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Post by ostinato on Jul 18, 2007 18:28:31 GMT 12
www.parliament.nz/NR/rdonlyres/768888ED-C30D-4770-8C72-30ECC79F775A/57858/DBSCH_SCR_3814_5182.pdf"While the Aermacchis continue to be flown for a few hours a month to keep them in a saleable condition, we understand that it is a Defence Force decision not to use the aircraft for training. The Minister said that the Defence Force is able to use the Aermacchis for
training purposes, but also indicated that this was an operational matter for the airforce" Am i reading what i want to hear or what? Able to use the macchi's for training purposes... why the bloody hell are they just doing an hour every fortnight! Bring back 14SQN!
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Post by phil on Jul 18, 2007 18:38:00 GMT 12
Well that's perhaps a little misleading, the govt actually has to fund those flying hours for the air force to be able to use them, so if the aircraft are flown it has to come out of the existing budget, unless the govt is prepared to spend more, then something else (like pay rises, or SAR missions) will have to go....
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Post by 30sqnatc on Jul 18, 2007 20:04:45 GMT 12
Am i reading what i want to hear or what?
Able to use the macchi's for training purposes... why the bloody hell are they just doing an hour every fortnight! Bring back 14SQN!
Why, what defence output would they be acheiving?
Paul
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Post by phil on Jul 18, 2007 20:56:10 GMT 12
Ummm....pilot training? Or is that way too obvious?
Fleet support would be another. FAC training for the group might be another. Air shows - the ideal recruiting tool that one. The things they used to do.
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Post by ostinato on Jul 18, 2007 21:19:00 GMT 12
Pop over to whenuapai and you'll see learjets there every second month doing simulated attack profiles against the navy ships. This is a civie company doing something we could do?
Im sure they'd be kept busy with all the other jobs phil mentioned too!
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Post by Dave Homewood on Jul 19, 2007 8:19:41 GMT 12
Welcome to the forum Ostinato. A very interesting first post. I tend to agree with you and Phil, surely they could be making use of the time the aircraft spend in the air. Even if giving rides to tourists for top dollar like the former-Soviets do would be more useful than now.
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Post by 30sqnatc on Jul 20, 2007 20:02:50 GMT 12
Pop over to whenuapai and you'll see learjets there every second month doing simulated attack profiles against the navy ships. This is a civie company doing something we could do? Im sure they'd be kept busy with all the other jobs phil mentioned too! Using Macchi seems to be a pretty expensive way to achieve a Navy training requirement we apparently only need to undertake every second month. Using that logic we should have an NZDF submarine just to train P-3 crews  Paul |
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Post by phil on Jul 20, 2007 20:28:18 GMT 12
That's a pretty limited view don't you think? Fleet support might only be carried out every second month at present, but who knows? With an NZDF asset to do the job the Navy might be able to carry out more training. Also, on the days not carrying out fleet support they could be doing all the other things the air force can use them for. They would hardly be sitting around doing nothing when the Navy isn't utilising them.
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Post by Dave Homewood on Jul 21, 2007 11:06:25 GMT 12
I'm fairly sure that hiring Lear jets isn't cheap Paul. And considering that the Maachis have to be flown regularly, why not use those hours more productively and incorporate them into military training rather than circuits? It makes sense to me. NZ is paying to fly them for nothing, why not fly them for a reason, and achieve two goals at once?
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Post by skyhawkdon on Jul 22, 2007 8:56:13 GMT 12
In July 2004 the Macchi's had flown over 800 hours since the ACF was disbanded in Dec 2001. It would be interesting to know what the figure is now. None of that flying was allowed to be tasking doing anything productive, it was just "burning holes in the sky" - keeping a few pilots current and the aircraft airworthy. The cost of flying a Macchi would be around $3000 per hour. I bet we pay more than that for the Learjet... you do the maths! But the Macchi does have its drawbacks for fleet support. No radar or radar warning system makes finding a ship difficult unless the ship tells you where it is or has its TACAN beacon turned on - hardly realistic training. The A-4 on the other hand is much more suitable  but that ain't likely to happen.  |
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Post by Dave Homewood on Jul 22, 2007 11:34:18 GMT 12
The Maachi could still be flown in circles burning holes in the sky above an airshow...
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but that ain't likely to happen. 