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Post by flyjoe180 on Dec 6, 2007 8:11:30 GMT 12
Latest from the NZ POlice: Update - Operation Valour
3:17pm 5 December 2007
The scene examination of the Army Museum at Waiouru has been mainly completed today. The Forensic Scientists from the ESR who have assisted the Police with this phase of our enquiry will be returning to Wellington with some of the exhibits located for further forensic examination.
Detective Senior Sergeant Chris BENSEMANN, the Officer in Charge of the enquiry said that a number of useful pieces of information had been located during the forensic examination of the scene, which will be evaluated as to their relevance to our enquiry. He said that the recovered CCTV footage from the scene had been helpful.
The current main focus of the enquiry is the house-to-house canvass of the Waiouru township and Army Camp. The aim of this phase is to identify and speak to all persons who were in Waiouru on Saturday night/Sunday morning to ascertain if they saw or heard anything suspicious or have any information which may assist the Police enquiry to locate the stolen medals and apprehend the offender/s. The New Zealand Army have kindly seconded 20 Military Police Officers to assist in this phase of the Police enquiry so that it can be completed in a timely manner.
Detective Sergeant BENSEMANN said that he believed that there must be someone in the area who had information which would help solve this crime.
Photographs of the stolen medals and biographic details of the recipients will be placed on the Police Internet site later today.
The 0800 information line, 0800VALOUR, has been used by members of the public to pass on information to the enquiry team which has grown to 40 police officers. The enquiry base in the Waiouru Military Camp environs has been provided by the New Zealand Army which is also providing accommodation, meals and other services to the Investigation Team.
Detective Senior Sergeant BENSEMANN said that the level of co-operation by the New Zealand Army and the Museum employees had been outstanding and was a great example of organisations working together to achieve a common goal.
ENDS
For further information please contact:
Detective Dennis O'Rourke
Mobile 027 358-8442
email: Dennis.O'Rourke@police.govt.nz www.police.govt.nz/news/release/3536.html |
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Post by flyjoe180 on Dec 6, 2007 8:14:55 GMT 12
And as an extra slap in the fasce, they are not the only medals to have gone missing: A Christchurch medal dealer says the Waiouru medals that were stolen last weekend are not the only ones to go missing.
Tom Taylor Young has been in the medal business for 35 years. Earlier this year he advertised New Zealand Army service medals for sale, which prompted a visit from the Military Police.
The Military Police were reportedly trying to trace some medals taken from the Defence Department in Wellington and wanted to know where Taylor Young had purchased them from.
Taylor Young had bought them legitimately from a reputable dealership called Chelsea Military Antiques in London.
The collection included New Zealand medals for service in East Timor, Iraq, Afghanistan as well as the Solomon Islands.
Taylor Young emailed the dealership, saying the Defence Force they thought the medals were stolen.
They replied to Taylor Young and said they purchased the medals from a New Zealand around a year ago.
The dealership said the seller had cloth badges, insignia and New Zealand medals which were traded and paid cash for.
Chelsea Military Antiques say the same man had sold medals to other shops in both Britain and in Brisbane.
While the man did not raise suspicions at the time, Taylor Young is adamant that he must be in the Defence Force.
The Defence Force admits that it is missing 12 general service medals from a batch of 4,500 which were struck in 2002.
While no one from the Defence Force would appear on camera, a spokesman admits it was probably an inside job.
Investigators have so far failed to uncover the culprit behind the theft of the medals, but it is another embarrassment for the military that they do not need. www.tv3.co.nz/News/Medaltheftmayhavebeenaninsidejob/tabid/209/articleID/40859/cat/41/Default.aspx |
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Post by flyjoe180 on Dec 6, 2007 8:16:12 GMT 12
I saw the above article on last night's late news, and it seems whoever had obtained these medals, did so before they were even awarded. The rim usually has the recipient's rank and name etched onto it. These were virgin medals, never worn or used. Definitely an inside job you would have (unfortunately) to think.
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Post by Dave Homewood on Dec 6, 2007 10:14:20 GMT 12
The loss of the historic medals is devastating to New Zealanders, but we have to rememebr that it does not diminish anything from the deeds those men carried out to win them. And perhaps one of the positive spin-offs from this is the public is being reminded of those men and their wartime efforts.
I'd still love to see the culprit caught, and dealt to in the manner that the likes of Charlie Upham and Jack Hinton would have seen fit!
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Post by flyjoe180 on Dec 6, 2007 12:14:23 GMT 12
Charge and convict the culprits with treason. What is the penalty for treason now days? It used to be the death penalty until 1989, but I believe that is now no longer an option.
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Post by flyjoe180 on Dec 6, 2007 12:21:55 GMT 12
And you are right there Dave, no theft of medals or decorations can take away what those men were recognised for, their acts of bravery are forever theirs, and part of our military history. The Victoria Cross is not for sale
"The military honours bestowed upon me are the property of the men of my unit as well as myself and were obtained at considerable cost of the blood of this country. Under no circumstances could I consent to any material gain for myself for my services."
Sir Charles Upham
Those words and temperament of character from New Zealand's greatest war hero are ones that his three daughters are having just a tad difficulty living up to. We learn that they have received a million dollar offer from Australia and one worth almost three times that much from a British collector, and have given the New Zealand Government a chance to match it. I suggest the taxpayers of New Zealand cough up the cash because these three have obviously forfeited their right to hang such honour in their house, now that Charles Upham has died (he passed away in 1994). Besides, the price seems to be what the market can bear, since we also learn the other day that the VC of Australia’s most decorated Gallipoli veteran, Captain Alfred Shout, fetched the record price of $1 million (AUS). So I suppose it stands to reason that inheritors of a double VC should get at least double the cash.
Only it doesn’t stand to reason. The Victoria Cross is priceless. It is first in the order of precedence, ranking higher than any order of chivalry, be it the Order of Canada, the Bath, the Garter, be it the Supreme Order of Christ. I submit that if there is one thing worse than cash for peerages, it is cash for VCs. Granted the buyers and sellers of VCs are not, as such, trading in honours (they are not paying to be a VC holder, only to own the VC), but it’s still not keeping in the spirit of the medal’s true value. The Victoria Cross is no mere trinket. The British Commonwealth’s highest award for valour and gallantry “in the face of the enemy” represents the life and blood of nations. It is sacred. It should not be for sale.
King George V felt so strongly about this, he ordered that no matter the crime, no authority could ever strip a man of his VC, commenting that a recipient should still be permitted to wear the decoration even if he were on the gallows. (His Private Secretary stating in a letter the King's view that:"no matter the crime committed by anyone on whom the VC has been conferred, the decoration should not be forfeited. Even were a VC to be sentenced to be hanged for murder, he should be allowed to wear his VC on the scaffold.")
Had he the foresight, Emperor George would no doubt have widened this policy to forbid the auctioning off of VCs too, much as one cannot auction off one’s citizenship. We cannot sell our passport because we do not own it; we are merely passport holders. Ditto for the Victoria Cross. Recipients of the VC are often described as winners or holders of the award, not owners. The comparison is valid, I think, since heroism in the face of a nation’s enemies represents the highest act of citizenship. It seems to me that there is a special responsibility to protect the dignity of these gallant acts, and not cheapen them by selling them off to the highest bidder.
The grandson of Alfred Shout, Graham Thomas, who sold the medal last week, said keeping the VC in his family home had become too much of a responsibility. He also needed the funds to help his children and grandchildren, and to pay medical bills. "Anyway, I think Captain Shout would support my decision to sell it to support his descendants".
Too much of a responsibility. Well, Captain Shout certainly knew a lot about responsibility, not to mention the sacrifice responsibility sometimes requires. Not sure hanging a VC on your wall of honour constitutes a grave responsibility or an immense joy, but I’m thinking the latter more than the former. As for the brave soldier somehow agreeing from his grave with the decision of his grandson to get rich off his heroism by selling the family jewels to a private collector, I’d have to say don’t think so. It is more likely that Graham is expressing seller’s remorse and is conveniently trying to lessen the guilt he feels for his actions.
But all of this is important now not because of principle alone. It so happens that this year, the 150th year of the Victoria Cross, we continue to find ourselves in the thick of our still unfolding history. Last week, the Americans, Brits and Canadians were engaged in pre-dawn offensives against hundreds of Taliban. Obviously we are still carrying out operations “in the face of the enemy”. We are witnessing our soldiers being killed on a weekly basis, meaning that the winning of a VC is still very much within the realm of possibility. All this is to say that soldiers are required to wear their medals when in uniform. For them, selling them is not an option. So why should it be an option for their offspring? Why should those who buy it be able to sell it again for even more? Why should a man profit from another man's courage?
themonarchist.blogspot.com/2006/07/victoria-cross-is-not-for-sale.html |
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Post by corsair67 on Dec 6, 2007 12:26:42 GMT 12
Probably a smack on the back of the hand with a wet paper bag.  So at least two dealers purchased these items and never thought it was odd that they weren't ingraved with the recipients names?  ?  |
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Post by flyjoe180 on Dec 6, 2007 12:29:40 GMT 12
You have to wonder, anyone who knows anything about 'normal' medals (ie not crosses or VC's) such as these would know that a name is always etched onto the rim. We live in a sad commercial world, everything has a price nowdays and the unscrupulous are out to make a buck.
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Post by corsair67 on Dec 6, 2007 12:35:58 GMT 12
No one is really coming out of this whole fiasco looking very good so far, are they.  |
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Post by flycookie on Dec 6, 2007 13:40:16 GMT 12
stuff.co.nz/print/4314262a1861.htmlThursday, 06 December 2007200712060500 No medals for gentle approach Rosemary McLeod Will the boys who stole the war medals from the Army Museum kindly own up, or everyone – and I mean everyone – will be kept in after school. I'm waiting (tap of cane on lectern, steely accusatory stare) and silence. Seriously, did this technique ever work? I loved the way Defence Minister Phil Goff immediately sprang to that headmasterly approach this week, in an instinctive desire to seem as if he could do something. Basically, this is just a schoolboy situation, he implied, and all you have to do is shame the brats into a mumbled confession before giving them a well-earned thrashing. Only you can't give them a thrashing anymore: you have to give them gentle understanding about their mothers, and bullies, and food allergies. Well, I have gentle understanding. I gently understand that the thieves are the last sort of people on whom this approach could work, and that they're immune to shame, or they wouldn't have stolen the damn medals in the first place. I understand that they did it because the medals are worth a lot of money, and I also understand that they can sell them to rich loon-bombs who'll keep them locked in a box under their beds, and gloat over them. Mr Goff rather hoped the thieves might have a conscience, which I think – to put it mildly – unlikely. Few people go to Sunday School these days in order to acquire such ethical handicaps. Why do we flail about in the face of an outrageous act like this? What's wrong with a snarled, "We'll root you out, you scumbags and you'll wish you'd never been born!" or "You've got 24 hours during which, if you return them, you may survive!" or even "If you don't hand them over we'll cut your toes off one by one!" The people who won these medals were men of action, not ditherers afraid of looking aggro. That's why we admire them. But there are plenty of people who'd rather earn notoriety than respect, and we've had a series of similar attacks on items of value, or symbolic power. So many in fact – there'll be more that I haven't thought of – that you'd almost think it was a national sport. In the 1980s, there were attacks, attributed to a group known as the Ruatoria Rastas, on beautiful colonial churches in the area, as well as on the old farm buildings and home of a local landowner. The churches were treasures we might all have enjoyed, but they had to go. They had a better idea. In l994, activist Mike Smith took a chainsaw to the old pine on Auckland's One Tree Hill. The city landmark didn't last. The following year, Otaki's church, the 145-year-old Rangiatea, was razed by an arsonist. If we had a Sistine Chapel, this was probably it. The fearsome chief Te Rauparaha provided some of the materials as well as labour to build it, and the tangi on the site the day after it burned was the biggest in Otaki since he died in the 1840s. Say what you like about Christianity, many Maori took to it, and its arrival here is part of all our history. So to hell with it. In 1997, the America's Cup, proudly housed in the Royal New Zealand Yacht Squadron's clubrooms in Auckland, was attacked by a man with a sledgehammer and badly damaged. You can't have symbols of success on display. And also that year, Colin McCahon's huge Urewera Mural was stolen from the Aniwaniwa Visitor Centre in the King Country. It went missing till the following year, when art patron Jenny Gibbs negotiated its return from Maori radicals, including Tame Iti. Then, in 1998, an idiot armed with a sawn-off shotgun and crowbar wrenched James Tissot's painting Still On Top from the wall of the Auckland City Art Gallery. The gallery got it back eventually, very badly damaged, and restorers worked on it for two years before it could be displayed again. It will always bear the scars. What with the way we also let the rats get at the Treaty of Waitangi, what does all this say about us? Can't we accept that some things are more important than ourselves? You may not copy, republish or distribute this page or the content from it without having obtained written permission from the copyright owner. To enquire about copyright clearances contact clearance@fairfaxnz.co.nz.
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Post by flyjoe180 on Dec 8, 2007 14:56:09 GMT 12
The potential reward for the return of the medals stolen from Waiouru Army Museum has shot up to more than $330,000.
A Nelson businessman has offered $100,000 and a former United States serviceman has added US$25,000 (NZ$32,000) to the $200,000 proffered by British billionaire Victoria Cross collector Lord Ashcroft.
But the police have yet to decide whether they will accept the offers, said Operation Valour spokesman Detective Dennis O'Rourke.
He said police headquarters was looking at policy, procedure and legal issues, and inquiry chief Detective Senior Sergeant Chris Bensemann was considering the potential effect on the investigation.
Police yesterday called in a specialist search team from Wellington to do a more detailed examination outside the museum and to provide advice on other areas that could be searched.
Police have again declined to release any footage from the museum's security cameras and were not prepared to say how many offenders were involved in the break-in last Sunday. The 96 stolen medals include nine VCs.
New Zealand's latest VC winner, Corporal Willie Apiata, and a number of other well-known New Zealanders are featuring in a TVNZ appeal for the return of the medals, to be played all weekend.
Army spokesman David Courtney said Corporal Apiata had taken special precautions to keep his medal safe, but would not give further details. www.stuff.co.nz/4316136a11.html
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Post by flyjoe180 on Jan 19, 2008 14:50:27 GMT 12
NZ's biggest reward offered for medals
5:00AM Friday January 18, 2008
By Juliet Rowan
The largest reward in New Zealand history has been offered for information leading to the return of the Waiouru Army Museum's stolen war medals.
Police and the Army yesterday said a $300,000 reward was now on offer to anyone who gave information about the missing medals, which include nine Victoria Crosses, two George Crosses and an Albert Medal.
British medals collector Lord Michael Ashcroft and a New Zealand businessman who wishes to remain anonymous have put up the money.
The museum director, retired colonel Raymond Seymour, told the Herald that the money ought to be a "very good incentive" to anyone who knew something about the December 2 heist.
"By golly, if $300,000 doesn't make someone talk about providing information about the return of these medals, I'm not sure what will," he said last night.
"It might just prick someone's conscience in order for the police to get that necessary piece of information to end this terrible saga."
Colonel Seymour has been counting the days - 46 - since thieves smashed their way into the museum at night and plundered the Valour Alcove where the medals - won by some of the country's greatest war heroes - were displayed.
The reward comprises $200,000 from Lord Ashcroft and $100,000 from the mystery New Zealander.
The offer was jointly announced by Army chief Major General Lou Gardiner and Police Commissioner Howard Broad.
Lord Ashcroft's offer came the day after the medals were stolen, but Mr Broad said there had been a delay in accepting it because of the "unusual circumstances" of the private offerwww.nzherald.co.nz/category/story.cfm?c_id=32&objectid=10487473
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Post by Brett on Feb 16, 2008 15:18:28 GMT 12
That is great news!
Here's a bit more info. They still haven't caught the theives.
Stolen military medals recovered
Stuff.co.nz | Saturday, 16 February 2008
RETURNED: Some of the military medals that had been stolen from Waiouru Army Museum.
LATEST: Military medals stolen in a museum heist in December have been recovered and the net is closing on those who stole them, police announced today.
The 96 medals - including nine Victoria Crosses - were stolen from the museum in the early hours of December 2.
The Victoria Cross medals taken in the heist included those of World War 2 soldier Captain Charles Upham, the only man to ever win two VCs.
The medals are considered to be worth several million dollars.
Operation Valour inquiry head Detective Senior Sergeant Chris Bensemann said all 12 sets of medals had been recovered in good condition and had been verified as being those stolen from Waiouru.
The medals were returned as a result of a $300,000 reward being offered last month by Lord Michael Ashcroft, the owner of the largest collection of Victoria Crosses, and a Nelson businessman.
"The reward was offered for information leading to the safe return of the medals and that has encouraged a person to come forward and facilitate the return of the medals to police," Mr Bensemann said.
An amount has been paid but no immunity from prosecution or support for reduction in any sentence for any offender was given in return, Bensemann said.
"New Zealand Police celebrate the return of these national treasures. The recovery of the medals was the top priority. Nevertheless, our job won't be complete until we find the perpetrators of this burglary and bring them to court.
"The file will remain open for as long as it takes. My team will continue to work on this inquiry and I would urge the public to continue to provide us with any information which may come to the front of mind. The public shouldn't assume that because the inquiry is a couple of months long we have gathered all the relevant information. Even the smallest snippet of information can be of use in such investigations," Bensemann said.
"What I can say is that the recovery of the medals has certainly narrowed the focus of the investigation, the net is closing and we are continuing to work very hard at pulling it tight."
Chief of Army Major General Gardiner said the intent was to return the medals to the Waiouru Army Museum once a comprehensive security review had been completed and changes implemented.
"The museum is the rightful home of the medals. The museum is New Zealand's link to our rich and proud military history and that is where these medals belong.
"New Zealanders should be able to see the original medals that these men were given. It is a tangible connection to the gallantry of some of the nation's most famous sons."
Defence Minister Phil Goff said in a statement that he was delighted and relieved at the recovery of the medals.
"These medals are New Zealand’s national treasures, with a value beyond any monetary worth.
"I would like to thank and congratulate the police for their work in recovering the medals and to thank the two businessmen for their generosity in putting up money as a reward for information leading to the recovery of the medals.
"Along with other New Zealanders I also hope that those responsible for the theft will, in due course, be held to account.
The theft of the medals was a "wake-up call" over the need for greater security regarding them, Goff said.
* The stolen medals were awarded to the following recipients:
Captain C Upham (VC and bar), Brigadier L Andrew (VC, DSO), Captain S Frickleton (VC), Sergeant J Hinton (VC), Sergeant A Hulme (VC), Major R Judson (VC, DCM, MM), Lieutenant Colonel H Laurent (VC), Sergeant J Grant (VC NZEF), Sergeant K Elliot (VC), Lance Corporal D Russell (GC), Sergeant M Hudson (GC), Captain R Riding (AM).
- with NZPA
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Post by lumpy on Feb 16, 2008 18:08:02 GMT 12
Yes , a great result ( so far ) . Nothing like a scum bag to turn another scumbag in ( all credit for doing so , but I wonder how long they knew where the medals were ) . Still , now the police have firm leads , Im sure the truth will come out , and those responsible will be accountable . If not , at least the medals are safe
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Post by flyjoe180 on Feb 17, 2008 11:13:52 GMT 12
Brilliant news. Great to have those medals returned to their rightful place. Someone will go down for it, albeit $300k richer.
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Post by corsair67 on Feb 17, 2008 11:24:06 GMT 12
Yes, $300k richer - but they might be murdered before they get to enjoy the spoils!
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Post by Calum on Feb 17, 2008 11:36:04 GMT 12
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Post by flyjoe180 on Feb 17, 2008 13:27:44 GMT 12
Police are now getting confident arrests will be made in relation to the theft of the medals. Police positive thieves will be caught
Feb 17, 2008 7:25 AM
Police are confident arrests will soon be made following the return of the war medals.
All 96 medals stolen from Waiouru Army Museum last year have been recovered.
Detective Senior Sergeant Chris Bensemann says police negotiated the return of the medals through an independent third party.
He says despite the return of the awards, their investigation is far from over and that he was always confident the medals would be returned.
Auckland barrister Chris Comeskey, the man who helped secure the return of the medals says he has been negotiating since mid-January to get them back.
As a criminal lawyer, he says he was able to put out feelers to get some idea of who might have carried off the heist.
He says there aren't too many people in New Zealand who'd be capable of such a brazen burglary.
Comeskey says he doubts the thieves anticipated the massive public backlash to the theft.
The stolen medals included the Victoria Cross and bar awarded to Captain Charles Upham.
His daughter Amanda says she's over the moon her father's medals have been returned but says the medals should be locked in a vault, and replicas should be made.
She says when she heard to news she thought it was a hoax, although she'd always been confident the medals would be returned also.
Meanwhile there has been a call for the medals to be placed in Wellington's Te Papa museum.
National's defence spokesman Wayne Mapp sympathises with people who want the medals on show at Waiouru Army Museum.
But he feels they should be displayed where a larger number of people can see them.
Mapp says a home could be found at Te Papa, or the Auckland War Memorial Museum.tvnz.co.nz/view/page/1318360/1585694 |
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Post by flyjoe180 on Feb 17, 2008 13:30:09 GMT 12
I wouldn't like to see the medals in Te Papa, it's the wrong place for them entirely. The Auckland War Memorial would be better, or retain them at Waiouru with beefed up security. Or inside the Wellington War Memorial.
And as for , well ya can't beat te news eh fellas.
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Post by FlyNavy on Feb 17, 2008 13:46:31 GMT 12
"Comeskey says he doubts the thieves anticipated the massive public backlash to the theft." I am guessing the thieves did not give it a second thought.
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