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Post by rone on Feb 16, 2017 19:25:04 GMT 12
My response to the last two posts. My initial post was purely a thought I had regarding using a C130 as a fire bomber. My comments re an "Alloy Tank and Fittings, no great expense" I stand by because simply that is what MAFFS is. The cost relative to having a dedicated aircraft built as a stand alone fire bomber is comparatively small in comparison. I have been involved with pressure vessel systems so I do know they are not that complex. And yes a 24hour time frame is needed from start to go, but please remember these two fires, which merged into one have been burning for almost a week. If a Herc. can overfly Pitcairn Island and drop a bulldozer surely the Port Hills would not be as difficult. And yes the nozzle pictured is of the MK2 version which empties out through the side doors. There are pictures on that site also of the Mk1 version that unloads out the rear. I did not reckon on it all getting so technical and beaurocratic. The main point is really that if a means of carrying a larger quantity than a helicopter is/was available and used then 11 houses would possibly still be standing.
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Post by rone on Feb 16, 2017 16:20:34 GMT 12
And this is not the first major fire in NZ in the time of the Herc's being here.
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Post by rone on Feb 16, 2017 16:18:15 GMT 12
baron, may I suggest you take the advice offered above and Google "modular aircraft fire fighting systems" to see just how the tank system is fitted to C130 aircraft. You just might learn something new.
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Post by rone on Feb 16, 2017 15:39:57 GMT 12
Thank you Errol C, seems this old me came up with the idea 10 years after the USofA. I just knew it was feasible. To be able to dump nearly 3000US gallons in 5 seconds is way more practical than a chopper. 8minutes turnaround is fast. Landing and takeoff added on, but in the case of Christchurch total turnaround time would surely be less than 30minutes.
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Post by rone on Feb 16, 2017 15:09:58 GMT 12
I appreciate the fact that water alone is not discharged, in my first post, 5th line down Fire Retardant is mentioned.
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Post by rone on Feb 16, 2017 14:07:32 GMT 12
Seems like I stirred things up a bit. "Thor" does not empty via the rear door, Bristol Freighters have been history for a few years now, a C130 can carry more than 1tonne, in fact quite a bit more. I looked at this from an engineering point of view, I am first to admit I am not an aircraft engineer, just an old fashioned engineer with 60plus years of experience. An OVAL alloy tank with baffles is super strong, think road going fuel tankers as an example. As I stated earlier, a couple of large diameter pipes draining out the rear will deliver a large amount of water in a short time. At least I got some critical response which appreciate.
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Post by rone on Feb 16, 2017 9:42:25 GMT 12
Good to see a response. But there is no need to hire an aircraft from o/seas. all that is required is an alloy tank and fittings. No great expense. As for C of G, that must also be a consideration when dumping cargo via parachute out the back.
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Post by rone on Feb 16, 2017 9:06:45 GMT 12
I have been thinking, (as did Richard Prebble), in view of Global Warming and NZ's hotter, drier Summers, is it not time for NZDF to consider using a Hercules as a fire Bomber. Before everyone shoots my idea down, think about it first. Helicopters are limited in the amount of water they can carry, I do not know the load capacity of a Herc but it is sure far more than a Helo. For not a great amount of dollars a alloy tank could be made that would fit into a Hercules to carry a very large amount of water plus retardant. If cargo, including bulldozers (as at Pitcairn Island) then dropping a few thousand gallons of water out the back door via a couple of large diameter pipes would be no sweat. I know they need a runway with access to water, but in the case of Christchurch, there is everything in place. I reckon the 8 home owners would have been grateful to see a large volume of water dropping from the sky. While monsoon buckets do a great job normally, when the fire is as intense as when say a large house or pine trees are burning, the heat generated causes a large proportion of the water to evaporate basically. So is this a sound idea that has merit or not.
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Post by rone on Feb 13, 2017 14:01:44 GMT 12
Posted on the General Board
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Post by rone on Feb 13, 2017 14:00:07 GMT 12
Peter, the post you refer to was " Were there Kiwi Code Breakers in WW11, Dave Homewood posted the comment that HMNZS Irirangi closed in 1990, posted 31January 2017
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Post by rone on Jan 21, 2017 9:29:43 GMT 12
I read a short article in today's Herald, accompanied by a video of Air Chathams DC-3 after landing at Wanganui. While the video was noting startling, the written article once again shows the pathetic standard of reporters lack of knowledge and education. The reporter was clearly informed the aircraft was powered by two piston engine motors, each of 1250HP. Obviously not able to read her own shorthand, the plane must be the only Dakota in the world powered by 240HP engines.
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Post by rone on Jan 19, 2017 20:48:11 GMT 12
Aha, commonsense usually prevails. Everywhere in any town or location always has an area of parallel parking to cater for the people towing something behind their vehicle. But there will always be those who need to park as near as possible to the shop of choice because they are too tired to walk. A common complaint with the younger set these days.
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Post by rone on Jan 19, 2017 13:11:30 GMT 12
Bugger, up until 20 odd years ago I did have a complete radome, outer bakelite? casing and internals. All I have now are 2 Dural tubes being used as oar shafts. It came from one of the PB2B Cats cut up at Hobby late 50's.
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Post by rone on Jan 19, 2017 12:38:27 GMT 12
After viewing the video I was reminded of when beaurocrats in this country had brains and commonsense. The vehicles angle parked backed in was fairly common in many NZ towns until soon after the war. To any present day doubters that think it is a silly way to park, I suggest go to many places in Australia and see how the traffic flows with back-in parking. Off topic I know but back then officialdom knew a bit more than todays lot.
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Post by rone on Dec 28, 2016 21:04:29 GMT 12
Dave, a small correction if I may, Armstrong Whitworth made aircraft, Armstrong Siddeley Motors (ASM) made engines, hence the Cheetah series of aero engines are Armstrong Siddeley Cheetah 1X, X. The first picture following the Oxfords being scrapped, where you say you do not know what the parts are, it is an Oxford Instrument panel I believe. The siamesed tachometers are the clue.
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Post by rone on Dec 19, 2016 16:06:43 GMT 12
If my memory is correct, Norfolk Island operated their own aircraft until the service was taken over by Air NZ. There was pictures of the a/c in the NI terminal building. I think they used a 737 and when ANZ took over ANZ initially used that a/c until they started using the 320.
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Post by rone on Nov 20, 2016 20:38:22 GMT 12
With reference to the US Camp at Waikaraka Park, I have memories of going into the camp at the end of the war when the troops were returning from the islands. All their gear, tents etc. were in large piles and burnt. A few locals were given camp beds and blankets and us young ones were given tins of their K rations, to get the candy that was inside.
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Post by rone on Nov 20, 2016 20:27:51 GMT 12
Peter, thank you for the pictures of the Bunker and the CAC. I served my engineering apprenticeship at the CAC, as did my father and uncle before me prewar. The machine gunfire you refer to was the army proof officers firing on the range up in the trees to the right of the original factory. Many of the trees were still there when I worked there. The white roof building at middle bottom is/was the new factory built early in the war. Two stand alone ammunition factories were also built in Hamilton, one since given to the Maoris, the other factory was demolished recently when Dey St became a part of the bypass. At the entrance to all three factories there was a sentry box situated. Nobody was able to enter or leave without a pass. Do you know if the bunker is still operational at all?. I think I read sometime back that when the ARA stopped using it was going to be dismantled, maybe wrong though.
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Post by rone on Nov 15, 2016 20:18:47 GMT 12
On the first index list below the photo of Waikaraka Park, there is reference to NZ Army Owens Road. Would that be where the underground plotting bunker used by the Air Force and later taken over by Civil Defence. It was if I recall correctly in the grounds of the old Teachers training College. On the same page is a reference to GVP CAC, what is that? is it anything to do with the CAC factory in Mt. Eden? Would be keen to see the pictures of those two sites please.
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Post by rone on Oct 18, 2016 20:19:50 GMT 12
Back in the day when there was a Ministry of Works (MOW) and their predecessor the Public Works Department (PWD), they had a depot at every Defence Force base, until the polly's decided they were not needed anymore. MOW looked after all the maintenance on base, from roading, grass cutting, you name it, they did it, until, I think, a fellow by name of Prebble decided that money could be saved by having contractors tender for the work. As an aside, I used to maintain water pumps on a MP's lifestyle block out from Manurewa. After he was elected to Parliament he found out that the MOW based at Papakura Army camp were at his beck and call to do any and all maintenance on his property. Result?, I was no longer required.
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