Uniform Query

[pjw4118]

The YAM at Elvington have two items of RNZAF uniform they would like to know more about. Any ideas?

[flyjoe180]

Does it have any names/service numbers in it? That may narrow a search down a bit.

[Dave Homewood]

Could these date from No. 14 Squadron's Cyprus days? I have seen a photo of a Vampire ground crew member on the squadron wearing a slouch hat like this in Cyprus, or Egypt.

[phil82]

We used to have summer and winter uniforms,the example shown being the "KD" example of the summer equivalent of "best blue". As a result of much gazing into their crystal balls down there in Handbrake House,the air force hierarchy always managed to effect the changeover from winter to summer uniform on the coldest day of the year.

[phil]

The Navy still manage to do that.

[camtech]

Aug 12, 2014 12:40:27 GMT 12 Dave Homewood said:

Could these date from No. 14 Squadron's Cyprus days? I have seen a photo of a Vampire ground crew member on the squadron wearing a slouch hat like this in Cyprus, or Egypt.

Possibly Dave, but note the hat badge is the Kings Crown.

The SD uniform of that style was only available to officers and Warrant Officers - us baggies had to be content with KD long sleeved shirt and KD longs, suitably pressed and starched of course.

[davidd]

That warrant officer jacket looks to be of the 1969 - 1981 period (approx) with the RNZAF shoulder titles, and the colour would be the one termed "stone grey" (SG), altghough they weer still frequently referred to loosely as "KD". As for the Aussie slouch hat complete with puggaree and KC badge, I reckon that is a jack up, although RNZAF bods sometimes got into strange habits when on overseas deployments. There is a photo of several of our Berlin Airlift crews, and one (NCO) the flight engineer is wearing the RAF beret of the paeriod, although this was never approved by RNZAF, and he would not have been able to wear it in NZ. Also, as Dave H points out, it is just within the bounds of possibility that Aussie slouch hats MAY have been worn on Cyprus (or even later in Singapore), or 14 Sqdn on armament camps (in Malta?) when the RAF, RAAF and RNZAF were together, that the slouch hat may have seemed an attrractive alternative to the rather useless F/S cap for airmen on tarmac duty. However I have never seen photos of this, although it is only fair to point out that I have not made a study of the subject!
David D

[Dave Homewood]

The slouch hat was not exclusively Australian of course, by any means, and in WWII the British Army and RAF both had them issued in India and Burma. Maybe this belonged to an RNZAF member attached to the RAF in that region?

[30sqnatc]

I don't believe it is an Aussie slouch hat due to the colour and design. Edit - I've checked my Rhodesain Army and Air Force references. I'm absolutely sure the hat is Rhodesian Army pattern. The RhAF routinely deployed Vampire and Hunter sqns into the Middle East as we sent 14 Sqn.

Another option is the Rhodesian African Rifles had a battalion serving in Malaya during the emergency who worn these slouch hats as part of their ceremonial uniform. Perhaps the Warrant Officer worked with them or the Rhodesians had an Army Ground Laision Officer attached to an RNZAF Sqn.
Paul

[Dave Homewood]

A Rhodesian officer attached would not be entitled to wear the RNZAF badge, he'd wear his own Army unit's badge.

Here's the photo i was thinking of, of the No. 14 Squadron RNZAF Groundie at Cyprus


Not turned up on the left side but a very similar hat.

[pjw4118]

Thanks for the replies team. I have put the YAM curator onto this site so he can follow the discussion

[30sqnatc]

Sorry I didn't explain my throught properly. I was thinking they had exchanged hats which was then kept with the RNZAF badge as a monento.

The day I left my teamsite at the end of a deployment we all swapped national badges which I then attached to my Kiwi brazzard as a momento.

No one even blinked an eyelid when I got off in Whenuapai wearing the badges of four countries.

But your picture certainly suggests it was an issued or at least officially tolerated item.

[Dave Homewood]

I wonder if the museum has any information on who donated these items to their collection (or where they purchased them if not donated) that may hold some clues.