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Post by Dave Homewood on Jun 19, 2006 0:19:38 GMT 12
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Post by Dave Homewood on Jun 19, 2006 0:21:39 GMT 12
PS you'll have to copy and paste the whole link into Google to go direct, as the link above has a @ in it so only takes you to the homepage
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Post by corsair67 on Jun 19, 2006 10:03:39 GMT 12
Dave, I'm pretty sure these were all Royal Navy FAA Corsairs that were dumped off a carrier at the end off WW2.
There was an article in Flightpath or Classic Wings (?) about these aircraft quite a few years ago, when someone reckoned they'd found a whole heap of them off the QLD coast intact, sealed in rubber, totally restorable and they were going to start making millions from them...blah, blah, blah: you get the idea.
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Post by Dave Homewood on Jun 19, 2006 10:28:46 GMT 12
Yes I recall that 'recovery' or 'discovery' where they reckoned there were also RNZAF Avengers, which makes some sense. But I'd not heard of an RNZAF Corsair attached to this. I wondered if they'd located a dataplate on this Corsair which had evidence of it being an RNZAF example? I've never heard of our Corsairs being handed to the RN FAA for disposal.
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Post by corsair67 on Jun 19, 2006 10:44:12 GMT 12
While having another look at that website I noticed that the third photo down shows the remnants of an RN roundel on the fuselage remains of that Corsair.
I thought all the flyable RNZAF Corsairs that left the Pacific came back to NZ and were melted down or used for parts in NZ?
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Post by Dave Homewood on Jun 19, 2006 11:10:10 GMT 12
Yes, I think you're right about the fate of the RNZAF's Corsair fleet. There's nothing about the FAA in Warren Russell's excellent tome.
That roundel does look British, but then our Corsairs did revert to that style after the war too. The Japan 14 Sqn ones had them (but they were all burnt in Japan) as did training examples in NZ. I'd think this is a case of mistaken identity on the webmaster's part though, and is FAA
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Post by Dave Homewood on Jun 19, 2006 11:12:05 GMT 12
After coming out of the salt water and then sitting in that dry heat, I wonder how much is left now, and how muh crumbled into aluminium oxide.
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Post by amitch on Jun 19, 2006 11:29:19 GMT 12
I would agree that it's not one of ours as i belive they all came back here, or went to Japan. Having said that, one or two may have gone elsewhere. At the end of the war, bringing aircraft home wasn't the top priority.
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Post by Bruce on Jun 19, 2006 11:37:34 GMT 12
That Roundel is a C1 roundel, which according to the rnzaf.hobbyvista.com 14 sqn page was only applied to one machine, NZ5632 in Japan. As such it would have been destroyed there. It is more likely to be an FAA machine - the FAA museum has just completed an interesting restoration of a corsair with the same type of roundels - displayed in the original paint, complete with all the weathering and scuff marks etc.
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Post by corsair67 on Jun 19, 2006 19:00:50 GMT 12
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Post by Bruce on Jun 20, 2006 10:14:21 GMT 12
yep the FAA museum Corsair is awesome - a true time capsule. Note the position of the fuselage roundel is further forward than the RNZAF machines, where the roundel was positioned over the USN star and Bar. this is the same position that the roundel on the Noosa wreck is in, more evidence that it is an FAA machine.
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Post by steve on Jun 21, 2006 2:19:24 GMT 12
Some years ago I researched at National Archieves in Wellington the intact wreck of a Corsair that crashed in the Hauraki plains swamp....very difficult access...Are the remains still there like the hudson wreck still present opp the Auckland North Harbour Bridge? (still worth a visit at low tide with gumboots!)
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Post by Peter Lewis on Jun 21, 2006 21:26:32 GMT 12
Corsair NZ5320 - W/off after f/l into Piako swamp 28Sep44 ex-Ardmore. Pilot P/O Peter C Shepard It is still there - many have tried to find it, with absolutely no luck at all.
No RNZAF Corsairs went to the FAA or were dumped at sea, although some crashed/ditched into it. Makes sense, as all of these aircraft came directly from the USA, with no British involvement (unlike many of the P-40s).
Several Avengers and Walrus did go to/return to the FAA and, in the case of the Avengers, did meet a watery end.
The Hudson (NZ2024) stalled in low-level turn on landing aproach onto Whenuapai runway 21 25Jan43 and crashed into Waitemata Harbour. The corroded remains are clearly visible at low tide from the upper harbour bridge, though I would think hardly recognizable as anything but a bit of junk after 63 years of salt water immersion.
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Post by Dave Homewood on Jun 21, 2006 21:53:29 GMT 12
I had the same impression Peter of the Hudson, and my own attempt to go and have a look in 1991 while I lived at Hobsonville proved impossible as the mud was so bad you went up to your hips.
However recently two seperate people have said to me they've been and had a close inspection and it's all reasonably intact!
Hairy (a member here) is one of them and while he was visiting me last weekend we discussed it, and he said he climbed inside and was even able to move the control column, etc.
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Post by Dave Homewood on Jun 21, 2006 21:57:50 GMT 12
Back to Corsairs, Peter do you have any details on the Corsair that was found by the Army well after the war in a big field of gorse near Ardmore? Apparently it was ditched there, but too difficult to retrieve due to the thick gorse which went for acres. I'm unsure if the pilot survived or not. My Dad told me the Army was crashing around in the gorse in Bren Gun carriers in the late 1940's or early 50's, and found the plane.
As the whole area has been developed it won't still be there, iin fact I think Dad said the army removed it, but I'm not certain of that.
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Post by steve on Jun 22, 2006 2:26:30 GMT 12
thanks flynzl for your update in regards to the Hudson crash...My research (P Cookes defending NZ) stated it was on a hobby approach however whenuapi make more sense...whatever...back in yhe early 90s a group of aviation enthusiates inc myself reached the remains...rather tricky as the mud would go waist deep in parts!....What i remember is the remains of one wing only...and we all thought from the size of the intact wheel that it was to large to be a Hudson...just impressions...and the wing was very intact..really exciting explorations...makes me wonder how much is buried well into the seabed? As for the piako crash landing...it all appears to be on private land ...and a very large swamp...from what you say....i am guessing ... the entire corsair is still there under water which matches what i read at national achieves ...from letters of the 1970s...for recovery rights etc to govt...I do recall over the years some reasearch groups exploring recovering a very wet but intact corsair to no avail....very interesting treasure hunt!
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Post by Peter Lewis on Jun 25, 2006 11:45:59 GMT 12
I can speak from personal observation that the wreckage of NZ2024 is just about where you turn onto finals for runway 21 at Whenuapai using a northerly circuit. I see it there every time that we use 21. During the time Hobsonville and Whenuapai were both operational, normal practice was a northerly circuit for Whenuapai (left hand for 03, right hand for 21) and a southerly circuit for Hobsonville - otherwise there was the distinct possiblity of a very loud and distressing bang! The same circuit directions are now usually (but not always) used at Whenuapai owing to the build up of housing in the Hobsonville marina area (musn't disturb the locals). I have not closely investigated the Hudson wreck, but I have my doubts as to the current integrity of the structure - the attached photo was taken in 1988, and it hasn't improved since then. Just for interests sake, Lockheed Hudson Mk III NZ2024 arrived in NZ on 'Waiotapu' 29Sep41, BOC Hobsonville soon after, so it didn't have a very long life - just over a year.
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Post by steve on Jun 26, 2006 2:21:53 GMT 12
Thanks..for that info...and excellent picture...I can only speak from my experiece out in the soft mud in the 1980s....what i explored was exactly what you see in the picture....where is the rest of the aircraft??...under the soft mud ...and why was this section not removed ...if other parts were....Quite fasinating in 2006 the wing section of this ww2 crash is still present in our upper harbour!....Any info or pics of the C87 crash with Jap exchange prisioners on board opp whenuapai village/herald island 1943 i believe...........I have the complete hard copy of the USAAF B17e crash report at whenuapai that i should post...not sure about national archieves disclosure rules etc?
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Post by p40fanatic on Apr 28, 2007 0:06:23 GMT 12
Hey dudes, ooh I love old wrecks! Unfortunately the Hudson pic no longer appears, is there any chance you could repost it? I'd be keen to see other folks' wreck pics, such as the Electras up on Ruapehu and Richmond, anything Kaimai, P-40s etc. Amazing stuff to see.
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Post by Peter Lewis on Apr 28, 2007 18:00:39 GMT 12
Image reposted. Wreck still visible well clear of the new bridge at low tide (totally covered at high tide).
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