B-17 Bomber Paint Vs No Paint, Unexpected Results

[Antonio]

Interesting

[Dave Homewood]

An interesting video, and the RNZAF found the same thing with painting the Mustangs made them faster and more efficient too.

But he is dead wrong in saying the "B-17 bomber flew its first mission in the European theatre in August 1942."

The RAF started to fly B-17C Flying Fortress bombers over a year before that. Wikipedia states:

"While the Short Stirling and Handley Page Halifax became its primary bombers by 1941, in early 1940, the RAF entered into an agreement with the U.S. Army Air Corps to acquire 20 B-17Cs, which were given the service name Fortress I. Their first operation, against Wilhelmshaven on 8 July 1941 was unsuccessful. On 24 July three B-17s of 90 Squadron took part in a raid on the German capital ship Gneisenau and Prinz Eugen anchored in Brest from 30,000 ft (9,100 m), with the objective of drawing German fighters away from 18 Handley Page Hampdens attacking at lower altitudes, and in time for 79 Vickers Wellingtons to attack later with the German fighters refuelling. The operation did not work as expected, with 90 Squadron's Fortresses being unopposed.

By September, the RAF had lost eight B-17Cs in combat and had experienced numerous mechanical problems, and Bomber Command abandoned daylight bombing raids using the Fortress I because of the aircraft's poor performance. The experience showed both the RAF and USAAF that the B-17C was not ready for combat, and that improved defenses, larger bomb loads and more accurate bombing methods were required. However, the USAAF continued using the B-17 as a day bomber, despite misgivings by the RAF that attempts at daylight bombing would be ineffective.

[nuuumannn]

Oct 12, 2022 12:28:35 GMT 12 Dave Homewood said:

An interesting video, and the RNZAF found the same thing with painting the Mustangs made them faster and more efficient too.

But he is dead wrong in saying the "B-17 bomber flew its first mission in the European theatre in August 1942."

The RAF started to fly B-17C Flying Fortress bombers over a year before that. Wikipedia states:

"While the Short Stirling and Handley Page Halifax became its primary bombers by 1941, in early 1940, the RAF entered into an agreement with the U.S. Army Air Corps to acquire 20 B-17Cs, which were given the service name Fortress I. Their first operation, against Wilhelmshaven on 8 July 1941 was unsuccessful. On 24 July three B-17s of 90 Squadron took part in a raid on the German capital ship Gneisenau and Prinz Eugen anchored in Brest from 30,000 ft (9,100 m), with the objective of drawing German fighters away from 18 Handley Page Hampdens attacking at lower altitudes, and in time for 79 Vickers Wellingtons to attack later with the German fighters refuelling. The operation did not work as expected, with 90 Squadron's Fortresses being unopposed.

By September, the RAF had lost eight B-17Cs in combat and had experienced numerous mechanical problems, and Bomber Command abandoned daylight bombing raids using the Fortress I because of the aircraft's poor performance. The experience showed both the RAF and USAAF that the B-17C was not ready for combat, and that improved defenses, larger bomb loads and more accurate bombing methods were required. However, the USAAF continued using the B-17 as a day bomber, despite misgivings by the RAF that attempts at daylight bombing would be ineffective.

Yers indeed, I've had this conversation with a few people, Americans included about the RAF's use of the B-17C/Fortress I, which was less than satisfactory. There isn't a huge amount of published material out there in detail about the raids and the RAF's use of the type, so much searching needs to be done about it. The wiki article is good in the information presented and draws accurate conclusions in stating the aircraft was not ready for operations. Serviceability was the main problem as mentioned, but its operational readiness was curtailed by simply being unable to perform the tasks the USAAC stated it could.

The arrangement of the RAF operating the type was done with the full support of the USAAC, as the bomber was in service in only small numbers at the time; Boeing production rate was not high and within the year between 1940 and end of 1941 the company had only produced around 40 aircraft. A far cry from what was later achieved. The USAAC's principal bomber type was the B-18 Bolo, which was certainly unsuited for operations in Europe as it had poorer performance, load carrying capability, defensive armament than European bombers in use at the time. Nevertheless, a team of US observers went with the Forts to the UK, including civilian medical personnel to research the effects of high altitude flying on aircrew.

The unserviceability that plagued the aircraft made itself known almost immediately on arrival and it took 90 Sqn three months to become operational on the Fort. The first losses of the type were not on operations but were purely accidental and hinted at issues to come. One aircraft was burnt out on the ground following an engine fire that spread rapidly. The second was a bit of a mystery and I remember reading about this years back from records in that the investigators couldn't figure out what happened to the aircraft - it had clearly suffered massive structural failure in flight, the cause of which was unknown and untraceable. It turned out that at an altitude of 33,000 ft the aircraft's flight controls iced up to the extent that it became uncontrollable and dived into the ground, killing all aboard. Obviously, by the time the wreckage reached the ground the ice had melted.

This icing issue affected that first raid in July 1941 in that of the three aircraft that took part in the raid, only one dropped its bombs on the target. The second iced up so badly that a deep vibration set in and so the pilot descended and decided to return home. The third aircraft's bomb bay doors refused to open, although I'm not sure if it was icing or mechanical unreliability that led to that happening. During that raid, the bombers were intercepted by Bf 109s, but these struggled to reach the Forts, but if they had, it could have been curtains for the British because their guns had frozen and were inoperable.

It's worth noting that when the US 8th AF arrived in Britain it believed that its Forts should fly unescorted daylight raids. The British said this was a bad idea and it took a few months of operations to prove to the Americans that it was. They certainly had learned some of the lessons from the Fortress I debacle in 1941, as the aircraft had improved defensive armament, including power turrets (the B-17C was armed with five manually operated machine guns only) and were not so affected by icing, but not all of them.