Marshall of the RAF Sir Cyril Newall

[Dave Homewood]

Before and during the early period of WWII, including the crucial Battle of France and Battle of Britain, Sir Cyril Newall was the Chief of Air Staff for the Royal Air Force, and his leadership during this time, alongside Dowding, was seen as important and decisive.

In February 1941 he and his wife moved to New Zealand where Sir Cyril took up the post of Governor General.

I wonder, had the case been in 1942 if the Japanese Zeroes and bombers had suddenly appeared in New Zealand skies and an attack or attempted invasion taken place, would Newall have still had power to step in as an Air Force leader and control the RNZAF? Or would he have to have remained to one side and have no direct say in how the RNZAF was organising the defence? Did his rank of Marshall of the RAF (the highest rank there is in the Air Force structure) still have merit? Was he still an active airman, with jurisdiction? You see photos of him at NZ functions in his uniform. And if so did he have the right to lead the RNZAF in time of crisis, either as an airman or as representative of the King?

[komata]

An interesting question. FWIW,as 'Representative of Hs Majesty George VI, King of Great Britain and Northern Ireland. Emperor Of India and the colonies of the British Empire and its Dominions' (etc. etc. etc.), Sir Cyril was in effect George VI at a local level.. As such, he would have been consulted about the events that were occurring on that level, and be kept in the loop in respect of local political actions. he was, after-all the local 'King'. All information he received would have been passed-on the his 'masters' in London. He would also have been consulted for his 'tactical' knowledge, his advice being sought as to the best appropriate means to deal with the problem as outlined above. Whether or not he would have taken command of the RNZAF would have depended-upon the actions of the New Zealand Government (specifically the War Cabinet), who would have, in turn, taken guidance from Whitehall. If the NZ Govt. decided that Newall was suitable, a War Emergency Regulation would have been quickly passed, formalising (legalising) the appointment. Due to local equipment inadequacies however, I would suggest that he could only have been able to do so much; Vildebeests / Vincents, Hawker Hinds, Airspeed Oxfords and Lockheed Hudsons were not exactly in the forefront of aviation and just a tad less than modern...

As I said, FWIW. It's an interesting question.

[Dave Homewood]

The Hudsons were very modern and would have done very well against a Japanese fleet off the NZ coast. Had troops landed I also think the Vildebeest and Vincent crews would have done some good work with night bombing,just as they did in Malaya. It was the daytime attacks that were the demise of them.

It's known that Newall did not get on well with PM Peter Fraser, it would have been an interesting one if he felt Fraser was making the wrong moves given Newall's real experience in defending Britain and Fraser's huge lack of such, being a conscientious objector in the first war.

[isc]

I wonder if there was some reason, ie incompatablity with someone in Britain that saw him shipped out to NZ to get him as far away as possible, there were some major rivalries in the services. isc

[Dave Homewood]

He was possibly just due to retire from the RAF and took the opportunity offered. Dowding had already retired when the war began and they called him back, luckily.

[isc]

Was he the one who addressed the armed forces as men and boys of the Army and Navy, and gentlemen of the Airforce. It was a GG around that time, and it did cause some friction among the troops. 

I did a bit of a search: After building up the RAF with increased Spitfire and Hurricane production, he was "sacked" just after the Battle of Britain, after an argument with Lord Beaverbrook over aircraft production and repair. Churchill then had him posted to NZ as Govenor General. Yes he did make the above speech, and also didn't make himself over popular with the government.  He had no influence or attachment to the RNZAF.  after the war he was made a Baron, while other high ranking RAF officers were made Viscounts(a higher rank in the peerage).   isc

[Dave Homewood]

Yes that was him that singled out the Air Force as gentlemen,and rightly so. The poor Air Force boys paid dearly for that one comment, they were forever more known by the Army as The Blue Orchids.

[John L]

Dad met him when he was visiting the troops in the Islands and didn't have particularly kind things to say about him - thought of him as a typically "foppish" English toff type......as opposed to meeting "Bull" Halsey and he and his mates being given a bottle of Scotch!

[camtech]

Sir Cryil Newall after Pacific tour, in front of the Lodestar used (RNZAF):
Sir Cyril Newall Pacific tour return 1943 by Les Billcliff, on Flickr
First 4 unidentified, Sir Cyril, Wing Commander J Adams, Major Holland-Martin (ADC), ?, Earle Andrew, photographer.
The photo says 1943, but the Neg No. is 3139/ /44.

[Dave Homewood]

Regarding the above photo, this comes from the EVENING POST, dated 23 NOVEMBER 1943

ISLANDS VISIT

GOVERNOR-GENERAL

TROOPS IN FORWARD AREAS

His Excellency the Governor-General (Sir Cyril Newall), accompanied by Major C. J. Holland-Martin, A.D.C., has returned to Wellington from a fortnight's tour in the South Pacific. He visited Fiji and forward areas in the South Pacific war area, where he saw New Zealand Service personnel under operational conditions.

The following dispatch has been received from an N.Z.E.F. official war correspondent covering his Excellency's tour:—
Sir Cyril Newall visited New Zealand servicemen as far north as Vella Lavella and the Treasury Islands Group during the tour of forward Pacific zones which he has just completed. His Excellency was away from New Zealand for a fortnight, in which time he covered many thousands of miles to see in operational conditions units of the Dominion's Navy, Army, and Air Force fighting in and round the Solomons area.

On his way north, his Excellency visited Fiji, where he saw the Makogai leper settlement, which is supported generously by New Zealand contributions and is treating many patients from New Zealand's dependencies, and the central medical school at Suva, a training ground for native medical practitioners.

His tour of the Armed Forces opened at a South Pacific base of the Third New Zealand Division, where he inspected reinforcements at their training depot and personnel and installations at base units. His Excellency spent several hours with hospital patients, talking with casualties evacuated from the front lines.

Members of the Women's Auxiliary Army Corps and New Zealand girls working for Allied military officials also had an opportunity of meeting the Governor General.

IN THE SOLOMONS.
In company with Major-General Barrowclough, commander of the N.Z.E.F. in the Southern Pacific, Sir Cyril visited the forward elements of the division on islands of the Solomons group, where he met and spoke to almost every man of the force. His Excellency showed keen interest in areas where the New Zealanders have recently been fighting. On Treasury, his Excellency saw a Japanese prisoner brought in by a New Zealand patrol. At Vella Lavella, he invested New Zealanders with awards won during the recent campaign on that island.

In company with Commodore Wallingford, Air Officer Commanding Southern Pacific Islands, and Air Commodore Buckley, his Excellency spent several days with R,N.Z.A.F. personnel. His visit to operational airstrips coincided with a period of heavy attacks on enemy airfields and shipping in the Bougainville area, and Sir Cyril saw formations of New Zealand fighter aircraft on their way to and returning from escort and strafing sorties. He spent some time in a fighter pilots' "ready" hut, talking to the men who were about to take off.

His Excellency learnt with pleasure of the high standard of the work done by ground crews of New Zealand squadrons, which kept almost 100 per cent of their aircraft available for operations every day. The New Zealand fighter wing's tally of enemy aircraft at the time of Sir Cyril's visit was 57.

At an advanced Royal New Zealand Navy base, his Excellency inspected ships of a flotilla which has operated in Pacific waters for many months. He was accompanied by Commander A. D. Holden, and during his visit presented Long Service Medals to three of the flotilla's personnel.

[angelsonefive]

I think Newall's " gentlemen of the Air Force " remark was an attempt at humour that fell flat.

[komata]

Concerning 'Gentleman of the ROYAL New Zealand Air Force' (Note the emphasis).

Within my family two relatives were (wartime) 'Navy (one RN, one RNZN) and one NZ Army. My father was RNZAF.

The Army and Navy 'uncles' were present at the parade and the Newall comment wasn't well received , to the extent that 40 YEARS after it occurred, the subject could still cause acrimony.

However, on the positive side (and for all RNZAF personnel who might read this), Sir Cyril's announcement DOES mean that all and any members of the RNZAF, whether currently-serving or not (and including Civi's I believe; Sir Cyril didn't specify otherwise), can quite legitimately call themselves 'GENTLEMEN',and sight the Newall comment as complete (and legal) justification for so-doing.

Although for some odd reason, Navy and Army don't quite see things the same way, if the Governor General (as HM's representative) has made the statement, it carries the full weight of 'Royal' Authority...

So 'Gentlemen' of the RNZAF you are all entitled to be (Sir Cyril said so )

(I thought you might like to know).

[Dave Homewood]

Despite many veterans telling me about that infamous speech and the after effects it had, I have never been able to find the date it was made, nor the venue, and nor the actual contents. I wrote once to the office of the Governor General to see if old speeches were retained for historical reasons and they had no record of it. Did your uncles state where it took place, Komata?

[errolmartyn]

I am reminded of the following exchange:

Female friend to her upstairs flatmate: "There's an officer and gentleman downstairs to see you."

Flatmate: "That's great. Tell them both to come up."

Errol

[pjw4118]

Yes indeed Errol . And Dave the rankle still remains.I prefer the version " soldiers of the Army , sailors of the Navy and GENTLEMEN of the Air Force." A few years ago at a meeting a rather pompous Brigadier asked why our Air Force vets should be given special treatment , so I slipped that quote in. He puffed a bit so I gave him the thought that all our men were volunteers and had to pass an exam to get in . If they were dumb and failed , it was the trenches for them. He puffed quite heavily then , but as a civvie I was immune.

[Dave Homewood]

just a note on the original topic of this thread, I saw a newsreel film yesterday online of Newell being sworn in, and the narrator said he was sworn in as the Governor General and Commander-in-Chief. I think it's interesting that the second title is often forgotten. Does that title still go with the job today?