A-26 Invader in RNZAF

[nuuumannn]

Hi guys, I came across a reference recently that stated that the RAF was looking to acquire the A-26 and share it with Australian and New Zealand squadrons, four RAAF and three RNZAF units, with 240 Invaders being sent to Aussie and 180 to New Zealand. A further 120 were to be allocated to each country in the second half of 1945 and a similar number in 1946. That this never happened is not surprising, but I have two queries;

1. Were these Invaders meant for the (NZ) RAF squadrons (often quoted as RNZAF units in some publications) or, as it states that they were to be sent to New Zealand, for the actual RNZAF? If the latter...

2. Was this request by the British to the USA approved or known about by the New Zealand government? Is there any official mention of the A-26 in RNZAF service in any New Zealand correspondence that anyone knows about?

[Dave Homewood]

Three RNZAF units, and 180 aircraft?

180 aircraft would have been enough to equip 12 squadrons, or at least 10 squadrons and an Operational Training Unit!!

Fascinating. Where did you read about this? I have never heard or come across anything regarding the A-26 being considered for RNZAF service, I don't think.

[markrogers]

I remember reading somewhere a RNZAF draft plan for 1946 as set out by the RNZAF for B-24 Liberators, P-51Ds, Douglas C-54s, and more C-47s. All of that of course was cancelled, except for the first 30 P-51Ds already on the way on the water which of course the Govt of the time had to accept and were mothballed when they arrived, later reactivated to form the Territorial squadrons.
However I didn't see anywhere in it a mention of A-26s. Interesting though about them.

[nuuumannn]

The reference is in the book Foreign Invaders by Dan Hagedorn and Leif Hellstrom. The aircraft for Britain were to be acquired under Lend-Lease, so presumably the Brits were thinking along the lines that the war might go on a bit longer than it did, and yes, 180 does seem like a lot for NZ. According to the text, the British order was written in September 1944.

[tbf2504]

Going invaders for the RNZAF in the Pacific theatre at that stage of the war would not have been a consideration. Remembering that our combat aircraft at that time were all USN types as part of the policy
of fitting in with the US Navy systems. The allocations of the P51's in 1945 was an attempt to get us back into the northern Pacific where the USAAF was the primary force. However, we ran out of hostilities
before that could eventuate. The immediate post-war airforce was based on using aircraft there were already in service, again mostly USN for the combat force.

[nuuumannn]

A bit more on the A-26 in RAF service from two other sources, an order for 140 A-26C (glazed nose) Invaders was placed with the USA through Lend Lease, and three individual aircraft arrived in the UK from USAAF stocks in June 1944 for evaluation, which led to its investigation for the RAF and the order. None of these 140 aircraft were delivered to the UK and the rest of production for the RAF were diverted to the US Navy as JD-1s.

What's as interesting, although without a Kiwi connection is that the Invader was considered for the carriage of the High Ball anti-ship bouncing bomb; its installation being similar to that of the Mosquito and one was kitted out to carry the bombs. This was done in the USA, not the UK, with the intent that the Americans acquire the weapon, and examples were sent to the USA in great secrecy. Trials were carried out and the Invader performed well, despite one bomb bouncing up and hitting the tail of the trial aircraft. Apparently, B-25s, B-26 Marauders and Grumman Avengers were all considered for carrying High Ball in US service at one time, but the idea was canned as the USA decided it didn't have a need for it.

Fascinating stuff.

[McFly]

Mar 4, 2021 16:01:47 GMT 12 nuuumannn said:

What's as interesting, although without a Kiwi connection is that the Invader was considered for the carriage of the High Ball anti-ship bouncing bomb; its installation being similar to that of the Mosquito and one was kitted out to carry the bombs. This was done in the USA, not the UK, with the intent that the Americans acquire the weapon, and examples were sent to the USA in great secrecy. Trials were carried out and the Invader performed well, despite one bomb bouncing up and hitting the tail of the trial aircraft. Apparently, B-25s, B-26 Marauders and Grumman Avengers were all considered for carrying High Ball in US service at one time, but the idea was canned as the USA decided it didn't have a need for it.

Fascinating stuff.

This one...

[nuuumannn]

wow, that's amazing footage. Apparently fitting out of the Invader for carriage of High Ball was done in the UK, by Vickers, who did the Mosquito installation, but the modification kit was dismantled and shipped to the USA, where it was fitted to the doomed aircraft in the clip. Test flights were carried out from Eglin Field, Florida.

[johnnyfalcon]

Obviously didn't refer to the height from which the Mosquitoes released theirs...

So, we didn't get/need 180 A-26s but we got/didn't need 80 Mosquitoes. I know which one I'd prefer

[nuuumannn]

Mar 4, 2021 15:53:45 GMT 12 tbf2504 said:

Going invaders for the RNZAF in the Pacific theatre at that stage of the war would not have been a consideration. Remembering that our combat aircraft at that time were all USN types as part of the policy
of fitting in with the US Navy systems.

Well, this is why I thought it prudent to ask, since the British had designs to share the type with its Allies, so did the thought get beyond the initial suggestion in a report in the UK to a formal statement to the New Zealand government?

[davidd]

That accident looked REALLY nasty! But back to A-26s for RNZAF, I am fairly certain that the RNZAF itself was never advised of any such thing (A-26 allocations), although perhaps the Combined Chiefs of Staff in Washington (hope I have got that standing body described correctly) may have been mulling over such things in latter part of 1944. Pretty well all Allied aircraft in production during latter part of WW2 (except the Russian ones) were allocated in Washington even before they were built, but many of the initial allocations had to be changed due to various pressures and circumstances, often more than once! Of course the Americans kept most of their own aircraft, as did the British, but the smaller, and non-aircraft producing countries had to plead for material assistance, and then be allocated to the nearest or most convenient Allied operational command, who would usually choose the type that they thought would best fit into their particular area. Thus the RNZAF was extremely lucky to be allocated F4U Corsairs and Catalinas for instance, as well as some C-47s and C-60s' also P-40s of course, and TBFs, but we never saw nor heard much of our (allocated) A-24s (Army SBDs). From memory, A-26 production was just getting into its stride when the Pacific war folded up. By 1945 the operational theatre that the RNZAF was placed in (by now known as the South-West Pacific, with RNZAF only occupying bases in the areas to immediate NE of Australia, although Borneo was thought to be the next step forward) was seen to be only requiring single-engine fighter-bombers, certainly so far as the RNZAF contribution was concerned. By January 1945 the RNZAF was aware that the Americans no longer required us very much in the SWPA, and our PV-1s were by now a dwindling asset with nothing that they could do being very much in demand at the front line; the decision to run down the RNZAF's Ventura force had already been taken by the Americans, with our first squadron disbanded in late March, another in June, and two more shortly after that. The final two squadrons were to remain on operations in the NORSOLS area into early 1946, but of course that never happened after the Atomic bombs. The A-26 never showed up on the RNZAF's "Lend-Lease" delivery schedules in either 1944, or 1945. The surfeit of new American aircraft and units still flowing to forward operational areas to increase the pressure on the surviving axis was astonishing, with sixteen new squadrons of USMC PBJs (Mitchells) being scheduled to build up the medium bomber strength in the SWPA from late 1944 onwards. Even the Americans soon realized that good military targets were just not available for such a force, and they felt that construction of the additional airfields required to accommodate the last four or so squadrons ready to depart the US of A could not really be justified.
David D

[nuuumannn]

Thanks for the context, Dave. Since the Brits eventually cancelled their A-26 order before a single example was delivered, although a few were completed and test flown in British roundels and serials, I guess little is going to exist on it. In context, it does seem strange that the Brits should have put forward the suggestion that the RAAF and RNZAF should have them, with a specified number of airframes too, which suggests a contextual usage, otherwise, what would cause the writer of the report to come up with those figures?

A-26s did see combat with the USAAF in WW2, briefly in the Pacific in 1944, then with the 9th AF from the UK in late '44 onwards, with one unit in Italy operating A-20s and A-26s alongside each other during the last few months of the war. Great aircraft.

[nuuumannn]

Mar 4, 2021 17:41:55 GMT 12 johnnyfalcon said:

Obviously didn't refer to the height from which the Mosquitoes released theirs...

So, we didn't get/need 180 A-26s but we got/didn't need 80 Mosquitoes. I know which one I'd prefer

Here's a YT clip about the project, with at 27 seconds the Mosquito beginning its run-in. It's a tad higher than the Invader and you can see just how high the bomb bounces.



That would have been an interesting situation, the RNZAF operating Invaders instead of Mossies. Zac, how about a model?

Royal Museum 71

This particular aircraft has an intriguing history, it was used to fly lobsters to Turkey from Belgium (!), but was impounded at Antwerp and has been placed in the big museum in the centre of Brussels.

[McFly]

Here's some photos (albeit small...!) of an RAF A-26 Invader during trials at the 'Royal Air Force's Aeroplane & Armament Experimental Establishment (A&AEE)', and an article below which references the RNZAF allocation of A-26 Invaders (Original Link Here)



Abstract:
"By late September, the requirements had once again changed and the Air Ministry decided to request enough Invaders to equip three Royal New Zealand Air Force and four Royal Australian Air Force squadrons during the first half of 1945. This requirement stated that the RAAF would need 240 A-26 and the RNZAF 180 during that period. Further, 120 Invaders would be required for each air force during the second half of 1945 and a similar number for the first half of 1946. Since none of this was transacted, the idea must have been dropped soon after the initial request."

[Dave Homewood]

Here is a really old thread about other types the RNZAF nearly got, or were rumoured to be getting:

rnzaf.proboards.com/thread/1269/rnzaf-pacific-war

[Deleted]

This is all fascinating. 180 of them!! I had no clue.

Mar 4, 2021 19:12:07 GMT 12 nuuumannn said:

That would have been an interesting situation, the RNZAF operating Invaders instead of Mossies. Zac, how about a model?

Send the kit, I'll get it done!

[markrogers]

Fascinating!

[nuuumannn]

Mar 4, 2021 20:14:57 GMT 12 McFly said:

Here's some photos (albeit small...!) of an RAF A-26 Invader during trials at the 'Royal Air Force's Aeroplane & Armament Experimental Establishment (A&AEE)', and an article below which references the RNZAF allocation of A-26 Invaders (Original Link Here)



Abstract:
"By late September, the requirements had once again changed and the Air Ministry decided to request enough Invaders to equip three Royal New Zealand Air Force and four Royal Australian Air Force squadrons during the first half of 1945. This requirement stated that the RAAF would need 240 A-26 and the RNZAF 180 during that period. Further, 120 Invaders would be required for each air force during the second half of 1945 and a similar number for the first half of 1946. Since none of this was transacted, the idea must have been dropped soon after the initial request."

Good stuff McFly, but a wee error in the article, the A&AEE evaluated three Invaders, not two. The first was the USAAF A-26B that was inducted into the RAF, but never wore British markings, it's mentioned in the text. The other two were A-26Cs 43-22479, KL690 and 43-22482, KL691, again, mentioned. Of the latter two, the former was used for armament and handling trials at the A&AEE Boscombe Down and the latter went to Cunliffe Owen for fitting out, then went to A&AEE Boscombe Down for armament trials beginning in July 1945 before being returned to the USA in 1947. The first one in the pictures, KL692 was the first of the RAF order built by Douglas and was taken in the USA. It never reached the UK.

[davidd]

It would seem that, although all sorts of planning was underway in Washington and London, nobody had thought to advise the NZ (and presume Australian) governments of these A-26 delivery plans. I have read through most of the RNZAF's files on RNZAF expansion and re-equipment from 1942 to 1945, and so far as I can recall, A-26s were never mentioned, or even hinted at.

It also causes me some frustration to read in numerous accounts that "Lend-Lease" aircraft were "ordered" or "chosen" by recipient governments, when this was rarely, it ever the case. Priority and choice of new military aircraft for aircraft-deficient air forces was the responsibility of various bodies in London, but more particularly the USA (think Washington DC) where there were several layers of administrators whose sole job was to consider all the claims ("bids" would be a better word) from around the World for new (or even used) aircraft, and, taking into consideration the actual strategic and tactical situations in all theatres, come up with the "right answers" for all concerned. It would seem that the main influence as to what types of aircraft were chosen for any theatre, just happened to be the senior military commander of that theatre, whether he be British, American, or any other nationality, who would be relying on what his own group of specialists and experts had to say on the subject. National governments of all but the largest and most powerful countries seldom if ever had much if any say in the matter. Beggars could not be choosers. Somebody had to accept those types that nobody else was interested in; thus NZ and Australia had to accept the B-34 Venturas against their better judgement, although to be fair, they really had no idea that these particularly Venturas had a few problems, and were second hand, a point they only learned of shortly before they arrived in the country, although a belated apology was received from "our man" in Washington.
David D

[tbf2504]

As David states, the allocation of aircraft was controlled by a combinned board in Washington. We got what they dictated. An interesting side story to this was the allocation of the P40-N which had
no blind flying panel. As the foke-lore goes one of the New Zealand advisors on the board in Washington was asked about the New Zealand weather patterns. Of course he was loud in the praise of our
beautiful weather with clear sunny skies, etc,etc. Based on that advice the decision was made that we only needed "day" fighters with no need for a blind flying panel.