Did any kiwis fly the F-4 Phantom?

[Dave Homewood]

Did any RNZAF pilots do exchanges to the USAF, US Navy, RAF, RAAF or other air forces to fly the McDonnell Douglas F-4 Phantom?

Or did any kiwis serve on them as part of those air forces?

I know about half-kiwi Mark Hanna, but I wonder about any others, out of curiosity.

Did any NZ pilots evaluate the Phantom during the Canberra replacement programme?

[baronbeeza]

I am sure you will end up with at least one name on the list Dave. Don may be the man to know but I have a very strong feeling at least one 75 Sqdn pilot did an exchange.

Did Jim Barclay fly them on exchange in the mid-seventies ? That would be my bet at this stage.
I am sure one of the pilots about the Squadron in the early 80's had not long come back from a stint on the F-4.

[McFly]

Chris Lee pops up as having flown the F-4 while on exchange in the States.

Chris Lee's Experience
Airbus A320 Check Captain Air New Zealand

December 2011 – Present (10 months) Christchurch
Airline Captain
Air New Zealand
August 1987 – January 2012 (24 years 6 months) Christchurch

GD Officer
Royal New Zealand Air Force
August 1984 – August 1987 (3 years 1 month) Ohakea

14 Squadron OFC. Strike Wing Training Officer
F4 Phantom Instructor Pilot
United States Air Force
January 1982 – September 1984 (2 years 9 months) Homestead AFB, RNZAF Exchange pilot

GD(P)Officer
Royal New Zealand Air Force
January 1973 – January 1982 (9 years 1 month) Ohakea


nz.linkedin.com/pub/chris-lee/39/9a4/426

[beagle]

Yes Jim Barclay did as I spent 1/2 a day with him doing a foreighner for him in the fabric bay and we had a good chat about things.
He mentioned his stint in the US and about the F4

[baronbeeza]

Now I am reading that Glen Todd may have followed CC Lee. It would seem Glen did his exchange tour in the mid-80's. He was back in the country in 1987 to fly the gold A-4.

That is 3 names already. I am sure there will be more.

[phil82]

Sqn Ldr Fred Kinvig did a full two year tour on the F4 with the USAF. Late 60s? Brought a lovely green Mustang back with him!

[skyhawkdon]

Gavin Howse and John Bates also flew them on exchange with the USAF. Several others would have had rides as well.

[the_flying_surfer]

FLTLT Aaron Lloyd (40SQN) rode in the backseat of a German F4 Phantom II at Exercise Maple Flag in 2009 !!

[skyhawkdon]

Actually thinking about it I think John Bates flew A-7s and A-10s on exchange, not F-4s. I'm also sure Glenn Todd did his exchange with the RAF flying Hawks and not the USAF.

[baronbeeza]

Public Appearances by the Golden Skyhawk
_

_
The Golden Anniversary Skyhawk was flown by Flight Lieutenant Glenn Todd at a number of public events in 1987. Todd had only recently returned to RNZAF Ohakea having been on an exchange to the USA where he'd been flying McDonnell Douglas F-4 Phantoms.

-

www.cambridgeairforce.org.nz/RNZAF_50th_Anniv_Skyhawk.html

About halfway down the page.

The Hawk does sound better though as I had a feeling someone was in the UK during the early 80's.

Steve Moore was doing his thing. Colin Rippey was at Cranwell and I think there were a couple of Hawk exchanges shortly afterwards.
Greg Elliot went on to do a Hawk exchange but that would have been later.

[Dave Homewood]

I do not know now where I got that information from about Glenn Todd flying the F-4, I will try to find my resource on that.

[trimotor]

Pretty sure Glen Todd flew the Hawk. All US forces exchanges had been ended by 87, courtesy of the ANZUS rift.

[beagle]

what about any exchanges with the RAAF and our guys flying their F4's.
did any of our exchange pilots go to fly F111's

[trimotor]

Never heard of an RNZAF pilot flying RAAF F4's, and I'd wager there was never a Kiwi exchange on the F111; reason being that there was no direct role comparison, unlike the exchange pilots I saw flying the RAAF F111's in the late 80's/early 90's-USAF F111 guys and RAF Tornado pilot/nav. (I forget which).

[avenger]

I believe Peter Rhodes flew the F 4 in the RAAF.
Wouldn't claim that as a 100% certainty.

Later - just as well I didn't go for that 100% claim, Peter did not fly the F4 but did serve in the RAAF.

[Bruce]

Would any of those F4 exchanges been part of the Canberra replacement evaluations? Aparently the F4 was high on the wishlist at one time, so surely some flight evaluations would have taken place.

[skyhawkdon]

Most of the US F-4 exchanges were during the Skyhawk era Bruce but Fred Kinvig did his exchange on them prior to the Skyhawk purchase. He had just finished his exchange and was about to return to NZ in 1968 when he was sent to the Douglas factory to evaluate the A-4 and compare it's performance to the F-4. All the details including Fred's interview are in the early chapters of "SKYHAWKS".

[Dave Homewood]

It seems that AVM Ian Morrison got at least one flight in a Phantom.... from the PRESS, 10 APRIL 1963

[Glen T]

I was on 2 Sqn late 1985 to late 1986, and had a large part to play with the Gold A4. During a Sqn BBQ, Glenn Todd ... (note I have one n in Glen, and Glenn Todd has two... it matters..!!), Glenn said he was getting use to flying the NZ A4 again, as the vibrations affected the pilots causing nausea, and was a different feeling after flying the F4 in the USA. This discussion was brought about by me being the first one in the back seat in the Gold NZ6256 with Jim Jennings the pilot on its second flight... the flight that Bruce Nixon took loads of promo piccs and film from NZ6255, and a very fast streak down the runway for the National Film Unit filming it from the runway, for the RNZAF 50 years celebrations, and me using the sick bag... And John Bates did fly the A10. My son and I visited John at his home in Taupo some years ago and his office was amazing with the articles and plaques, and photos of A10 stuff adorning his 'man cave'.... In an amazing qurk of coincidence, in Sep 2017 I drove from Phoenix to Las Vegas to visit Blue Air Training in the hope they would want live ejection seats in their Strikemasters... some of the ex RNZAF seats had my signature on them from 1991.... And I met their CEO, Chep. Their office had a RNZAF plaque on the wall next to a pic of an A10... It was a plaque gifted by a Flt Lt John Bates, to the Lobos, dated 10/76 to 2/79. Chep's hope was to buy some retired A10's from the USAF, and fly them as Red Air aircraft... he had people in high places in the Pentagon... and John's plaque was still on the wall of a new company forty years later...!! Chep was amazed someone from NZ could make a flying visit to his little new buisness, and know who the plaque was from.... And Jim Barclay has told me he flew F4's in the US too.