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Post by phil82 on Jan 10, 2015 14:30:07 GMT 12
There's an interesting comment from Richard Prebble in the latest Listener on this very same topic. Motorists are being ticketed for travelling at 101km/h onroads which the New Zealand Transport Agency is suggesting should have a speed limit of 110km/h! He goes on to suggest current Police tactics[read Government] are creeping criminalisation! I wait in hope for the day when someone with the money and nous to afford it takes a cop to court over a ticket issued on the basis of an instrument only the police have which is better than the average speedometer in a car which is acknowledged as being 2 0r 3 per cent out. I'll do it tomorrow when I win Lotto! Watch this space!
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Post by Dave Homewood on Jan 10, 2015 17:28:12 GMT 12
You cannot blame the police officers on the roads for this, they are probably as against this as anyone. it falls on their shoulders simply to administer the policy that comes down from on high from the police chiefs and the Ministry of Police. Most cops didn't join up to ticket good drivers - it's hardly getting them better work stories, is it?
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Post by Darren Masters on Jan 10, 2015 23:28:59 GMT 12
You cannot blame the police officers on the roads for this, they are probably as against this as anyone. it falls on their shoulders simply to administer the policy that comes down from on high from the police chiefs and the Ministry of Police. Most cops didn't join up to ticket good drivers - it's hardly getting them better work stories, is it? My point all along Mr Homewood
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Post by Darren Masters on Jan 10, 2015 23:32:50 GMT 12
Let's not even start on cyclists...
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Post by mumbles on Jan 11, 2015 9:22:39 GMT 12
Let's not even start on cyclists... Indeed, there are many more bad drivers out there than bad cyclists.
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Post by Darren Masters on Jan 11, 2015 10:54:30 GMT 12
Let's not even start on cyclists... Indeed, there are many more bad drivers out there than bad cyclists. My bad motorcyclists I meant to say and some of the ways they ride/manouver.
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Post by phil82 on Jan 12, 2015 22:55:33 GMT 12
"The police's "confusing" zero tolerance stance on speeding is to be reviewed, Police Minister Michael Woodhouse says".
"He has asked police to review all of the public messages it put out as part of the 2014/15 summer road safety campaign".
Perhaps he's been reading this site?
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Post by Darren Masters on Jan 13, 2015 17:48:58 GMT 12
"The police's "confusing" zero tolerance stance on speeding is to be reviewed, Police Minister Michael Woodhouse says". "He has asked police to review all of the public messages it put out as part of the 2014/15 summer road safety campaign". Perhaps he's been reading this site? And ofcourse stated "It is absolutely not aboout revenue". Yep, that's why the speed camera vans (2 on way home today) hang out in the zone where it runs from 100km/h to 70km/h. Absolutely not revenue. Ofcourse not...
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Post by haughtney1 on Jan 13, 2015 19:00:55 GMT 12
I can imagine the conversation now.....
"Here you go minister....a grand new idea.."
"But Mr Police commisioner, it's just like last year....but with lower speeds..."
"Well sir, WE DO predict it will raise a further 15 million in fines..."
"15 million extra? What about the road toll? "
"Road toll commissioner, what's that? I said an extra 15 million!"
" EXCELLENT!.....pay rises all round"
Or something like that I reckon.....
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Post by Dave Homewood on Jan 13, 2015 21:48:55 GMT 12
Do other countries run these stupid holiday road toll counts? Or is this just some macabre kiwi thing. I have often wondered that. No matter what the police do people will still die on the road - for many different reasons, but I always find it pretty sick how the media seem to turn it into a scoreboard and once it gets into double figures they get all preachy. I wonder if the constant media focus on the growing tolls adds to the stress of drivers in these holiday periods and maybe contributes to the factors that see stupid accidents occurring?
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Post by general on Jan 13, 2015 22:14:39 GMT 12
Looking at any infringement "notice" from a legal viewpoint it is simply that, a "notice". They can't enforce it by making it a 'demand' but trick you into believing you are liable. Any infringement is only an offer of contract.
In fact, any infringement notice is actually a "bill of exchange". The same as a cheque. By definition, a bill of exchange is "A notice to a party to pay to another party at a fixed or future date a certain sum". Strange but true. Anyhoos, for the purposes of expediency back to the notice.
These are cleverly worded to influence to pay. Once you understand the true nature of the daylight robbery you can deal with it lawfully. It is merely an 'offer of contract' Upon receipt of any 'notice' write across the front of the notice, one line under the other at a 45-deg angle, "NO CONTRACT. RETURN TO SENDER". Return the notice via registered mail to the STREET ADDRESS, not a PO Box, of the Infringement Bureau.
Bill Turner (among many others) discusses the ins and outs of legal deceptions on his YT channel.
I agree. The police are forced to operate as 'corporate collection officers' instead of 'law officers' much of the time. We at our end of the chain should respect this and tread lightly when confronted by the bureaucratic BS of traffic infringements. The police are pressured to carry out distasteful policy.
To pre-empt any pitchfork-and-torches horde I am referring to 'Acts', not 'Laws'. The LTSA is concerned with revenue-collection, not safety. If acts had any influence on promoting safety or preserving life the results would be obvious. The statistics, instead, speak for themselves.
Regards
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Post by Darren Masters on Jan 14, 2015 15:26:29 GMT 12
Dave, they have the 'double demerit' scheme in Aus but never heard of 1km/h. Obviously the campaign failed...
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Post by shorty on Jan 14, 2015 15:35:58 GMT 12
Seeing as how the media like to run it as a scoreboard how come they don't work both sides of the equation and factor in the number of people conceived in cars over the holiday periods? I reckon we would end up with a positive figure in the account book, mind you there may be a delay of nine months or so before the final tally is worked out
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Post by suthg on Jan 14, 2015 19:36:39 GMT 12
IIRC last year - I mean the 2013 Christmas Season, the safety call was all about Driving to the Conditions, get adequate rest and food while you travel long distances. Keep aware of the other motorists (and keep a watch for motorbikes was a particular campaign as well, I remember) - all good common sense advice and rules, and we had the lowest road toll in what, 12 years? And just a 4km/hr tolerance over the specific Christmas 12 day holiday season. It actually achieved something with using a commonsense programme.
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Post by kiwithrottlejockey on Jan 15, 2015 10:00:08 GMT 12
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Post by Dave Homewood on Jan 15, 2015 11:14:41 GMT 12
Something that baffles me is the Police have counted in the Christmas holiday road toll the death of a middle-aged man who was killed while rarking it up on a motorcycle in sand dunes at Port Waikato, and went over a bank. How can that equate to being a road death? Yes beaches are used legally as roads but the sand dunes bloody well are not.
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Post by lumpy on Jan 15, 2015 11:29:52 GMT 12
Something that baffles me is the Police have counted in the Christmas holiday road toll the death of a middle-aged man who was killed while rarking it up on a motorcycle in sand dunes at Port Waikato, and went over a bank. How can that equate to being a road death? Yes beaches are used legally as roads but the sand dunes bloody well are not. Pretty much any place that the public have unimpeded access to can be considered as a road ( if someones driving / riding on it ) . Its really just the same rule that applies to beaches .
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Post by Dave Homewood on Jan 15, 2015 11:35:03 GMT 12
Strange.
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Post by The Red Baron on Jan 15, 2015 11:37:08 GMT 12
A road is any place the public have access too whether by right or not.So if a car crashes through you lounge room wall and kills you sitting in your lazy boy,its classed as on a road. However they also get selective and leave some crashes out to give better statistics.
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Post by Dave Homewood on Jan 15, 2015 12:04:36 GMT 12
Hmm, so it is therefore absolutely fine for a bicycle to ride on a footpath, as it's technically a road?
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