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Post by ianbw12 on Jan 8, 2009 15:52:24 GMT 12
Hi,
That thread on the Harvard has got me thinking about the Occidental kit of the Texan T6G lurking downstairs...
I realise that the kit doesn't have the front MG fitted, but is that the only difference if one wants to build an RNZAF Harvard?
I notice that some of the early Harvards don't seem to have the MG mod too...
Anyone out there tried to build an NZ Harvard or even just done some research into this, please?
Cheers,
Ian
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Post by agalbraith on Jan 8, 2009 16:31:43 GMT 12
Hi Ian
How are you mate? I think from memory it also needs the extra framing added on the canopy, but that shouldnt be too difficult.
The old Monogram/Revell nose insert panel is a perfect fit on the Occidental kit. I may have a spare....will have to look.
One thing that I noticed is that the engine cowl isnt right. It dosent have the taper and the opening looks too small at the front. I used (believe it or not) a Tamiya Corsair spare cowl and cut it down to the right length and re-scribed the different panel lines on. The taper and opening are waaaay better now and more importantly when you offer it up to the fuse it "looks" right. I am sure there are other minor details, but best check refs.
To me somehow the old Monogram kit looks fantastic still after all these years. I have started the Occidental kit befor I could track down a Monogram one, but I reakon combining the 2 you will get an awesome RNZAF one.
I am suprised Hasegawa or Tamiya hasnt done this famous trainer!
Mmm all this talk makes me want to get my kit out again...............
Hope this helps a little
Cheers
Anthony
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Post by Dave Homewood on Jan 8, 2009 21:35:37 GMT 12
I have the Monogram kit which I completed but then decided to strip the paint and do it again (this is about fifteen years ago). I still intend to repaint and reassemble it someday as it is a great kit.
I've never yet had the chance to see an Occidental kit though. Is there any chance of some photos please Ian as you make the kit? And I'd love to see your's too Anthony, it may inspire me to dig mine out again. Did every single RNZAF Harvard get the nose gun fitted or just the ones in the OTU's and FAFAI units?
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Post by ianbw12 on Jan 9, 2009 12:15:49 GMT 12
Thanks guys, Hi Anthony, nice to hear from you! I remember now it was you that showed me the Monogram nose gun piece on the Occidental kit! How are you going? If I could build more than 2 kits a year I'd be happy! Not sure about removing the cowling from the Tamiya Corsair though- seen the price of kits lately!?  Cheers Dave- I'll certainly post pics when (if) I start building! Currently have a Huey on the go (pics soon) and the Hasegawa Corsair, being built just 'for fun'... Cheers, Ian |
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Post by silverfox on Jan 10, 2009 8:30:30 GMT 12
Oddly, I'm just building an Occidental Harvard from the later issue with both the T-6 and Harvard canopies. I'll post some pictures when we get some decent day light up here.
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Post by baz62 on Jan 12, 2009 15:48:33 GMT 12
I don't know if the guns were actually fit to all the MK2a and MK3 Harvards but they all certainly had the mounts and hardware for them in the nose and the startboard wing. When NZ1087 came to the museum we fit her with guns and hung some dubious looking rockets under the port wing and small practice(?) bombs under the starboard wing. Actually heres the cockpit view of the nose gun. You can just see the breech(breach?) top right. And at the top you can see the base of the gunsight.  And outside you can just make out the "rockets and bombs".  Can you still get the Occidental or similar kit or is it out of production now? |
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Post by 30sqnatc on Jan 12, 2009 22:26:55 GMT 12
Actually heres the cockpit view of the nose gun. You can just see the breech(breach?) top right. And at the top you can see the base of the gunsight. No not the breach, that is at the body end of the barrel. What you can see is the backplate. The cylindrical protrusion is the recoil buffer which is adjustable to buffer the final stages of the rearward movement of the breech block. Paul |
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Post by Dave Homewood on Jan 12, 2009 23:15:00 GMT 12
An interesting photo. I wonder, when the gun was fired would the cockpit have filled with cordite smoke?
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Post by silverfox on Jan 13, 2009 6:22:54 GMT 12
Baz62,
Occidental went tango uniform back in 2003. Their moulds were sold to Italeri and occasionally re-surface, The Havard has never been re-issued but the T-6 has, without the Havard style glazing.
Harvard boxings are pretty rare on this side of the world. Two of us scoured the UK Nationals and only found a Hobbycraft re-issue.
Did the Red Checkers machines carry the wing gun, the photos I have don't seem to show it but....
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Post by Bruce on Jan 13, 2009 8:07:30 GMT 12
when i was at Gulf Aeronautics we looked after NZ1099, belonging to Jim Pavitt and Charles Darby. the aircraft was restored to accurate Gunnery trainer config, including the flipover rear canopy and swivelling rear seat. This would be the last armed RNZAF Harvard, as Charles brought in his collected weaponry for installation one day. we installed the cowl gun (as per picture) the rear gun on swivel mount, the wing gun, gun camera, bomb racks, flare pistol etc.
In service, according to Charles, the aircraft were only only fitted with the guns if a. they were dedicated weapons trainers or B. they were carrying out specific weapons training. certainly the Red Checkers would not have carried guns - by the time the Checkers teams were operating, weapons training would have been carried out on Vampires and later Strikemasters. When not armed, a cap was fitted over the cowl and wing gun apatures, although most retained the wing gun cartridge collector bulge under the RH wing. gunsights remained in place in most instances. guns could be installed in about 30 minutes if required.
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Post by Dave Homewood on Jan 13, 2009 10:05:08 GMT 12
I think postwar only the TAF and FAC Harvards were armed.
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Post by harvard1041 on Jan 15, 2009 7:48:35 GMT 12
Hi Dave
Actually the 0.30 cal wing gun was used on Wings courses up thru the early 1960s at least ...as were rockets...at Birdlings Flat.
I really don't know if the RNZAF ever used the cockpit 0.30 cal however...as someone said here, a bit of a stink etc....and it is realy really important that the gun interruptor worked well...
At some stage, the RNZAF took out the US N-4B gunsight and put in British ones as well - that big oval shaped cutout in the glareshield.
...any old Armours out there ?
Rgds
Hvd1041
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Post by kiwichappers on Jan 15, 2009 8:56:48 GMT 12
We had Harvards visit us when on excerise in 1969 from Burnham Camp at 'Little Malaya' and they flew some low passes firing what I hoped were blanks. They also dropped a few flour bombs which must have been in storage a long time as the one that hit our jeep did an awful lot of damage as it was rock hard which meant a long walk home for us. Not impressed with 'fly boys' at the time as I recall.
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Post by Dave Homewood on Jan 15, 2009 12:35:32 GMT 12
Don't mock, those flour bombs are NZ's only defence now!
Amazing to hear one put a Jeep out of action!
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