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Post by general on Aug 27, 2013 22:06:04 GMT 12
Gentlemen, quite the hive of busy bees on this thread!
Absotively magic to see all these great pics.
If I've missed it I apologise but would there be good colour references for the Fancy nose art? On a prophetic note I have a 1:48th commission build on the cards, for this particular 75 Sqn a/c.
I will have to translate the markings into CAD, thence to a decal sheet.
Many thanks for this serendipitous topic!
Regards
Ross
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Post by Dave Homewood on Aug 27, 2013 23:28:58 GMT 12
Superb Don!! Thanks!
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Post by pjw4118 on Aug 28, 2013 17:42:24 GMT 12
Ross the only colour references we have are shown above in the painting of JN-M. We know that the original was too bright/white and was toned down with a overwash ,,,
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Post by fwx on Sept 3, 2013 21:50:39 GMT 12
According to Ian Wallace's research, quoting Pilot Alex Simpson, who flew JN-M on two op's, Captain Reilly Foull's colouring was: "The face, neck and hands were originally a ‘flesh’ colour, but had faded to be almost white. The uniform was Army khaki. He holds a pint of ale in his right hand, a 25lb practice bomb in his left and a corn-cob pipe in his mouth. The devil that he was, he has two horns sprouting from his temples." www.thescale.info/news/publish/The-Captains-Fancy.shtmlGreat to see the two logbooks, thanks Peter, some very interesting info in those, and thanks also Don for those beautiful pics! For anyone interested in this legendary Lanc, there is a whole lot more about her history from Jack Wall, A/B in S/L Jack Bailey's crew, who flew her on her 100th op': 75nzsquadron.wordpress.com/2013/07/27/the-memoirs-of-jack-wall-part-13-ne181-the-captains-fancy/- plus related posts. Cheers, Chris |
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Post by fwx on Sept 5, 2013 13:35:41 GMT 12
There's a coincidence - Glen's top post on the previous page mentions:
Alexander Stewart Ballingall. NZ 2286. Sqn Ldr, Pilot and Flt Commander. 75(NZ)Sqn, 8May to 21 Jul 1945. RAF Mepal.
- and further down the same page, the second of Colin Emslie's logbook pages shown (April 45), is signed off by "AS Ballingall, S/L, O/C C Flight".
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Post by Dave Homewood on Sept 5, 2013 14:44:43 GMT 12
Based on the info you provided two posts back Chris I have pieced together this 'artist's impression' of what the original nose art may have looked like. Just for fun...  |
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Post by Dave Homewood on Sept 5, 2013 14:53:08 GMT 12
And by the end of the 100 plus ops something like this  |
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Post by fwx on Sept 5, 2013 21:17:57 GMT 12
Brilliant Dave! Well done, Glen will like that. The photo with Ed Ware in the cockpit has a bit more detail of the top of his head but the original artwork seems to be a fairly rough interpretation of the classic Daily Mirror cartoon character, Captain A. R. Reilly-Ffoull:   |
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Post by Dave Homewood on Sept 5, 2013 21:21:03 GMT 12
Not as rough as my rough interpretation  |
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Post by fwx on Sept 5, 2013 21:24:26 GMT 12
No I think you've caught the crazed look quite well - he had a touch of the Terry-Thomas about him I'd say?
Could be a whole new career for you in nose art??
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Post by Dave Homewood on Sept 5, 2013 21:29:52 GMT 12
I have always thought that he had a Terry-Thomas look too. A bit of an evil caddish type.
Who actually applied the artwork, does anyone know? or who's idea was it, which crew?
He is also reminiscent of the cartoon characters that appeared in British and NZ Army literature and on signage, etc, in the Italian Campaign. they were called 'The Two Types' and were stiff upper lip pommy officers who got everything wrong. A bit like Colonel Blimp.
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Post by pjw4118 on Sept 6, 2013 15:38:22 GMT 12
FWX , thats not a crazed look thats a FORUM look !!
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Post by pb150grandaughter on Sept 24, 2013 7:05:39 GMT 12
I wonder, did any of the No. 75 (NZ) Squadron bombers make it to 100 operations (plus)? And does anyone know of other Lancasters or other bomber types that achieved this milestone with kiwi crew or connections? In the excellent book "Lancaster" by Mike Garbett and Brian Goulding there's a photo of Lancaster BIII PB150 CF-V of No. 625 Squadron at Scampton with a large kiwi sitting on a bomb painted under the pilot's window, alongside markings for 100 ops (five or so of which were dropping food rather then bombs). Does anyone know who the New Zealand crew member/s was/were? Wow, Take a look at my blog to check the pictures out, my grandad was the bomb aimer and the exact same plane you described. I would love to find out more information on it! My blog is rockandinspire.wordpress.com/2013/09/23/my-grandad-xxx/ I am taking it this is the crew as I also have other pictures of the crew sat in the pilots seat :-) |
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Post by pjw4118 on Nov 14, 2013 17:29:47 GMT 12
The NZBCA with MOTAT is currently upgrading the displays from the minimal treatment they received when the ADH opened.
As part of this re look , we are considering if the Lanc could be re done as JN -M The Captains Fancy. While it means changing squadron codes from AA , the Lanc may become a better exhibit.
What we need is the history of JN - M and the names of crews who flew her. I know some of our Forum dwellers have done a lot of work , can you share it , perhaps by PM.
We intend locating as much material as possible before deciding on making it a funded project.
As you know the Lanc has AA codes on the starboard side and 101 squadrons SR on the other , but there is some question about the contribution and fate of the actual aircraft currently depicted as well as the famous AA perhaps disappearing.
Discussion is most welcome
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Post by Dave Homewood on Nov 14, 2013 17:40:04 GMT 12
The nose art was on the port side. Perhaps change the port side to JN-M and leave the starboard side as AA-O?
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Post by skyhawkdon on Nov 14, 2013 17:57:18 GMT 12
I second that, but I'm biased given my family connection to the current starboard side markings!
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Post by pjw4118 on Nov 14, 2013 18:32:31 GMT 12
Understood Don , but most Kiwi aircrew didnt fly with 75 , so that maybe that is a bit of overkill. What other squadron/aircraft would you like to see?
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Post by Dave Homewood on Nov 14, 2013 18:51:41 GMT 12
How about Taipo, the Lancaster flown by Roy Calvert DFC** - I believe he was the only Lancaster pilot to receive three DFC's.
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Post by fwx on Nov 15, 2013 13:55:24 GMT 12
No, 75 (NZ) Sqdn was the only NZ heavy bomber squadron, so I think it's entirely appropriate to have a JN code on one side, and the AA code on the other. The intention after all, was to bring NE181 back to NZ after the war. If the bomber boys had been able to convince the govt. she would be here in the flesh! AA-O makes a neat pairing, with the famous code, and very good existing film footage of her in action.
My penny's worth! Cheers, Chris
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Post by pjw4118 on Nov 16, 2013 10:17:11 GMT 12
Thanks for the input gentlemen , and thanks Chris for the offer of detailed info.
Any change is going to be debatable and I think getting JN-M accepted is the first step. Having AA as well wouldnt have my support. I think 101 , or 7 Squadrons are a possibility but personalised to a special Kiwi crew that would have its own story board.
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