So Where are all the Ageing Dead Cessna's gonna go.......

[sluf7]

With the world wide AD on ageing Cessna's happening I dare say quite a few will be heading to the Knackers yard. The expense of repair far out weighing economic repair.... As newer LSA and Microlights being cheaper and with better fit out than there ageing counter parts.

While I am here some friends are looking for a dead Cessna to pop in the Garden as a garden ornament so if anyone knows of one in presentable condition let me know.

[sluf7]

I forgot to ADD for Cessna North Island only and Taranaki would be nice altho will look at anything

[baronbeeza]

I am not so sure that much is changing worldwide. There are no AD's yet for the aging aircraft as such, what has happened is that Cessna have chosen to incorporate the SID's inspections in the Service Manuals.
This effectively mandates the inspection in NZ where we are now obliged to use the manufacturer's schedule.
The 'mericans are just continuing with their almost generic 100 Hr and Annuals.

You could almost export an aircraft to the States rather than walk away from it. The difficulty there of course is that it may not be worth much if it can't get through an inspection.

Many Cessnas are fine, the ones that have been corrosion proofed and protected can breeze through the SID's. Their value can only have increased.

There are some about that have been affected by the cheaper generic Part 43 App C inspections, or even worse Sched 5. The past owners could be seen to have taken advantage of the cheaper maintenance on offer, basically to the detriment of the longevity of the machine.

Much the same could be said of the SAIB inspections that should be getting looked at on the other certified types. If the problem areas are looked into and treated or rectified then there really should not be too much of an issue later on.

You are correct in that the older aircraft are requiring more maintenance and yes, some are being parked up.

Many of the hangars are seeing problems encountered on these 'newer' and more modern types though. Stuff never seen before on the classic types, fretting shallow countersinks for example.

I realise time will tell but I'm afraid I have to admit I am still stuck in my own little time warp. It's a bit like the Jap cars, - they will never catch on...

[sluf7]

I concur couldn't really remember if AD's or SIDS ta for clearing that up.

Yes the light stuff like all aircraft do have there issues. I think more and more people are actually looking at fuel consumption now when deciding on what there next ride is. I mean take the Great Planes Sonarei for instance 135kts on 80hp power at 12 lph in the cruise or less. G limits depending on how many ribs ya put in 11plus and the best and most well balanced aerobat.

[lindstrim]

Yet some cessnas that I know of have been a bit of a pain to repair, and even in one case scrapped.

[baronbeeza]

Yet some Cessnas that I know of have been a bit of a pain to work on, in general. Did I say Piper's were easier ?

[chinapilot]

Plenty of people including myself are coping with their aging Cessnas...many are still changing hands and if you have had good annuals done the SIDs aren't too demanding.
They'll be around for a long time yet as everyone doesn't want to go 'plastic', in fact three people I know have bought C180s in the last few weeks.
For the cost of an LSA you can buy a Cessna/Piper/Mooney whatever and put gas into for years and still have change left over.

[sluf7]

Don't get me wrong I like any Plane and if someone gave me a Cessna I would have it like a shot........!!!!!!!!!

It isn't really an issue if you have loved your plane and done everything to keep it Flying AD's SID's etc and tarting them up etc with all that extra finery one can add.

As we all know they are virtually rebuilt over there life time anyhoo.

[baz62]

Yes if maintenance has been "skimped" on(as in only what's required) or little to no preventative maintenance done thats when the horror begins as areas not seen for years reveal bad news.
With my Auster it would be easy to cover something with paint and fabric, especially non structural items but I want to see her last for a long time after I'm gone and ((hopefully) not cause any issues to a future owner.

[kiwithrottlejockey]

What about Cessna 185 ZK-CBS that was purchased new by the Mount Cook group and fitted out as a ski-plane (see the aeroplane on the left in the photograph, which I took in April 2006). I can remember reading an article about that particular aeroplane in NZ/Pacifc Wings many years ago, and about the HUGE number of airframe hours it had accumulated in one of the most demanding alpine flying environments in the world. The article mentioned that Cessna had offered to purchase the aeroplane so they could pull it to bits and see why it was still in such good condition after being thrashed around that turbulent environment for so long, but that Mount Cook Skiplanes were rather attached to it and didn't want to part with their Cessna.

[airspeednz]

I work in a dedicated SIDs Inspection workshop and I can tell you now that there are definitely problems getting these 100 series aircraft SIDs compliant! If the inspection is to be carried out to the letter then there are issues with a number of components and framework. Most of the problems arise due to corrosion. There is no doubt in my mind that the program is well worth carrying out as the cost involved (even for a worst case scenario job) is still far less than the replacement value - assuming you are looking at a newer type. The problem is more to do with the fact that we as an industry, have let the value of these types to slide well below what they are truly worth. I accept that the aircraft has more than probably earned it purchase value a number of times over in the case of a training aircraft. However in many cases this hasn't been factored into the leasing/hiring equation. I am (as a pilot) not suggesting that I want to see huge increases in what it costs to hire an aircraft - regardless of the type, but if one takes a look at the Robinson helicopter as an example, the cost of hiring one is relatively high for basically one reason and one reason alone. Replacement! With the 2200 hr rebuild requirement that has to be factored into the equation (on top of initial purchase costs) Can you imagine what the cost of rebuilding your favorite club or private aircraft would be? Guess what? That is most likely where the SIDs program is heading. And if you are thinking 'its okay - I don't own a Cessna' think again. Any aging aircraft should be (and in time will be) required to undergo this type of program. I hate to say it but that's how I see it. The value of a SIDs compliant Cessna has to be a great deal more than what we are seeing these aircraft (non compliant) being sold for. Sorry if this ruffles a few flight feathers folks. As I say - it's just how I see it. Regards Dave.

[johnnyfalcon]

Totally agree with you

[flyjoe180]

I heard a few days back from a Cessna specialist that Piper are also considering an ageing aircraft programme. Although he wasn't too sure how that would work out as New Piper distance themselves from the old company.

[kiwithrottlejockey]

Now for the multi-million dollar question....

• Is it a Cessna?

[johnnyfalcon]

Well the "file photo" is a Cessna. But surely they have better examples in their "file"...

[FlyingKiwi]

Jul 8, 2013 11:14:50 GMT 12 flyjoe180 said:

I heard a few days back from a Cessna specialist that Piper are also considering an ageing aircraft programme. Although he wasn't too sure how that would work out as New Piper distance themselves from the old company.

Joe, without naming regos, a certain blue striped 172 you'll probably be quite familiar with from your instructing days is having the Sids inspection done at the moment - fortunately the current owner wants to keep it in good flying condition so work is progressing (and nearly finished), but the figure I've heard quoted for the total cost of getting everything done is well into five digits! I'm sure many other owners of similarly aged Cessnas around the place will not be so keen on those sort of bills.

[thomarse]

I think most owners will be relatively aware of what these birds cost at the best of times.

It's well over 20 years since we put a pair of those flexible fuel cells in our C206, and that was darn near five figures back then!

I for one am on the lookout for a Cessna that's not had the SIDs done - as a retirement project. C172K L or M would be my preference.

[flyjoe180]

Well it is good to hear that some of the old machines are being spared from retirement due to lack of funds. What about the aerobat Leo, that was rebuilt from the ground up basically in probably 2005 from memory, has that been inspected with the SIDS programme yet?

[FlyingKiwi]

It's actually been sold Joe - it was doing very little flying since the arrival of the 162s.

[Peter Lewis]

Gone to Mercer.

So what are they using now for basic aeros, Leo?
Wouldn't fancy aerobatics in a 162.