RAF Instructors Sent to New Zealand in 1939

[Dave Homewood]

I am sure we have previously discussed the RAF instructors who came out to New Zealand to train up RNZAF personnel before the war, but I am not sure where that thread is. I just came across this and thought it worth posting. From the New Zealand Herald dated 2nd of May 1939:

THE AIR FORCE

BRITISH INSTRUCTORS

TECHNICAL TRAINING WORK

PASSENGERS BY RIMUTAKA

[From our own correspondent] LONDON, April 13

Seven fully qualified technical instructors with wide experience as instructors in the Royal Air Force are due to arrive at Auckland in the Rimutaka on June 1 to assist with the rapid expansion of the Royal New Zealand Air Force. They are the first of the men to whom the Minister of Defence, the Hon. F. Jones, referred last February as the "competent personnel" to be loaned by the Royal Air Force.

With the exception of one man, they will all take the rank of sergeant, and they will be stationed in different parts of the Dominion. Four of them are aero engine fitters, two are wireless electrical mechanics, and one is a fitter-armourer. Five are married, and they will be accompanied by their wives and children.

The aero engine fitters are Sergeant J. R. Terry, Corporal H. V. Norman, Mr. J. A. Hughes, and Leading Aircraftsman C. De Wild; the wireless electrical mechanics are Mr. J. W. Todd and Mr. W. F. Coulson. Corporal F. Hiom is the fitter-armourer. Mr. Hughes will not take the rank of sergeant with the New Zealand Royal Air Force, but will remain a civilian instructor.

All of the men answered an order for application issued by the New Zealand Government in London and published in the Royal Air Force weekly orders. Further men are also to be sent to New Zealand, and several are to be interviewed. There is some difficulty, however, in securing instructors for New Zealand, since they are needed by the Royal Air Force in Britain. The Rimutaka is due to sail from England on April 27.

[thomarse]

I'm keen to hear more of these gentlemen's careers here in NZ. Did any remain here? I don't recognise any names

[davidd]

I imagine that most would have returned to the UK, probably in latter part of war, but I do know that a few RAF types (Britons) who were sent to NZ early in the war for various duties, flying and technical, decided to remain in NZ permanently. One of them was an engineer officer, and he served out rest of his career in RNZAF postwar. We also had another RAF chap as a Museum guide after he retired, although he has since died, well in his 90's I think. We also had quite a number of RAF chaps washed up in New Zealand after the debacle of Singapore, mostly technical staff.

[tbf2504]

Some of them went to the E&W School at Wigram which was just setting up and taught the latest RAF skills in the various electrical/wireless mechanics and wireless operator techniques.

[Dave Homewood]

Of course a good number of RAF personnel were brought over in 1942 too to help the RAF set up their fighter squadrons and their air defence system. Some were Kiwis who had been serving with the RAF and were experienced fighter pilots (like John Gibson and Bob Spurdle), or fighter controllers, etc., while others were Brits in the RAF such as the wonderful Eric Marsden who gave a brilliant interview to the IWM about his experiences. See here for more on that.
rnzaf.proboards.com/thread/28612/brilliant-iwm-interview-eric-marsden

[errolmartyn]

Feb 28, 2023 20:09:26 GMT 12 Dave Homewood said:

I am sure we have previously discussed the RAF instructors who came out to New Zealand to train up RNZAF personnel before the war, but I am not sure where that thread is. I just came across this and thought it worth posting. From the New Zealand Herald dated 2nd of May 1939:

THE AIR FORCE

BRITISH INSTRUCTORS

TECHNICAL TRAINING WORK

PASSENGERS BY RIMUTAKA

[From our own correspondent] LONDON, April 13

Seven fully qualified technical instructors with wide experience as instructors in the Royal Air Force are due to arrive at Auckland in the Rimutaka on June 1 to assist with the rapid expansion of the Royal New Zealand Air Force. They are the first of the men to whom the Minister of Defence, the Hon. F. Jones, referred last February as the "competent personnel" to be loaned by the Royal Air Force.

With the exception of one man, they will all take the rank of sergeant, and they will be stationed in different parts of the Dominion. Four of them are aero engine fitters, two are wireless electrical mechanics, and one is a fitter-armourer. Five are married, and they will be accompanied by their wives and children.

The aero engine fitters are Sergeant J. R. Terry, Corporal H. V. Norman, Mr. J. A. Hughes, and Leading Aircraftsman C. De Wild; the wireless electrical mechanics are Mr. J. W. Todd and Mr. W. F. Coulson. Corporal F. Hiom is the fitter-armourer. Mr. Hughes will not take the rank of sergeant with the New Zealand Royal Air Force, but will remain a civilian instructor.

All of the men answered an order for application issued by the New Zealand Government in London and published in the Royal Air Force weekly orders. Further men are also to be sent to New Zealand, and several are to be interviewed. There is some difficulty, however, in securing instructors for New Zealand, since they are needed by the Royal Air Force in Britain. The Rimutaka is due to sail from England on April 27.

Herewith, some details about the personnel mentioned in the above article:

Sergeant J. R. Terry - actually John Reginald Torry – ex-RAF Fitter, became NZ39450, renumbered 70199 in Jan 1949

Corporal H. V. Norman – Herbert V. Norman became NZ39446

Mr. J. A. Hughes – actually Alfred Alan Hughes, became NZ39448 (ex-RAF 59123, then civilian instructor) and see page 263 of By Such Deeds, also page 163 of J M S Ross’ history of the RNZAF

Leading Aircraftman C. De Wild – Charles De Wild – ex-civilian instructor, became NZ39443

Mr. J. W. Todd – became NZ39449, renumbered 70228 in Jan 1949, and see page 480 of By Such Deeds

Mr. W. F. Coulson – Wilfred Francis Coulson, became NZ39447 (ex-RAF 506176) – killed in flying accident 24 Sep 45 (see For Your Tomorrow Vols 2 and 3)

Corporal F. Hiom – Frank Hiom, ex-RAF Fitter, became NZ39445 (ex-RNAS F43924, RAF 243924)

Missing from this above batch of RNZAF numbers is NZ39444, but this was allotted to a F. Butler who was later renumbered 70516 in Jan 1949. No known RAF connection and was not on the Rimutaka sailing.

Errol

[Dave Homewood]

ENGLISH AIR OFFICER

SERVICE IN DOMINION

NEW WELLINGTON BOMBERS

FINEST TYPE IN THE WORLD

Seconded for service with the Royal Now Zealand Air Force for two years, Flight-Lieutenant J. T. Brown, an engineer officer of the Royal Air Force, arrived from England by the Rimutaka yesterday. He will be stationed at Wigram.

While he declined to comment on service matters, Flight-Lieutenant Brown, who has had 26 years in the force, expressed the view that New Zealand had done well in ordering Vickers Wellington aeroplanes. He said that he was familiar with the type, which is still on the secret list, and considered it to he the finest medium bomber built anywhere in the world.

Before the first flight of perhaps six of the 30 machines ordered by New Zealand left England for the Dominion later this year, No. 99 Squadron. R.A.F., using the same type of machine, planned a non-stop flight from Mildenhall to Egypt, he said. Mildenhall became known throughout the world as the starting-place of the Melbourne centenary air race.

Information gained on this flight would be of value to the New Zealanders about to fly to the Dominion, Flight-Lieutenant Brown added. He said he had visited the Vickers factory, where the Wellingtons were built, and had also met some of the senior New Zealand officers sent to England to man the machines.

NEW ZEALAND HERALD, 1 JUNE 1939

[davidd]

I take it the RAF plans for the flight to Egypt were never executed?

[davidd]

Note that Flight Lieutenant (later Squadron Leader I think) J T Brown was to end his RAF (and RNZAF) career in rather spectacular fashion in (I think) 1942 or 43; I presume he was sent back to the UK thereafter, although this may not be correct. This was a very sad end to a long and otherwise unblemished career in the RAF.

[Dave Homewood]

AIR FORCE EXPANSION

TRAINING OF PERSONNEL

INSTRUCTORS FROM OVERSEAS

[by TELEGRAPH —PKF.SS association] DUNEDIN, Saturday

The Minister of Defence, the Hon. F. Jones, states that in a few days 11 men from overseas will begin appointments with the Air Department. They are Squadron-Leader Keogh, an engineer officer who is due by the Tamaroa on June 15, to be posted to Air Headquarters, and later to take charge of technical training; Flight-Lieutenant Calder, arriving on the same date, to be chief flying instructor at Wigram; and the following eight technical instructors for the civil reserve:—Sergeants Baldwin and Torry and Corporals Hughes, Norman, Hiom and Todd, and aircraftsmen Dewild and Coulson. A civil appointee also on the Tamaroa is Mr. A. G. Hill, who will supervise operating methods and flying personnel.

NEW ZEALAND HERALD, 5 JUNE 1939

[errolmartyn]

Mar 2, 2023 20:21:15 GMT 12 Dave Homewood said:

AIR FORCE EXPANSION

TRAINING OF PERSONNEL

INSTRUCTORS FROM OVERSEAS

[by TELEGRAPH —PKF.SS association] DUNEDIN, Saturday

The Minister of Defence, the Hon. F. Jones, states that in a few days 11 men from overseas will begin appointments with the Air Department. They are Squadron-Leader Keogh, an engineer officer who is due by the Tamaroa on June 15, to be posted to Air Headquarters, and later to take charge of technical training; Flight-Lieutenant Calder, arriving on the same date, to be chief flying instructor at Wigram; and the following eight technical instructors for the civil reserve:—Sergeants Baldwin and Torry and Corporals Hughes, Norman, Hiom and Todd, and aircraftsmen Dewild and Coulson. A civil appointee also on the Tamaroa is Mr. A. G. Hill, who will supervise operating methods and flying personnel.

NEW ZEALAND HERALD, 5 JUNE 1939

'Mr. A.G. Hill' was Arthur Gerald Hill who had served in WWI, firstly with the Artist Rifles then the RFC & RAF as 24074. He was commissioned into RNZAF (from the British RAFO) as a Flight Lieutenant on 9 Oct 39 and was allotted official number NZ1127 in Sep 1941. Interestingly, he was earlier also granted a Pilot's Commercial 'B' Licence (No 178) by Air Department on 27 Jul 39. Hill returned to England in 1945 and died in Kenya on 8 Nov 1954.

Errol

[fwx]

Mar 2, 2023 19:58:33 GMT 12 davidd said:

Note that Flight Lieutenant (later Squadron Leader I think) J T Brown was to end his RAF (and RNZAF) career in rather spectacular fashion in (I think) 1942 or 43; I presume he was sent back to the UK thereafter, although this may not be correct. This was a very sad end to a long and otherwise unblemished career in the RAF.

Wing Commander in fact, and awarded an OBE in Jan 1942.

So no doubt it was extremely embarrassing for his superiors when later that year, in his role as Engineering Officer at RNZAF Wigram, he was discovered to have been demanding a 20% "commission" on orders placed with a local Christchurch engineering firm.

Court-martialled, dismissed from His Majesty's Service and sent back to the UK.

[ErrolC]

Mar 2, 2023 19:58:33 GMT 12 davidd said:

Note that Flight Lieutenant (later Squadron Leader I think) J T Brown was to end his RAF (and RNZAF) career in rather spectacular fashion in (I think) 1942 or 43; I presume he was sent back to the UK thereafter, although this may not be correct. This was a very sad end to a long and otherwise unblemished career in the RAF.

Does 'otherwise unblemished' mean it was the first time he got caught I wonder?

[Dave Homewood]

Very enterprising, but not good in a time of war.

[Dave Homewood]

TRAINING AIRMEN

PARTY FROM ENGLAND

ON LOAN TO DOMINION

NEW ZEALANDER'S DUTIES

To assist in the training of young New Zealand airmen and ground staff, a flying officer, a warrant officer and 12 non-commissioned officers have arrived in the Dominion from England. The officer is a New Zealander, Flying Officer C. A. Turner, formerly of New Plymouth, who has been transferred to the Royal New Zealand Air Force after serving with the Royal Air Force in England for four and a-half years. The remainder of the party are members of the Royal Air Force on loan to the Dominion.

A tribute to the party was paid by the captain of the ship on which they travelled to New Zealand. "I cannot speak too highly of them," he said, "They were marvellous and helped us no end. They gave us great assistanca in keeping watch, and their cheerfulness and voluntary work has been an example to us all."


FLYING-OFFICER TURNER