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Post by baronbeeza on Jan 18, 2015 17:32:04 GMT 12
The very last thing we need is 3 foreign fishing boats tied up to the wharf and with 90% of the crews claiming they are stateless, no passports, and wanting to remain in NZ. That is no doubt what Mr Goff would have ended up with and somehow that proves the RNZN has things under control !
Those boats were more Australia's problem than ours, - but somehow I very much doubt the Aussies would be happy to take the crews off our hands.
It had the potential to be a very messy situation.
I believe Interpol have a purple notice out on the boats and the very last thing we need is them to steam into NZ waters to surrender.
The NZ Navy has gained the evidence required and probably had a successful mission.
Unfortunately this story has a few more chapters to it yet.
Illegal fishing is nothing new, places like Kiribati have zero chance of keeping it under control in their region. Somehow I think the International community is about to discover much more pressing issues and I think there is a very good chance that the NZDF is about to be about to be committed to another unrelated but even more unpleasant role.
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Post by Bruce on Jan 18, 2015 17:49:32 GMT 12
I can understand the complexities, but I am concerned that despite the Southern Ocean Fisheries patrol being a key design criteria for a Protector OPV, a couple of dilapidated floating hulks can out manouver it in an environment that it was supposed to excel in. The fact that apparently it cant embark a helicopter in those conditions also limits its effectiveness - Did we buy the right boats? I'm not criticising the decisions made by the crew - they were on the spot, we're not. But regardless of what actually went on, it doesnt make the Navy look particularly effective...
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Post by kiwithrottlejockey on Jan 19, 2015 0:25:51 GMT 12
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Post by baronbeeza on Jan 19, 2015 7:59:13 GMT 12
The cartoon is rather good, can you just imagine how the 'coalition' would be dealing with this one ?
We have a range of opinion here as it is. I was having a quiet think about options and what Ron is saying there. It was not so long ago that the political call could have been made when he was in a position of strength. We as a country could have different players in the team flying our flag.
Would Ron along with his partners Russel, David C and 'Kim' been so bold then ? Of course Phil as Defence spokesman (Minister) would be keeping us up with the play.
My thinking was that we would have exactly the same result as we have now, only difference is we have missed out on so much bloodshed and entertainment.
Somehow I feel the Navy are going to end up going back down to mop up in what is probably going to become a rescue mission. The planning for that mission may have started a few days ago....
Inevitable and saddening.
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Post by phil82 on Jan 19, 2015 8:06:12 GMT 12
It's very easy for some to demand affirmative action for which they won't be held to account when the body bags have to be counted.
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Post by Dave Homewood on Jan 19, 2015 21:43:25 GMT 12
Why is NZ wasting money sending ships on these patrols in the Southern Ocean if they cannot do anything about the illegal ships they are patrolling for?
Either stop the illegal fishing or stop wasting money on the Southern Ocean patrols in ships inadequate to carry out the role.
No doubt upon seeing how inept the Navy/Govt is, we'll soon have our waters infested with pirates.
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Post by kiwithrottlejockey on Jan 19, 2015 23:30:05 GMT 12
• Captain says too dangerous to board illegal fishing boatListen to the entire interview of the Captain of HMNZS Wellington by Jim Mora on Radio NZ's Checkpoint programme from early Monday evening. I've got to admit after hearing that interview that I tend to agree with the Captain. However, I still reserve the right to post the occasional “piss-taking” cartoon.... 
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Post by pepe on Jan 20, 2015 9:48:40 GMT 12
The Captain's comments also reported in the NZ Herald. "Navy fires back at critics" While the decision to board or not was his to make, it appears that any use of force was indeed dictated by instructions from "above" |
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Post by phil82 on Jan 20, 2015 11:22:46 GMT 12
Also from the Captains' broadside:" Criticism [by Opposition politicians though he doesn't mention them!]was misplaced. Not only did we find three illegal, unreported and unregulated vessels operating in an area of Antarctica the size of Australia,we caught them in the act .....and gained a whole heap of evidence." He goes on to say:"Calls by some MPs to use force were "ill-informed".It was a peace-time operation and we abide by a strict set of rules of engagement."
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Post by phil82 on Jan 21, 2015 12:27:17 GMT 12
I note a letter in the Herald today from one Ian Bradley a former RNZN [and ex-RN] Captain of the Leander frigate Waikato, in which he suggests he might have done things differently with the onboard Wasp. I doubt that Given Wellington is much smaller than a Leander, and in very rough seas, but Ian was certainly a more swashbuckling type of ships' Captain who would have been brilliant in wartime, or perhaps in Hornblower's day, but with a panache that eventually caused him to fall foul of the then [late 1970s?] Naval heirarchy and he was dismissed from his post for reasons never given. He took the Navy to court and lost, then wrote a book entititled "Don't Rock The Boat", the "boat" in this case being the Navy, and he being the "rocker"! I don't doubt he might have done things differently, but in the end he wasn't there. I can't say I knew him,rather I knew of him, but bumped into him occasionally and always found to be a very affable guy. He was Captain of the Waikato off California when a USN helicopter about to ditch arrived Ian invited him to land on Waikato despite the weight being beyond design limits. Now I'm going from memory here, so don't all you lot take me to task, but I believe Waikato had to undergo a survey after return to Auckland. Still, what could you do, watch a friendly chopper ditch in the sea?
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Post by meo4 on Jan 24, 2015 20:45:22 GMT 12
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Post by camtech on Jan 25, 2015 12:09:08 GMT 12
I see Chief of Navy Jack Steer backs the captain's decision.
No political will to engage in offensive action to deter these thieves means they will return, unless the "Flag" country gives an authorative order to detain.
Also, the sea state apparently made boarding the trawlers extremely dangerous.
An Orion over flight with bomb doors open may have suggested time to move on, but getting to the mother ship and blockading that could have meant the trawlers running out of fuel and needing to head to a port to refuel - gotcha!!
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Post by thelensofhistory on Mar 4, 2015 21:40:00 GMT 12
Give the Navy some proper weapons and give them some proper commanders, or stop funding them all together!! Unfortunately I don't foresee this happening until events have over taken NZ. In other words only when NZ is threatened by a foreign power will anything change. In time the consequences of opting for OPV's over Frigates will be seen. |
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Post by Ian Warren on Mar 5, 2015 9:44:46 GMT 12
 Now that is so funny and so so real, only trouble the crew were making pigs off themselves and not wearing uniforms 
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Post by Ian Warren on Mar 5, 2015 9:54:04 GMT 12
I note a letter in the Herald today from one Ian Bradley a former RNZN [and ex-RN] Captain of the Leander frigate Waikato, in which he suggests he might have done things differently with the onboard Wasp. I doubt that Given Wellington is much smaller than a Leander, and in very rough seas, but Ian was certainly a more swashbuckling type of ships' Captain who would have been brilliant in wartime, or perhaps in Hornblower's day, but with a panache that eventually caused him to fall foul of the then [late 1970s?] Naval heirarchy and he was dismissed from his post for reasons never given. He took the Navy to court and lost, then wrote a book entititled "Don't Rock The Boat", the "boat" in this case being the Navy, and he being the "rocker"! I don't doubt he might have done things differently, but in the end he wasn't there. I can't say I knew him,rather I knew of him, but bumped into him occasionally and always found to be a very affable guy. He was Captain of the Waikato off California when a USN helicopter about to ditch arrived Ian invited him to land on Waikato despite the weight being beyond design limits. Now I'm going from memory here, so don't all you lot take me to task, but I believe Waikato had to undergo a survey after return to Auckland. Still, what could you do, watch a friendly chopper ditch in the sea? I would like to find out more about that, aircraft type, the weather, idea for an exciting drawing/painting. |
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Post by ErrolC on Mar 5, 2015 10:04:21 GMT 12
There are photos on the Web of the Sea King on the pad
Sent from my D5503 using proboards
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Post by htbrst on Mar 5, 2015 13:12:06 GMT 12
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Post by Ian Warren on Mar 6, 2015 8:08:04 GMT 12
 Cheers Guys, Errol, htbrst, this will make for an interesting theme for a painting and with striking colours as well to boot.
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Post by meo4 on Mar 20, 2015 16:56:04 GMT 12
Boat caught with illegal 180 tonne toothfish haul A boat snared poaching in the Southern Ocean was detained after docking in Thailand with 180 tonnes of toothfish. The Kunlun arrived in Phuket on Monday and attempted to offload what it claimed was groper. Previously registered to Equatorial Guinea, it was falsely reflagged as an Indonesian vessel and renamed Taichan. Bangkok-based New Zealand officials, police and customs officers arrived on the island soon after and have been working with Thai counterparts to hold the boat and its illegal haul. Its understood one of the heads of the notorious Spanish syndicate Vidal Armadores also travelled to Phuket after it became clear the boat was to be detained. The Government worked quietly behind the scenes after the navy was slammed for failing to board two of a fleet of three vessels spotted poaching in Antarctic waters in January. After tracking the Kunlun to Thailand, they alerted officials and passed on evidence collected by the HMNZS Wellington patrol. Meanwhile, recent raids in Spain on Vidal Armadores-linked companies came after pressure from Wellington. Operation Sparrow - an investigation into alleged links with illegal, unreported and unregulated (IUU) fishing activities marked the first time Spain enforced a new fisheries law. The rust-eaten Yongding and Songhua are still operating in the Southern Ocean. Foreign affairs minister Murray McCully said he was able to confirm New Zealand authorities were working with Thai authorities. "This is a result of very good co-operation we have had with governments in a number of countries. "I draw attention to my earlier remarks that we weren't going to put a stop to this business overnight but we were prepared to invest the necessarily energy to make sure we put them out of business at some point." McCully previously fingered the poachers as Spanish pirates and named Stanley Management Incorporated, a Panama company and Sucre Arias Reyes, law firm, that he said provides a front for boats illegally fishing for the pricey delicacy. Thailand is not due to pass domestic fishing laws until June, which left authorities with few legal options. "Two things were useful," a New Zealand government source said. "Firstly, they'd declared the catch as groper, not toothfish. There is no question [it is toothfish]. It is an offence to declare your fish something different to what it is. That gave [Thailand] some capacity to hold for some time. "Separately, the boat had gone in there identifying itself as the Tiachan, flying the Indonesian flag. Our guys were quick to establish with the Indonesians that they didn't own it. So, it is technically stateless, giving the Thai authorities a facet to keep the vessel held. We've been encouraging them to confiscate the catch, so they don't get any benefit from their misdeeds." The source added the Vidal Amadores "have had their people on the ground trying to get their boat sprung." The raids in Spain came "as a result of information being supplied to them on a continuing basis." Antarctic toothfish is prized by top-end restaurants. They can grow up to 40kg in the remote and over-fished waters, and fetch around US$50 ($64) a kilo. i.stuff.co.nz/world/asia/67439413/boat-caught-with-illegal-180-tonne-toothfish-haul |
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Post by scrooge on Mar 23, 2015 9:01:31 GMT 12
Good, a result (hopefully). Though actually if you read the article to the end, the boat and load are only being held while investigations continue, they could yet be released should the necessary 'paperwork' be found.
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Now that is so funny and so so real, only trouble the crew were making pigs off themselves and not wearing uniforms 
Cheers Guys, Errol, htbrst, this will make for an interesting theme for a painting and with striking colours as well to boot.