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Post by chinapilot on Feb 6, 2012 18:23:17 GMT 12
Flyernzl...that sounds reasonable compared to say, the UK What was the breakdown in time?
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Post by conman on Feb 7, 2012 8:40:46 GMT 12
This is crazy , why does it cost so much to ascertain that someone is safe to fly for another couple of years, flight school short of business ? or CAA BS ?
Ridiculous when someone can get in a car and drive with no check until they turn 70 with the potential to cause as much if not more mayhem from bad skills / attitude
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Post by flyinkiwi on Feb 7, 2012 14:21:02 GMT 12
This is crazy , why does it cost so much to ascertain that someone is safe to fly for another couple of years, flight school short of business ? or CAA BS ? Pure and simply, it is the cost of aviation these days. Rising fuel, insurance and maintenance costs along with the added costs of code compliance, administration costs and other bureaucracy. All that gets passed on to the lowest rung on the food chain, you.
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Post by Peter Lewis on Feb 7, 2012 22:00:31 GMT 12
What was the breakdown in time? Three hours revision with instructor and aircraft. Flight test - 1.3 hours plus flight test fee. This is crazy , why does it cost so much to ascertain that someone is safe to fly for another couple of years, flight school short of business ? or CAA BS ? Ridiculous when someone can get in a car and drive with no check until they turn 70 with the potential to cause as much if not more mayhem from bad skills / attitude They do it because they can. Most people don't fly, so the majority can impose on the minority without fear. Actually I sort of agree with the system. It does make you get out there and revise the sort of stuff that you never usually get to practice, flying A to B. However, list of tasks that must be satisfactorily demonstrated does get longer each time. Latest addition seems to be the requirement that you must fly a 2000ft or so at 65kts without any flap out, and then demonstrate a turn to the right and a turn to the left in this configuration. What the f...? Who would every fly along, mushing nose up at 65kts so you can't see where you are going at that height? Bad- weather config is low down, with 10 degrees of flap so you can remain in contact with water or ground and able to see the path ahead, but this other one . . . Even Richard had no idea why this was required, but it was there on the list, so we had to do it. I see Auckland Aero Club are now talking openly about more than one checkout flight being required before they can sign off a BFR. Ridiculous. Anyway, this is one expensive little piece of paper:
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Post by johnnyfalcon on Feb 8, 2012 6:47:14 GMT 12
My BFR is due. The last one i did was 1 flight at 1.9 hrs, no revision flying, 1.5 hr ground work. It was a very thorough work-out, sweat under the David Clark seals if you know what I mean. The low-speed no flap config was unusual but I felt that it did give me a good tactile feel of the instability of the aeroplane at that edge of the envelope. It would be better to introduce full stall/spin recovery in my opinion, but then there's the issue of suitable aircraft.
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Post by flyjoe180 on Feb 8, 2012 8:22:15 GMT 12
The slow flight requirement was brought in after a series of low speed and spin accidents. I had to do it when I last renewed my B-Cat (which I have not done for the last few years due to the cost and I was only using it for 8 days a year at the ATC course in WB). I don't see the reason for doing a series of flights to satisfy a BFR requirement. The CAA mentioned that more than one flight may be required to tick all the boxes (e.g. if you did not have a suitable crosswind available to demonstrate that technique on the day). In the commercial world without simulators it is not practical or economical to conduct more than one test flight, which also counts as a BFR. Why should Joe Bloggs be treated any different?
Your PPL initial issue test is only one flight and that satisfies an examiner on behalf of CAA. So bringing in more than one sortie will make it too expensive for some. Shame on any aero club or school which seeks to milk its customers/members under the guise of misinterpreting the CAA's comment.
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Post by flyjoe180 on Feb 8, 2012 8:23:01 GMT 12
And as an aside, good to see Richards Hectors still flying. An old timer.
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Post by FlyingKiwi on Feb 8, 2012 18:07:06 GMT 12
It really depends a lot on the BFR too - just to expand on Peter's comment above on AAC suggesting more than one flight might be required; this is by no means a guaranteed thing. We've done several BFRs recently for very current pilots who got it done in an hour easily; if there's no crosswind at Ardmore there are plenty of other airfields in the nearby vicinity which have suitable cross runways.
We've also had several pilots who've taken 10 flights or more to get their BFR completed on account of having not flown for 15 years and only having a couple of hundred hours on the original license. Like I said, it depends entirely on the situation, but there's no point misleading someone into thinking it's going to be a quick 1 hour paperwork exercise if their flying is clearly not up to the standard required for the original issue of the license, and while as a C-cat instructor I'm not able to do BFRs myself, I've flown with students undertaking revision in preparation for a BFR who I would not be happy to send flying by themselves let alone with passengers, again not because of having an unrealistic standard to hold them to, but purely because of an extreme lack of recent experience.
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Post by voidhawk9 on Feb 8, 2012 20:39:59 GMT 12
100% . And some days I just say bollocks to practicing x,y or z lets just go for a scenic tour with a bit of map reading practise thrown in. The instructor would probably be thrilled to just go out with you and fly for fun. I know I loved those flights when I was instructing! ;D
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