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Post by snafu on Jul 8, 2018 18:03:33 GMT 12
I watched that Q&A interview. I have no idea who the interviewer was but what a complete dick, continually cutting in over Ron Mark while he is trying to make a point, not actually listening to what is being said, and trotting out all the usual bullshit about the cost could be cheaper if they buy civil aircraft, and the billions needed taking money away from hospitals, blah blah. Any Defence money saved never automatically goes into hospitals and schools, those departments have their own fixed budgets just like Defence does. The guy has no bloody clue, who don't they get a defence journalist to do the interview rather than some nobody... you and I know the P8 is based on a civil aircraft, just like the P3 is based on a Lockheed L-188 Electra |
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Post by Dave Homewood on Jul 8, 2018 18:13:21 GMT 12
That is not what is being implied, the P-8 is built and fitted out to military specifications, while the journalist would have had something like an actual civil airliner in mind, like a Dash 8.
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Post by snafu on Jul 8, 2018 20:04:27 GMT 12
That is not what is being implied, the P-8 is built and fitted out to military specifications, while the journalist would have had something like an actual civil airliner in mind, like a Dash 8. Guess my irrelevant tongue-in-cheek post doesn't translate well on the net  |
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Post by isc on Jul 8, 2018 21:46:08 GMT 12
The Hudson was also based on a civil aircraft, and it didn't do too badly when it was needed. (same manufacturer) isc
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Post by alanster on Jul 9, 2018 10:53:44 GMT 12
It was also interesting to hear Ron Mark's comments about NZ Frist's policy on reinstating the Air Combat Force and increasing defence spending to 2% of GDP (His words were "It won't happen this term" but it certainly leaves the door open to be part of a future Government/coalition agreement). Also great to finally have academics and commentators publicly rebuffing Helen Clark's "Benign Strategic Environment" comments from 2001. To be honest, it was a "benign strategic environment" back in 2001, for NZ at least. There was no island-building in the South China Sea, Chinese territorial disputes with Japan and India were not happening, even the eternal issues over Taiwan strait were pretty much off the radar. Outside actors operating in the pacific had not ramped up yet either. The only issues were the "arc of instability" stuff that the Australians really ramped up from 2003 onwards in the pacific. US hegemony in the asia-pacific region was nowhere under threat as it is today. Different story today of course. Not only do you have Chinese assertiveness to challenge the US-led order, but you also have a populist president in the United States with strong hints of isolationist policy positions, challenging that order as well. |
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Post by alanster on Jul 9, 2018 10:58:23 GMT 12
I watched that Q&A interview. I have no idea who the interviewer was but what a complete dick, continually cutting in over Ron Mark while he is trying to make a point, not actually listening to what is being said, and trotting out all the usual bullshit about the cost could be cheaper if they buy civil aircraft, and the billions needed taking money away from hospitals, blah blah. Any Defence money saved never automatically goes into hospitals and schools, those departments have their own fixed budgets just like Defence does. The guy has no bloody clue, who don't they get a defence journalist to do the interview rather than some nobody... Corin Dann. He is TVNZ's main man in Wellington. I guess he was trotting out the usual counter-arguments to Defence spending to see what this government's answers would be to that (as opposed to previous governments). |
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Post by snafu on Jul 9, 2018 11:33:15 GMT 12
Corin Dann. He is TVNZ's main man in Wellington. I guess he was trotting out the usual counter-arguments to Defence spending to see what this government's answers would be to that (as opposed to previous governments). Well if he wanted to know the answer he should have let him finish answering the question before asking another, it seem more like he wanted to get a ride out of him continuing to cut him of mid sentence. I for one thought Aron did very we’ll considering |
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Post by mcmaster on Jul 9, 2018 13:25:53 GMT 12
That's great if someone in Gov is talking out loud that things are looking far from benign. Here's hoping the fine members of the RNZAF get some good new gear soon.
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Post by Dave Homewood on Jul 9, 2018 13:38:20 GMT 12
What time is the announcement due?
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Post by kiwithrottlejockey on Jul 9, 2018 15:08:55 GMT 12
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Post by Dave Homewood on Jul 9, 2018 15:16:32 GMT 12
P-8A Poseidon purchase an important step in military capability
09 Jul 2018
Today the Government announced the purchase of four Boeing P-8A Poseidon maritime patrol aircraft to replace the Royal New Zealand Air Force’s ageing fleet of six P-3K2 Orions.
The new aircraft and associated training, infrastructure and introduction into service costs will total $2.346 billion. The P-8As will be in service in 2023.
The P-8A was selected because it is the best aircraft currently available that suits our needs and will allow us to continue to meet Government expectations in maritime security.
This important decision is the major element of the Future Air Surveillance Capability. It demonstrates the value with which the Government holds the New Zealand Defence Force, and its role as a military force charged with serving the country and its defence and national security objectives.
The Orions have served us very well but they date from the 1960s and are the oldest P-3s in continuous service in the world by at least a decade. The Poseidons are very capable and were the only option able to cover our vast ocean area of responsibility as well as provide the military capabilities for surface and sub-surface operations.
The P-8A will enable us to continue to deploy in a wide range of airborne maritime situations either independently, or effectively with our partners including Australia, the US and the UK (which all operate, or will operate, the P-8A).
Given the larger size and support requirements of the P-8A, to get the best use out of the aircraft’s capabilities, No.5 Squadron and some support elements will need to shift from Whenuapai to RNZAF Base Ohakea. New facilities and support systems will be built at RNZAF Base Ohakea.
In addition to the P-8A purchase, Defence Minister Ron Mark said today he intends bringing business cases to Cabinet in the next two years for a complementary surveillance capability, and for the replacement of the C-130 Hercules fleet.
The complementary capability will share the P-8A burden on lower-end, civilian and military maritime tasks, using options that could include smaller manned aircraft, remotely piloted aircraft systems (RPAS), or satellites.
The Government will consider options for these capabilities during the Defence Capability Plan review, which is due to be completed by the end of this year.
Today’s announcement is a welcome one and ensures that the vitally important maritime patrol capability endures and provides a balanced Defence Force for New Zealand.
Air Marshal Kevin Short
Chief of Defence Force
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madmark
Flight Lieutenant
Posts: 78
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Post by madmark on Jul 9, 2018 15:25:37 GMT 12
Excellent news and the right result for NZ and the RNZAF. Bring on the P-8!!!
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Post by ErrolC on Jul 9, 2018 15:25:53 GMT 12
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Post by Dave Homewood on Jul 9, 2018 15:59:56 GMT 12
It's not, in the conference he said that the P-3's already have to fly to Ohakea to bomb up, which we knew anyway.
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Post by Dave Homewood on Jul 9, 2018 16:02:57 GMT 12
So Ohakea is going to be a happening place soon with NH90's, A109's, Texan II's, P-8 Poseidons, and F-15's in the circuit.
I think it might be sensible to move No. 42 Squadron up to No. 5 Squadron's hangar when the Orions are finally all laid to rest. That would free up a hangar at Ohakea, and allow the Super King Airs to patrol our northern approaches in their training missions. With them there and the Seasprites and No. 40 Squadron it justifies keeping the base open.
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Post by atea on Jul 9, 2018 16:07:09 GMT 12
Must be new hangars and an extension of the runway at Ohakea if they are talking about half of the 2.3B on infrastructure and other associated costs.
Good news that they have gone in the proven direction and also well done to the previous defence ministers as well as Ron Mark for the work they all will have done getting this over the line.
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Post by haughtney1 on Jul 9, 2018 17:00:51 GMT 12
A sensible and practical decision, 6 would have been a better number in my view but having had a “chat” to a US P8 crew in Djibouti recently, its a seriously capable platform...and well understood with its 737 lineage.
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Post by kiwithrottlejockey on Jul 9, 2018 17:24:35 GMT 12
Ron Mark is currently having a very informative discussion with John Campbell on Radio NZ's Checkpoint programme and he has just given an assurance that, unlike the previous government which was planning to close Whenuapai and move everything to Ohakea, that under his watch Whenuapai will remain a RNZAF base. The discussion should be available to download and/or listen to from HERE once it has been archived on the Radio NZ website.  (click on the photograph to view the news story on Radio NZ's website)
UPDATE: The discussion between Ron Mark and John Campbell has now been uploaded to the website and can be accessed HERE. |
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jaybee
Squadron Leader
Posts: 125
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Post by jaybee on Jul 9, 2018 17:26:13 GMT 12
Wonder which kiwi museums will ask for one of the P3 aircraft when they retire?
Interesting to see which Australian museums have acquired a retired RAAF P3 airframe and the different approaches to displaying them.
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Post by Bruce on Jul 9, 2018 17:50:55 GMT 12
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