A mystery Corsair

[hairy]

Interesting, the picture is very, very similar (at this point I won't say they're the same as I don't have my copy in front of me) to one of the photos in a set of photos that I have have of this aircraft in my collection, it was taken behind the Waikato aeroclub, I even have one shot taken from the aeroclub roof looking down on the aircraft. The copies that I have come from a large collection that I recencently obtained, they belonged to a professional photographer who did sell copies of his photos so it doesn't supprise me that there are other copies out there.

If you don't mind me asking how much did you pay for your copy of the picture on E-bay as I now hold the negatives for this photo (if it is the same, I'm pretty confident) and I have being contemplating a limited run of prints from the lots n' lots of negatives that I got with this collection, if anyone is interested.
This may take awhile before I get 'round to doing it as I am currently working in the South Island for the next month or so, and I live in Auckland and I had only just started cateloging the photos before I left (2500 done, about 3500 left to go, 99% aircraft photos).

[Dave Homewood]

Welcome back to the forum Marcus. It sounds like you have a real goldmine of negatives there mate. In due course I'm sure we'd love to hear if it is the same photo as in your collection, and possibly see a few other angles if yopu're willing to post them.

So did the Hamilton ATC used to be based at Rukuhia back then I wonder?

[Peter Lewis]

I paid $6.99 for the print.

I would guess that the Hamilton ATC would have had rooms in the city, but kept the Corsair at the airfield. It would have been too difficult for the kids to commute weekly to the airfield (very very few, if any, kids had access to cars then) and the logistics of getting/keeping the Corsair in the middle of the city would have been difficult to say the least.

[Dave Homewood]

I agree about the transport for kids to the airfield. But even today where the ATC buildings are situated they could easily have had a Corsair as there is a park on three sides of the building plus they have quite a bit of carpark space. That aside, yes it is most likely to be Rukuhia by the sounds of things.

[Luther Moore]

I dont think it is NZ5623..I have a photo of 5623 and there is no 23 on the cowl.

[Dave Homewood]

What era is your picture from Luther?

[Luther Moore]

It's a FG-1D from 1945..Would it of been painted after the war or am I looking at another Corsair with the same code?

[komata]

(Note: Before I found this thread I posted a similar enquiry about this aircraft on the 'Silver Corsairs' thread')  

Although this thread has not ben active for a while, I am hopeful that someone might have found an answer  in the intervening time-period.

My son has recently (2013) given me a post-war photo of this self-same aircraft, ostensibly taken at Rukuhia and in the same location. It would however seem to have been taken at an earlier time than the image which originally prompted this thread, as the nose is obscured by a rather tatty engine cover (which IMHO is in itself an unusual thing to find on a supposedly 'withdrawn' aircraft)

The machine has the faded blue scheme that the type acquired as a result of its Pacific service, and retains its narrow FF-type markings on the fin.

HOWEVER, its national markings (at least on the fuselage)appear to be of RAF Type C1!! If it is not RAF C.1, then nearest I can find, after checking Warren Russell's book on Corsair Camouflage and markings, would be RNZAF type R-10y. There are no sidebars visible in the vicinity of the roundel. The under-wing marking (Starboard only) is unfortunately obscured, but it also doesn't seem to have the 'side bars' that I would have expected, although as thee wing area is in shadow, this may not in fact be correct. There is also a vertical white 'step-indicator stripe' below the cockpit.

As this seems to be an unusual marking for the type to have carried in RNZAF service, I have carefully checked W. Russell's book, but can find no indication of any NZ-based Corsairs carrying C.1 roundels, the nearest being NZ5632 which was in Japan when it had C.1's put in place.  As has already been noted, it did not return to New Zealand. 

There are no evident unit markings, and the area around the tailplane is either obscured in shadow or has been deliberately over-sprayed to obscure the individual aircraft number. There are no numbers evident on the fin or rudder, and with the nose obscured by the engine cover, no way of establishing if any more details might exist in that area.  An odd detail is that there is no radio mast on the fuselage behind the cockpit canopy.

Over-all, it does seem to be a somewhat confused aircraft.

I have not found copies of 'my' photograph in any books on the RNZAF, and before seeing the photograph which prompted this thread believed that my  photograph was the only one of this particular machine.

We now know that it is aircraft '23' but are we any closer to identifying it specifically?


Thanks in advance.

Komata

[rone]

Just to upset the applecart, nobody has yet mentioned the Corsair that was given to Kings College ATC based at the College, Otahuhu. It was sold for scrap around 1953 from memory. I cannot recall serial number

[Dave Homewood]

Interesting. Was your father the scrap dealer who purchased it Ron?

[rone]

No Dave, although I only know who the first buyer was. There is a story attached to it. The first buyer refused to take delivery as between him inspecting it prior to tendering and turning up to remove it, he found it had lost it's engine. Persons unknown had backed a truck under the front and removed everything including the prop back to the engine frame mountings. There was a rumour, but only a rumour that a certain bloke that had a/c around his property at Rukahia ended up with it. From memory it was pretty well all intact prior to being sold

[camtech]

Kings College Corsair was NZ5634, Inst128. Converted to Inst airframe 1 Feb 1949. Sold by GSB Tender no 5062 8 June 1953. Any further information would be welcome.

[komata]

Wasn't there a black and white Whites Aviation Magazine photograph of this aircraft en-route to Auckland? From memory it was towed with wings folded along State Highway 1. Perhaps someone can unearth a copy for us?

[davidd]

Yes there was a photo of the Kings' College Corsair en route to its new home; this was published in the May 1949 edition of NZ Flying magazine, page 7. Apparently the history of this aircraft is slightly more involved than thought, as the article states that this aircraft was "on loan" to the College for a period of about 3 or 4 months, and "that it is expected that after they (the Kings' College ATC unit pupils) have gained first-hand information on the aircraft, pupils from other schools will probably receive instruction". This Corsair, which looks quite complete, "is brand new, requiring only a few hours work to make it airworthy." I personally think the last statement may be a slight exageration. It was also stated that this Corsair was one of two surplus aircraft at Rukuhia which were involved in a scheme to provide such aircraft to school pupils for instructional purposes, although it is not actually stated that both these aircraft were Corsairs. "The engines, however,have been completely flooded with oil for preservation, and for this reason it covered the distance between Rukuhia and Middlemore by road. The aircraft, which was towed by a tractor, left Rukuhia at dawn, and took the greater part of the day to reach its destination."
David D

[Dave Homewood]

Most of the aircraft at Rukuhia in 1949 still belonged to the Government Stores Board, didn't they? I am sure it was not till that year that they started auctioning them off. The well known RNZAF engineering officer Derm Hurley was the senior engineer there for a few years after WWII with a small team keeping all the inhibited aircraft in great condition in case they needed reactivation. I believe it was 1949 his position there disappeared when they began selling off the aeroplanes.

[Peter Lewis]

1948 seemed to have been the year of the big Rukuhia disposal tender.

For instance: Corsair NZ5201 "Stored at Rukuhia. Sold by WARB tender #1704 to H J Larsen of Palmerston North 2Mar48. Scrapped at Rukuhia" as were so many others.

[Dave Homewood]

OK, but I believe from what Derm told me he and his unit remained till 1949, unless my memory is shot here. Derm was very involved in organising the sales I believe too. This I think would explain why an aircraft is in great condition and inhibited, these aeroplanes were stored reserve, not scrap, at this time.

[Dave Homewood]

By the way, the RNZAF had a team there keeping the stored aircraft in good condition before the war even ended. They took most of the P-40's there in 1945 and they were followed by the Corsairs when the war ended. The team was part of No. 1 Repair Depot before that unit moved after the war's conclusion.

[komata]

Dave:

Re: '...Keeping the stored aircraft in good condition'.

I fear not. My late father was stationed at RNZAF Rukuhia when the aircraft returned from the islands and told me several times throughout the years that he and others were told to go through the assembled aircraft (both bombers and fighters)shortly after they had reached their final standpoint and to put a rifle-but through the instruments, 'to immobilise them as they were of no further use. The Yanks didn't want them back and the government couldn't afford to buy them'. Orders being orders, they did as they were told, albeit reluctantly. 'It seemed a real shame to have to wreck perfectly good aircraft'.

If this was 'keeping the stored aircraft in good condition', then I have to agree with you.

My father was also involved in the dumping of spare parts down into the Mystery Creek gully.

[Dave Homewood]

But at what date did they do that Komata? As well as having talked with Derm Hurley who was the Engineering Officer in charge of the stored aircraft maintenance unit then, I also talked with a couple of others who worked on the unit who also said they had to keep the aircraft tidy (though inhibited) ready for re-use if the need arose of the aircraft were sold. Some of the aircraft were indeed returned to service too, such as the Corsairs for No. 14 Squadron that went to Japan, and some Hudsons that returned to service as ASR aircraft.


Perhaps some of the aircraft were butchered as you tell it, but when? Maybe around 1948?