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Post by Dave Homewood on Mar 11, 2012 21:31:42 GMT 12
Next Sunday on Prime TV there's a documentary schedled called Lost Airmen of Buchenwald. These were 168 Allied airmen who after being shot down were sent to the concentration camp rather than to a proper POW camp. They were lead by a New Zealander, RNZAF Squadron Leader Pil Lamason. I reckon this could be an amazing story. See more here: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phil_Lamasonwww.lostairmen.com/
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Post by htbrst on Mar 12, 2012 6:54:59 GMT 12
Thanks for the Heads-up Dave - I'm related via my Dad's side of the family to the other New Zealander that was there along side Phil Lamason - Malcolm Cullen The airmen later formed the KLB club: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/KLB_Club
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Post by Calum on Mar 12, 2012 13:57:30 GMT 12
Max Lambert in "Night after Night" has a bit on Pil Lamason and the pilots in Buchenwald (I just finished it a few nghts back). It's right near the back IIRC.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 13, 2012 11:13:07 GMT 12
There are a number of books written about those 168 men - "168 jump into Hell" and "Destination Buchenwald" are two plus at least 3 privately written books by men who were part of the 168.
Phil Lamison was the leader and it is said that without his support they would not have survived.
Phil apparently refused to let the men get down because of their predicament so when ever they had to go somewhere he lined them up and marched them there in good military style.
I am not sure that Phil was ever adequately recognized for his efforts.
One of NZ's true heroes I think - did a fantastic job in very tough circumstances and yet seeks no recognition for his efforts.
As far as I am aware he is still alive. I spoke with him once and he told me that he doesn't much like to be reminded of those days.
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Post by errolmartyn on Mar 13, 2012 12:03:00 GMT 12
From Colin Hanson’s By Such Deeds - Honours and Awards in the Royal New Zealand Air Force, 1923-1999:
"LAMASON, Squadron Leader Philip John, DFC*, mid(2).
NZ403460; Born Napier, 15 Sep 1918; RNZAF 28 Sep 1940 to 16 Dec 1945; PoW Aug 1944 to c.May 1945; Pilot. Citation Distinguished Flying Cross (Imm) (14 May 1942): [218 Sqn RAF (Stirling)] One night in April, 1942, this officer was the captain of an aircraft which attacked Pilsen.[/li][li] During the return flight his aircraft was attacked by an enemy night fighter and sustained damage; the hydraulics were shot away and the turret rendered unserviceable, while a fire broke out in the middle of the fuselage. Displaying great presence of mind, Pilot Officer Lamason coolly directed his crew in the emergency and, while two of them dealt with the fire, he skilfully out-manoeuvred his attacker and finally shook him off. By his fine airmanship and great devotion to duty, Pilot Officer Lamason was undoubtedly responsible for the safe return of the aircraft and its crew. This officer has completed 21 sorties and he has at all times displayed courage and ability.[/i] [/li][li] The night of 25/26 Apr 1942, a long-range attack by six Stirlings against the Skoda armament factory. Citation Mention in Despatches (1) (2 Jun 1943): For bravery in action and meritorious fulfilment of duty with 1657 HCU RAF (Stirling). Citation Mention in Despatches (2) (14 Jan 1944): For distinguished service with 1657 HCU RAF (Stirling). Citation Bar to Distinguished Flying Cross (24 Jun 1944): [15 Sqn RAF (Lancaster)] Since the award of the Distinguished Flying Cross, this officer has continued to operate with courage and devotion to duty of a high order. He has completed a large number of operational missions including several attacks on Berlin and other heavily defended German targets and has always pressed home his attacks with vigorous determination. His gallantry, leadership and enthusiasm have been extremely praiseworthy. Member of the ‘Caterpillar Club’. Sqn Ldr Lamason was a Flt Cdr on 15 Sqn. He was shot down by a German fighter on 8 Jun 1944 during a raid on railway marshalling yards near Paris. He escaped from his burning aircraft and with the aid of the French underground movement evaded capture for seven weeks until caught by the Gestapo in Paris. He was transported to Germany in the last German train to leave Paris in 1944 and for two months was confined in the Buchenwald concentration camp."
Interestingly, not so much as even an mid for his efforts at Buchenwald.
Errol
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Post by Dave Homewood on Mar 13, 2012 12:31:02 GMT 12
I forgot to add it is screening on Prime at 8.45pm, Sunday.
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Post by lostairmendirector on Mar 13, 2012 18:04:16 GMT 12
I am the filmmaker behind Lost Airmen of Buchenwald. Very glad to see this discussion and excited for New Zealand to get to see our film in a few days.
If anyone has any questions now, or after the film airs, I'm happy to answer them. To answer one question here - yes, Phil Lamason is still living - still on his farm in Dannevirke, although he is well into his 90's now and understandably his health can be unpredictable.
My grandfather was an American pilot in Buchenwald with Phil's group, so my family owes much thanks to Lamason. It is true that I don't think he much cares to re-live that time in his life, nor do I think he has much use for accolades or other acknowledgments of what he did there. In that regard, I think we were lucky that he agreed to be in this documentary, and I hope you all get a chance to see it and to fully understand what he accomplished.
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Post by strikemaster on Mar 13, 2012 18:23:32 GMT 12
G'day, this sounds very interesting, will it be aired in Australia?
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Post by lostairmendirector on Mar 13, 2012 18:48:40 GMT 12
No plans for Australia yet, but hopefully a network there will take interest. By chance, it's an Australian who wrote Phil Lamason's Wikipedia page, and he did a great job on it.
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Post by Dave Homewood on Mar 13, 2012 18:51:17 GMT 12
Welcome lostairmendirector, it's great to have you here. I'm sure we'll all be discussing the documentary after it airs so it's great that you're here to answer queries. Thanks for making this documentary. I heard about what happened to these men a couple of years back when my colleague who has been filming WWII veterans with me met him. He had tried to convince Mr Lamason to take part in our project but he was not keen. So I'm really glad that you were able to record his story first hand. Were you able to get him to talk about his wartime career before being shot down on film - even if it's not used in this particular doco?
Also, is your grandfather still alive? All of them must have been incredibly brave men.
Lastly, how did you manage to find this thread? Did you happen on it by chance or have you been a forum reader for a while? Cheers!
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Post by lostairmendirector on Mar 13, 2012 19:05:33 GMT 12
Dave - The thread actually popped up via a Google Alert that I have running for anything that mentions the film's title.
My grandfather is still alive and kicking. Thanks for asking. He turns 90 in a few months. His name is Easy Freeman, for when you see the film. All seven of the airmen who appeared in the film are still alive and well. Some can even still travel; we are screening the film in Weimar, Germany (a few kilometers from Buchenwald) next month and one of the American airmen is going with me to the screening.
I did get some information on Lamason's time in the military before being shot down, how he joined up, etc., but our time was limited and we focused mainly on the incident surrounding his capture and time in Buchenwald.
It's night here in the US, but I'll check back in "tomorrow," and I'm especially looking forward to thoughts on the film after it airs.
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Post by Dave Homewood on Mar 13, 2012 19:12:51 GMT 12
Thanks for that. Wow, the screening in Weimar will be a very interesting event for you, good luck with that.
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Post by lostairmendirector on Mar 14, 2012 16:49:19 GMT 12
Here's a piece that a news show in NZ did back in November when we did a public screening at a theater in Wellington:
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Post by littlegreyrabbit on Mar 17, 2012 22:08:52 GMT 12
Does Phil Lamason discuss in any detail his claim that the airmen were slated for execution?
This is not mentioned by the earlier detailed accounts - eg The White Rabbit by Bruce Marshall or The Theory and Practice of Hell by Eugen Kogon. Both these works deal extensively with the plight of the secret agents who were executed in Buchenwald and mention the presence of the airmen but give no indication that they were ever slated for execution.
I was wondering if this was a later embroidery that was introduced, perhaps in connection with the push for the KTB club for compensation.
Anyway, if anyone knows the basis for this claim I would be interested.
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Post by lostairmendirector on Mar 18, 2012 12:10:29 GMT 12
Does Phil Lamason discuss in any detail his claim that the airmen were slated for execution? This is not mentioned by the earlier detailed accounts - eg The White Rabbit by Bruce Marshall or The Theory and Practice of Hell by Eugen Kogon. Both these works deal extensively with the plight of the secret agents who were executed in Buchenwald and mention the presence of the airmen but give no indication that they were ever slated for execution. I was wondering if this was a later embroidery that was introduced, perhaps in connection with the push for the KTB club for compensation. Anyway, if anyone knows the basis for this claim I would be interested. Yes, Phil Lamason and the other airmen talk about this in the film that airs tonight. Phil says that after the British SOE agents were killed, one of his inside sources in Buchenwald's underground groups told him that Lamason's group was next. After the war, one of the authors of 168 Jump Into Hell supposedly found the German document(s) that listed the date that they were to be executed (or at least the date that it would begin, as these things were usually carried out in shifts based on how many could be handled in a day). I have not seen that document, but on their personal Buchenwald files, which I have copies of, it is stamped "not to be transferred to any other camp." Make of that what you will, but it appears that Buchenwald was not meant to be a temporary stop for them before being moved somewhere else. Lamason says that he kept the revelation that they would be killed a secret from the rest of his group because he was beginning to worry about the mental states of a few of his men, and he didn't want any individuals doing anything reckless that could get them all killed faster. Most of the group didn't know about the execution order until a reunion that Phil attended in the 1980's, where he told them.
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Post by littlegreyrabbit on Mar 18, 2012 15:51:50 GMT 12
I am not in New Zealand so I won't be able to watch it - and it doesnt look of sufficient quality to justify getting the DVD.
My interest is more in the alleged fate of the SOE agents (solely to the purposes of understanding my angle it is my contention that the various SOE agents had probably been executed back in France as illegal combatants - exactly the same way HMG did with German agents caught in France - and those that survived had probably in some way cooperated with the Germans. For reasons of wartime propaganda the SOE wished to conceal this. This relates not just to Buchenwald but other camps as well.) As such my interest in the airmen is only tangential but was partly aroused when I read a Psychological Warfare report released in 1945 stating a number of Allied airmen had been gassed in Buchenwald.
There is nothing sinister about DIKAL. it is like a number of other acronyms, eg
Dikak (i.e. Darf auf kein Aussenkommando) [prisoner] may not be used in outside detachment Dikal (i.e. Darf in kein anderes Lager) [prisoner] may not be sent to another camp Dik-Geh (i.e. Darf in keinen Geheimbetrieb) [prisoner] may not be used in any secret concern Diksko (i.e. Darf in keinen kriegswichtigen Betrieb und nicht auf Transport) [prisoner] may not be used in any essential war concern nor be transported
I can only speculate as to the reason for DIKAL, but it may simply be that the German authorities knew that this group had some value or significance and didn't want them lost from view or split up, which might happen if they were sent off elsewhere for labor to an subcamp or to a factory. As such it doesn't mean that they will never be sent to another camp, but it is not to be done by local initiative or by selection for a quota that has been requested.
It sounds like one of the authors of 168 Jump into Hell is not particularly honest, because it is hard to imagine what type of document he claims to have. And this book was also the first time, as I understand, the Lamason claim appeared in print.
Hence I wondered if he had been verballed by this less than honest author. But you appear to be saying that you have heard Lamason repeat this claim. Which to say the least is rather unfortunate.
It is difficult to guess what would cause Lamason to invent such a claim (if you have correctly represented that you get this claim direct from his mouth). One possibility is that there seems to have been some tension in the group about the filling out of bogus Red Cross forms prior to leaving Buchenwald (bogus forms designed to elicit not particularly significant information by the Germans). Technically POWs werent supposed to be asked to fill out such forms - around 30 of the group refused to fill them out, the rest did. Lamason, as the unofficial leader, recommended filling them out.
Perhaps the supposed execution order was his way of explaining his attitude (it doesn't really need explaining - filling out or not filling out the forms made absolutely no difference to the war). Of course, this cuts both ways - for example if Lamason had REALLY been privy to an execution order and was urging filling out the forms because he was worried about the consequences, then it is impossible to think he would have not brought this up in such circumstances.
He didn't, for the simple reason no such order existed. Had it existed someone like Eugen Kogon would have known about it.
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Post by lostairmendirector on Mar 18, 2012 19:36:05 GMT 12
littlegreyrabbit - Your recent joining of this board for the sole purpose of posting in this thread, your admission that you don't live in New Zealand, and your use of a desperate and unsupported argument that I've heard before, leads me to believe that I have encountered you before in another online forum. You can believe whatever you like. But by your own admission, you haven't seen the film, and you will not see the film, so you don't even know what it is that you are arguing against. Your latest post is made up of claims that have no hard evidence to back them up. I spent two years of my life making this film, and I won't spend another minute defending it against someone who refuses to even watch it. And shame on you for bringing this argument here, of all places.
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Post by flyjoe180 on Mar 18, 2012 19:39:15 GMT 12
It's on in a few minutes. Looking forward to seeing it.
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Post by lostairmendirector on Mar 18, 2012 19:45:23 GMT 12
Thank you, flyjoe. I'm going to "stay up late" tonight to do a little interacting, as this is the televised world premiere of the film.
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Post by jonesy on Mar 18, 2012 19:53:52 GMT 12
I have to record it-the missus want to watch House Will watch it in the morning. Absolutely looking foward to it! And reading the comments of those who watched it tonight.....Sounds like a fascinating tale!
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