, the above explanation of the terminology is incorrect. ''Seaplane. A generic term covering all aeroplanes which can take off from and alight on the sea. It includes both flying-boats and floatplanes' ( Glossary of Flying - a dictionary of aeronautical terms reprinted from the Aeroplane Spotter published sometime during The Great Difficulty of 1939-1945) 'seaplane. [since] 1913. An aeroplane adapted for rising from and landing on water.' ( The Shorter Oxford English Dictionary, 1973 edition) 'seaplane. a plane that can take off from and land on water' 'floatplane. a seaplane that has hollow structures attached underneath its wings and sometimes its fuselage on which it floats so that the main body of the plane is not in contact with the water. Compare flying boat' 'flying boat. a seaplane with a body that acts like a boat's hull and allows the plane to float on water. Compare floatplane. (all Dictionary of Aviation, 2005 edition) Errol
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Post by errolmartyn on Sept 13, 2017 21:09:20 GMT 12
I spent the best part of a decade meeting and interviewing ex Ansett Flyingboat crew on Lord Howe Island and would like to support the kiwithrottlejocky statement. I would also like to add these, flying boat people, border on aggression when you call a Sandringham a seaplane, All of which just goes to demonstrate that while you might invite an aircrew member to give lecture on how to fly it would not be wise to invite him or her to give one on etymology! Errol
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MOTAT
Sept 13, 2017 22:34:13 GMT 12
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Post by markrogers on Sept 13, 2017 22:34:13 GMT 12
Saw the Sunderland on the 6pm TVNZ news tonight, it was awesome to see it being rolled into the MOTAT hangar! Congratulations and well done to all those all worked hard to restore it and put it on display.
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MOTAT
Sept 13, 2017 22:38:35 GMT 12
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Post by isc on Sept 13, 2017 22:38:35 GMT 12
It's coming on in a few minutes on TV1 10.30 PM news. isc
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MOTAT
Sept 13, 2017 22:48:27 GMT 12
Post by markrogers on Sept 13, 2017 22:48:27 GMT 12
Re the debate regarding a seaplane vs flying boat, sounds like flying boat would be the correct term for the Sunderland and Solent, and seaplane would be correct for a cessna 185 on floats for example. Just remembered that the 185 is also called a floatplane too...
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Post by Dave Homewood on Sept 13, 2017 23:09:33 GMT 12
Ugh, "seaplane" covers both flying boats and floatplanes, and also amphibious flying boats. Seaplane is the general term for any aircraft that can alight onto water, whilst the other three terms are categories within that type of aircraft. Just as Errol has pointed out twice.
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Post by Bruce on Sept 14, 2017 10:00:57 GMT 12
Yes, that is the correct legal definition as far as aviation law goes too. That is how they are always referred to in the Civil Aviation Rules. You have landplanes and Seaplanes, and just like you can get nosewheel and tailwheel landplanes, you can get Floatplane, Flying Boat and Amphibian Seaplanes.
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Post by Dave Homewood on Sept 14, 2017 14:48:09 GMT 12
Here are some great photos from the big move sent to me by MOTAT's Communications Adviser Vanessa Hefer, and a press release she has written too: Dance of the Flying BoatsMOTAT’s magnificent flying boats are on the move! A huge team of employees, volunteers and contractors spent days in the museum’s Aviation Display Hall bringing the newly painted Sunderland indoors, and moving the Solent ‘Aranui’ outside for further restoration works and painting. The long-term objective is to see the Sunderland and the Solent housed together under the same roof in the museum’s Aviation Display Hall. This vision is well on its way to being achieved with the Sunderland’s move into the hall. MOTAT chief executive Michael Frawley says it’s a significant moment for the Museum “The Sunderland was donated to MOTAT in 1967 but this is the first time in 50 years we’ve been able to house her inside so it’s a very special day for MOTAT and those connected with the plane.”. A rare treasure, the Sunderland is one of only four remaining examples in the world retaining its original military configuration. Earlier this year MOTAT completed the enormous undertaking of restoring and repainting the exterior of the aircraft. This is a job that was only possible with the tireless efforts of employees, volunteers, and contractors. MOTAT is fortunate to be supported by a skilled team who dedicate their time, knowledge and expertise to the museum’s aviation collection. “Seeing the Sunderland being restored and moved indoors is a tribute to everyone who has worked on this aircraft over many years,” says MOTAT Senior Workshop Engineer and long-term volunteer Norm McKelvey. Norm is a retired TEAL and Air New Zealand engineer who has been closely involved with the restoration of the flying boats and many other aircraft at the Museum. The next step in the Sunderland’s restoration is the repair of its internal lighting, the refurbishment of the gun turrets and cleaning the interior. To complete to entire project, the Museum needs to raise $120,000. This Sunday, 17 September is a special aviation Live Day where MOTAT visitors can be amongst the first to view the Sunderland with its striking new paintwork in the Aviation Display Hall. The Grumman Avenger Bomber will be operating its hydraulic wings while tours, talks and demonstrations will bring the stories behind the world-class aviation collection to life. MOTAT’s legendary Solent flying boat ‘Aranui’ is scheduled for exterior restoration work and has been temporarily moved outside to be protectively wrapped so that this work can be undertaken. These flying boats are rare artefacts from an era of aviation which pioneered air travel between Australia and New Zealand. Each aircraft has its own unique history, and MOTAT is delighted to share their stories with the public. Moving the Sunderland inside this week is a remarkable achievement and marks another important milestone for MOTAT. ENDS Further Information: Both vessels are products of the Short Brothers and Harland Limited, in Belfast, Ireland. The Sunderland was built in 1945, followed by the Solent in 1949. The Sunderland has a rich history beginning with service in British Royal Airforce; it was then loaned to the British Overseas Airways Corporation for training crew from 1946 to 1948, followed by serving the Royal New Zealand Airforce (RNZAF) with the 5 Squadron at Laucala Bay, Fiji, and Maritime search and Reconnaissance Unit at Hobsonville. The Sunderlands were eventually superseded by new technology with the Lockheed Orions. Following the aircraft’s retirement in 1966 MOTAT was gifted the Sunderland NZ4115 in 1967. Considered the most romantic air travel of its time, the TEAL Solent Commercial Flying boat operated as a long-range, luxury passenger service in the Tasman and South Pacific between 1949 and 1954. Thereafter, it operated exclusively in the South Pacific servicing the ‘Coral Route.’ Today, the Solent ZK-AMO ‘Aranui,’ is the sole remaining Short Solent Mk 4 in the world, and represents a glamorous era in New Zealand aviation history, making it a highly significant artefact in the collection. The Solent Flying boat ‘Aranui’ retired in 1960, and was donated and relocated to MOTAT in 1966. The Solent Preservation Society (SPS) restored the aircraft in the 1980’s and contributed funds to the first Aviation Display Hall to house the Solent. More recently, a new conservation programme has been developed with input from the International Conservation Services (ICS) with ongoing interior and exterior works planned. Thanks to a generous donation from Air New Zealand restoration works on the interior of the Solent are in the process of being carried out. Aviation Display Hall Location: MOTAT – Meola Road, Western Springs, Auckland Aviation Live Day: 17 September, 10am to 5pm Normal MOTAT admission fees apply
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MOTAT
Sept 14, 2017 15:47:19 GMT 12
Post by andrewpit on Sept 14, 2017 15:47:19 GMT 12
I think shes means one of 3 retaining their military configuration. Duxford, Hendon and Motat
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MOTAT
Sept 14, 2017 16:00:06 GMT 12
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Post by ZacYates on Sept 14, 2017 16:00:06 GMT 12
I love that aerial photo! I like all of them, but still.
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MOTAT
Sept 14, 2017 18:51:49 GMT 12
Post by kiwithrottlejockey on Sept 14, 2017 18:51:49 GMT 12
Shouldn't that be “Dance of the Seaplanes”?
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MOTAT
Sept 14, 2017 21:38:56 GMT 12
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Post by campbellbox on Sept 14, 2017 21:38:56 GMT 12
She looks SO good. I might have to pop along on Sunday.
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Post by felicityr on Sept 15, 2017 4:47:25 GMT 12
Great to see these photos and this is so cool....my late father's logbook contains entries for this Sunderland and that Devon (NZ1813) alongside.
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MOTAT
Sept 15, 2017 9:28:08 GMT 12
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Post by Mustang51 on Sept 15, 2017 9:28:08 GMT 12
Bloody marvelous ! Well done to all concerned. Its on my list of things to do again next time in Auckland. Hopefully the Copthorne is open again by then !
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Post by pjw4118 on Sept 16, 2017 17:01:23 GMT 12
DONT FORGET , its Aviation Day at MOTAT tomorrow , the Avenger is now up alongside the FAA display and the Lanc has been moved forward to allow visitors around the tail. There will be plenty of volunteers and guides on hand . 10 till 4 Sunday.
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MOTAT
Sept 16, 2017 17:16:59 GMT 12
Post by Dave Homewood on Sept 16, 2017 17:16:59 GMT 12
If the Warbirds Battle of Britain Flypast goes ahead tomorrow, weather permitting, do they fly over MOTAT?
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Post by campbellbox on Sept 17, 2017 17:51:34 GMT 12
I popped along to Motat's live day, and was really impressed by what I saw. The Avenger looks great in it's new spot near the FAA display. There was an appreciative crowd as it spread its wings. But I had really come to gaze at this grand old lady. She looks magnificent. What a credit to everyone who worked on her, and to those whose hard work enabled the extension to the Aviation Display Hall so she can live out of the weather. Bendy wing courtesy of phone panorama... The live day led to an interesting discovery (for me at least) - the suspended Harvard can be set up to fly a dirty pass! All the kids working the controls loved it, and while I would have liked to have barged them out of the way, I was pretty happy just watching the gear and flaps go up and down. I also appreciated being able to get on the Lancaster's 6 again. Constructive criticism - I would like a gantry at this end of the hall so I could look down on the Lanc etc. The DC3 and Hastings cockpit were open out the back in the blister hangar, and further out an APC was charging around and the train was running. All very exciting, and well worth the trip.
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Post by ZacYates on Sept 17, 2017 19:02:37 GMT 12
Great photos! I like the Avenger display, and I didn't know about the Harvard - I'd heard the engine recording but that is so cool!
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