Corsair NZ5648

[Peter Lewis]

Can I be bold enough to float the remote possibility that the airframe NZ5648 that departed our shores in 1971 is not the same airframe that returned as G-BXUL in 2006?

[shorty]

Given the problems it encountered when it arrived in North America anything is a possibility depending on the integrity of the importer.

[angelsonefive]

Jan 21, 2010 22:15:05 GMT 12 Peter Lewis said:

Can I be bold enough to float the remote possibility that the airframe NZ5648 that departed our shores in 1971 is not the same airframe that returned as G-BXUL in 2006?

A possibility, certainly.

More likely though, it is a matter of another aircraft's data plate replacing a missing one.
NZ 5648's original data plate may well have 'disappeared' between 1949 and 1971.
As the FAA requires restored a/c to have a data plate before a plane can be placed on the US civil register, plates from total wrecks can turn up on restorations.

[patrick]

Jan 20, 2010 19:06:31 GMT 12 shamus said:

Sorry Nev. I don't know the answer to your question but was it Frank Bish that you were referring to. He was with Motat at the time. Don't know if he was a pilot or not but believe he has passed on to the great aerodrome in the sky.

Just resurrecting an old thread - Frank Bish was my grandfather, and yes, he was a pilot, in fact Josephine was the Corsair he flew in the pacific in the latter half of WW2. I am not sure about the airframe/serial number confusion - I will try and dig out his memoirs and see if there is a reference to it.

[camtech]

From my recollection of the story, as told by several at MotaT and Frank Bish himself, the aircraft was painted as NZ5611 - Josephine because he had flown the aircraft on occaision.
Patrick, it would be great to confirm dates and places if possible.

I also learned that Corsairs have no cockpit floor and it was not good practice to drop anything, as retrieval was an upside down affair! Spent many hours on this beast at MoTaT cleaning and replacing components.

[trx850]

Jan 20, 2010 17:56:03 GMT 12 angelsonefive said:

Jan 20, 2010 16:17:04 GMT 12 Dave Homewood said:

The Warbird Registry reckons this aircraft is Bu. 88391, if that helps?

www.warbirdregistry.org/corsairregistry/fg1-88391.html

The page is way out of date and has some spelling errors though

Joe Baugher's list of US Navy and Marine Corps Bureau Numbers home.att.net/~jbaugher/thirdseries9.html states that BuNo.88391 is actually correct for Corsair c/n 3205/NZ5648.

Mr Baugher goes on to state that the a/c was registered in the UK as G-BXUL and painted in USN colours with the false BuNo. 92844 applied.
92844 was allocated to an FG-1D the contract for which was cancelled, the no. was then allocated to a Ryan Fireball, also cancelled.
.

And here's the line for her from the RNZAF's aircraft files:

NZ5648 CORSAIR F.G.1-D 3305 92044 P23823 1945 JOHN WISE 17/08/1945 C.A.U. LOS NEGROS LOS NEGROS

Bu.No.88391 isn't even in their list for RNZAF Corsairs!
I have found a few errors on Joe's site regarding RNZAF aircraft.

Cheers,
Pete M.

[Dave Homewood]

Welcome to the forum Patrick. Do you happen to have any photos of your grandfather's RNZAF days or the restoration of this aircraft that you can perhaps scan and post for us to see? I'd be keen to learn more about his memoirs too, did he write a book?

[patrick]

Jul 31, 2010 22:47:56 GMT 12 Dave Homewood said:

Welcome to the forum Patrick. Do you happen to have any photos of your grandfather's RNZAF days or the restoration of this aircraft that you can perhaps scan and post for us to see? I'd be keen to learn more about his memoirs too, did he write a book?

He wrote a small booklet of memoirs that he distributed to the kids and grandkids (he fathered 12 kids!) and I have a copy squirrelled away somewhere which might contain some wartime photos, I am moving house in the next week so I will keep an eye out for it when we unpack and see if there are any photos worth scanning. BTW - Josephine was my grandmas name, Franks girlfriend during the war; and wife afterwards.

[Richard Wesley]

I worked with Frank at Motat for many years and enjoyed his stories of the war and working on some of the aircraft that were no longer at the museum when I arrived (such as Josephine and her replacement). I too would be very interested in seeing any photos if you do find the booklet.

[juddygirl]

In answer to an older question about Frank Bish. Yes he was a pilot and the Corsair was named after his wife Josephine. Grandpa (Frank) died a couple of years ago. If you want to know about the rebuilding of Josephine the best person to contact would be my father Mike Bish [e-mail] as he helped with the rebuild from start to finish. Josephine (Frank's wife) was a teacher, and Frank used to do dive bombs over the school yard while courting her. Josephine is still alive but in a rest home now.

[Dave Homewood]

Welcome juddygirl, thanks for that.

[snaphead]

If I could add a photo to this interesting thread.

It was taken in 1958 (with my box browny) . We lived in Te Awamutu at that stage so one fine Sunday afternoon I lept on my trusty Raleigh cycle and bike to Aspins Garage to have a look at this bird. The amount of traffic was negliagable, so didn't worry me.

[Dave Homewood]

Nice!!

[baz62]

Nice photo Pete. Which reminds me that I still have some of your "vintage" photos and one or two books of yours.
Baz

[snaphead]

Hi Baz

Thanks for the reminder of photos and books. I'm out of town next week so will contact you after I return, by e-mail or contacting Vicky (if there is still anybody there at IHL).

Am currently trying to locate some pix you may not have seen, Hastings beheading, Sunderland, low flying B-17, and my trip in-flight refueling an AWEACKS - this may need to be converted from slides.

[davidd]

I had an idea that the colour scheme for the restored "Josephine" was based on another Corsair, and a check of the history of Frank Bish and his time in RNZAF reveals the answer. After completing his training at Woodbourne (and a brief and fruitless posting to No. 26 Dive Bomber squadron at Ardmore), Frank (along with the rest of that unit's pilots) was posted to the new No. 20 Squadron also at Ardmore (flying P-40s and Harvards), then undertook his first operational tour with this squadron at Espiritu Santo, then Bougainville (from Torokina strip) between 19 April and 21 June 1944. Although he flew practically every Corsair on the strength of his unit, his favourite was F4U-1 No. 11, which was in fact NZ5211, which he flew some 15 times between 4/4 and 21/6/44. After returning to NZ, he was posted to 23 Squadron and flew one tour with them, at Ardmore, E/Santo, G/Canal, Bougainville (this time at Piva) and Los Negros. He returned to NZ and completed a third tour with yet another squadron, this time No. 26 (Ardmore, then Guadalcanal and Bougainville/Piva for a third time.) His last flight in RNZAF was on 10/6/45, after which he returned to NZ and was transferred to the Reserve by mid-September 1945. He never flew NZ5211 again, and also never flew one of the new FG-1Ds, as these were at Los Negros and were not even flying by the time Frank returned to NZ. So NZ5211 was the original "Josephine", although I have yet to see a photograph of it so painted. This aircraft was badly damaged in an accident at Torokina on 11/7/44 while being flown by another squadron, and was subsequently written off. I was given a brief summary of Frank's log book by Charles Darby about 30 years ago, and a check of the 20 Squadron unit history confirms all the details.
David D

[komata]

Although this thread hasn't been active since March 30, 2013, I have only just found it while 'exploring; the site. I am writing is response to John L'S question on 20 January 2010 in which he asked if 'Josephine' became airborne during her display at the opening of the Hamilton airport in 1966?

The answer is a very definite yes, she DID become airborne at the Hamilton airport opening, reaching a height of approximately 30 feet while so-doing. This 'height' is however only my estimate, as I was 'somewhat busy' at the time; it is only a guess. Getting into the air was not of course the intention of Mr. Bish who was 'Pilot in charge' at the time. 'Josephine' literally 'got away on him' and the 'flight' (more a 'hop' ) was totally unintentional. The problem was compounded by the fact that the ailerons and elevators were all ‘wired shut’ ('Locked' if you will) on CAD’s instructions to preclude any such foolishness occurring. As a result, the only control available to whomever was 'piloting' the aircraft was the rudder!!  In a 'normal' ground-running ('high-speed' run) situation such as was being envisaged, this would not have been a problem; as the rudder would be used  to turn/weave (and see where one was going) and the wheel brakes would be to slow everything down down and bring the aircraft to a stop. That at least was the avowed intention. 

The ‘high-speed run’ commenced from the southern end of the runway, but things became  little bit fraught when the power was applied.  Basic aerodynamics took-over and Josephine lifted-off the runway!!  This was not exactly what had been intended, especially (as previously-noted) there were no effective flying controls; only a rudder. 

On becoming airborne (‘At take-off’) Josephine 'crabbed' to the right, passing over the junction of the 'turn-off' taxiway to the terminal as a result. This placed her on a heading directly towards a large group of spectators on the hillside (behind the fence) to the north of the new terminal building.

I was standing close-to the previously-mentioned 'junction' and Josephine’s starboard wing passed almost directly over me, to the extent that I wound-up ‘hugging the grass’ as it went by. The aircraft was fortunately high-enough to make the tail wheel miss me (although it seemed very close as it went past) , while giving me a view of the pilot struggling furiously with the controls, as he was trying to divert the aircraft way from the spectators. Looking upwards at a rapidly-retreating aircraft that has just attempted to give one a haircut, does give you a somewhat-different perspective. I had a cheap camera with me at the time and took two pics looking ‘upwards’ at the departing machine. Sadly, the impact with the grass had jammed the shutter, so the photos were never actually exposed (although I didn’t know that at the time), a pity as they would have been somewhat ‘unusual’.

Although it seemed to take an absolute age to accomplish (and was really only a matter of seconds) Mr. Bish was eventually able to do direct Josephine back towards the runway and persuade her to land. With only the rudder available, I gather he had a few ‘problems’ while doing-so. He landed Josephine at a fairly high speed about three-quarters of the way along the runway and caused a brake-drum (the port one from memory) to overheat while trying to slow everything down, as there was not a lot of runway available for the purpose… Having landed, and with the brake-drum now cooling-down ‘Josephine’ was taxied back to a position near the terminal building and parked. The brake drum was carefully inspected after everything had been closed down. Meanwhile, ‘the show went on’ and other parts of the display took the public’s attention.

I was present when Mr.Bish climbed-down from the cockpit.  He seemed quite calm about what had just occurred, and I have long-held a sneaking suspicion that despite the 'control-limitations' and the difficulties that were encountered, Mr. Bish was not exactly unpleased with the fact that he had actually managed to get the aircraft into the air.   There is of course no way of confirming this, but, as I said, the suspicion is there.  'Just for old-times sake' perhaps.....?

Oddly, after Josephine’s ‘escapade’ the general public, who before her display had been all around and had queued-up to look inside the cockpit, almost studiously ignored her for the rest of the afternoon.  It almost seemed as though she had committed some shameful act by daring to fly. Certainly, from my perspective in her cockpit (a tale for another time, perhaps), public interest was almost zero for the rest of the day.

A rather long-reply, and my apologies for the length, but yes, John L, ‘Josephine’ DID become airborne on the day the Hamilton airport opened in 1966.

Hoping that this has been of interest.

[Peter Lewis]

Thanks for that confirmation komata.

[Dave Homewood]

Fantastic memories and great detail there Komata, thanks for posting that.

[suthg]

Wonderful story, it aligns somewhat with the Wellington Airport opening and the two embarrassing damaged aircraft there - the Vulcan bomber just averted a major catastrophe although had to crash land at Ohakea with a broken undercarriage, and the Sunderland Flying boat skidding on the tarmac on her belly picking up some asphalt on the way. At least the Corsair was not damaged and was suitably landed and parked.