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Post by Dave Homewood on May 19, 2011 1:17:33 GMT 12
By May 1942 some 750,000 homing/racing pigeons had been made available to the RAF by the public in the UK, including the King's own pigeons. And 1000 a week were being used by the General Reconnaissance squadrons of the RAF, released from aircraft in flight to report back messages and maintain radio silence.
This lead me to wonder, did the RNZAF ever use or consider pigeons for communication in this way? I don't think pigeons have ever been a popular racing sport in NZ so maybe they simply couldn't get them. But it would be interesting to know if it happened or was considered for GR aircraft within NZ skies.
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Post by shorty on May 20, 2011 8:55:18 GMT 12
In years gone by a large number if pigeons were sent around NZ by the railways. The Stationmaster (or Station Agent) would release them and note the time of release which was relayed back to the pigeon club. I can recall the hampers of pigeons sitting around on platforms awaiting release. All this, of course, was when we had lots of trains and stations!
A couple of guys in my class were into racing them (they lived in Waterview, Auckland)
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Post by Dave Homewood on May 20, 2011 9:25:09 GMT 12
Interesting. I had never heard of it going on here. I guess the hampers were returned by train?
There was a classic episode of Till Death Us Do Part where Alf Garnett bet his mate (played by Bill Maynard) that if they took their pigeons to Manchester they'd beat them home on the train. They released the birds and hopped on the traion. The birds settled down on top of the carriage and rode the train all the way back to London! Hilarious.
My question here came after reading a newspaper report about pigeons being used by GR crews in the RAF, with 1000 a week carrying messages back to base. It made me wonder if our own GR crews adopted this method. None of the GR crew memebrs I have talked with ever mentioned pigeons. I assume it never happened.
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Post by shorty on May 20, 2011 10:46:27 GMT 12
Our family used to spend a lot of holidays with a station agent and the pigeons would arrive in a wicker hamper (about the size of a large suitcase) with a release time on it. At the appropriate time they were released and a form giving the accurate time and weather conditions was completed and sent back with the hamper. When the birds arrived at their home loft the band from their leg was placed into a special recording clock device. The flight times were calculated from the dispatch card and the placings decided.
I think the amount of water surrounding NZ wold have precluded the use of pigeons here. In the UK they only had the channel to fly over if they were released over European operational areas whereas here they could have 50 plus miles to cover over water before finding anywhere to briefly rest (if they do that). The lack of landmarks may have also upset their navigation method back to their lofts.
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Post by Dave Homewood on May 20, 2011 11:59:42 GMT 12
The GR crews flying in the Baffins and Vincents and Vildebeests never ventured too far from land either though.
It's really bizarre to think that people would send off their beloved and prized pet on the train and expect it and its hamper to turn up safe and sounds a few hours later. What a strange hobby. These days the railways probbaly wouldn't have a bar of such activities and you'd have to use a courier van. ;D
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Post by shorty on May 20, 2011 12:08:06 GMT 12
They travelled in the guards van, oh well, thats ruled that idea out now.
They also stopped at country stations, oops thats another problem.
They were released by the station master/agent, damn thats another thing.
In those days the Railways was part of the public service, jeez, not scoring too well are we.
I don't know how pigeon clubs do it now.
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Post by Dave Homewood on May 20, 2011 12:20:30 GMT 12
Railways in NZ are complete rubbish compared with a) what they used to be from what I've heard and read, and b) compared with the likes of Britian and Europe. Yet it's still the most expensive way to travel.
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Post by ErrolC on May 20, 2011 12:52:53 GMT 12
Railways in NZ are complete rubbish compared with a) what they used to be from what I've heard and read, and b) compared with the likes of Britian and Europe. Yet it's still the most expensive way to travel. A useful response to this from me would involve a political rant (or three), so I will refrain. |
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Post by Dave Homewood on May 20, 2011 12:58:19 GMT 12
Nothing against the people who work for the railway, I just mean the entire network is not what it used to be. I would gladly go by rail if it went to many places with passengers rather than just freight, and it didn't cost more than flying. But that's no longer the case.
Still in the olden days even the pigeons were made to fly home!
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Post by shorty on May 20, 2011 13:41:39 GMT 12
Only because the miserly owners wouldn't buy them a return ticket!
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Post by ErrolC on May 20, 2011 14:13:58 GMT 12
Nothing against the people who work for the railway, I just mean the entire network is not what it used to be. I would gladly go by rail if it went to many places with passengers rather than just freight, and it didn't cost more than flying. But that's no longer the case. Still in the olden days even the pigeons were made to fly home! I wasn't offended, or being defensive (and don't work for Rail, although they were my parent company for a few years). The reasons for the differences are historical, geographical, and political. You can't talk usefully about any of these elements by themselves. |
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Post by ErrolC on May 20, 2011 14:36:00 GMT 12
Back to the original post (kind-of), bird seed was of course not officially imported to or produced in the UK during the war, creating a black market. The crews of some Swordfish in MAC ships would smuggle sacks of the stuff in the back of their stringbags - they had time to hide them after landing at their base in Northern Ireland before the customs guys arrived.
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Post by shorty on May 20, 2011 16:19:47 GMT 12
I read about that in a book written by a Swordfish pilot. Apparently selling it to little old ladies for their canaries was a very lucrative side line!
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Post by ErrolC on May 20, 2011 16:24:07 GMT 12
I read about that in a book written by a Swordfish pilot. Apparently selling it to little old ladies for their canaries was a very lucrative side line! Yep, 'Bring Back my Stringbag' IIRC |
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Post by Dave Homewood on May 20, 2011 17:06:16 GMT 12
Yes, I know a MAC pilot (probably the last, certainly NZ's last) who told me they did that too.
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Post by 30sqnatc on May 20, 2011 17:13:58 GMT 12
Railways in NZ are complete rubbish compared with a) what they used to be from what I've heard and read, and b) compared with the likes of Britian and Europe. Yet it's still the most expensive way to travel. Don't know when you last ventured on a train but my last trip just three weeks ago was contary to your belief: Wellington - Auckland $69 by train Return air fare Ak - Wgtn $241. And to get back on thread there were no pigeons in the guards van or any where else on the train but the chicken pie at the lunch stop in Ohakune could well have been ....... ;D |
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Post by Dave Homewood on May 20, 2011 17:23:11 GMT 12
You can get a ticket from Auckland to Wellington fequently on Grabaseat for $59, sometimes less. Trains from Hamilton seem to be intermitant and bloody overpriced. I guess cause it's full of Aucklanders and the seats are at a premium by the time it gets down here. Also their website is appualling in my opinion compared with other sites that sell tickets like airlines, buses and ferries. Just finding out if there is a train, then when, then how much can be a mission in my experience. Intercity is usually the best way to go in the end.
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Post by 30sqnatc on May 20, 2011 19:31:53 GMT 12
.... Also their website is appualling in my opinion compared with other sites that sell tickets like airlines, buses and ferries. ....... I totally agree that the website is USELESS. Four times I tried to pay for my ticket and it would not complete the transaction so I rang up the next morning. After the inevitable wait I explained what had happened. First had to cancel the four seats I had booked but not paid for then book and pay for another seat. Still I must admit even though it is a 12 hour trip, the scenery and comfort (compared to a sardine box aircraft seat) is great. outstanding |
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