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Post by phil on Apr 1, 2012 13:45:17 GMT 12
Also, I'm interested in Phil82's comment about some rather pink looking Air Force personnel that had been standing out in the sun all day without hats - do RNZAF personnel even get issued with wide-brimmed hats nowadays, or only the baseball caps? Yes there is an issue wide brimmed hat, and the dress instructions that were promulgated for the event (that I saw for pers travelling from WP) stated this was an approved head dress. |
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Post by kiwithrottlejockey on Apr 1, 2012 13:45:54 GMT 12
I just found the following video clip of the F/A-18 display on YouTube....
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Post by aeromedia on Apr 1, 2012 14:11:45 GMT 12
God bless Australia! That F/A 18 four ship was tighter than a fishes arse!
Anyone know whether the Harvards were returning to Ardmore before making their way south this week? I'd have thought they would hold there a few days.
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Post by jpschulze on Apr 1, 2012 14:20:31 GMT 12
FANTASTIC SHOW, FANTASTIC DAY! Had a blast...and thanks to Air NZ offcourse.
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Post by corsair67 on Apr 1, 2012 14:22:57 GMT 12
God bless Australia! That F/A 18 four ship was tighter than a fishes arse! I'm just waiting for someone to say, "the Skyhawks would have been lower!" ;D Did the four perform an airfield attack or two vs one engagement after their display? |
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Post by mumbles on Apr 1, 2012 14:25:14 GMT 12
Wow, just got back home from Palmy, a lot of catch up reading to do in this thread ;D
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Post by mumbles on Apr 1, 2012 14:28:37 GMT 12
Just a note I received by email tonight from Brendon Deere, he says there were no issues with his Spitfire, just that the airshow co-ordinators considered the show was running too long and so cut the Spitfire two-ship flypast and Sean's display. Umm, wow  . Possibly one of the worst on-the-day rescheduling decisions I can think of. I can think of at least two nothing-to-do-with-the-RNZAF displays that could have been chopped instead. Techinal issues I can handle, but that is just poor. |
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Post by mumbles on Apr 1, 2012 14:31:12 GMT 12
Agree the C17 and AT-6 Texan commentaries were sterile and sales pitch orientated. As was the gyrocopter commentary. Someone needed to tell that guy you don't need to raise your voice when using a microphone  |
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Post by mumbles on Apr 1, 2012 14:42:53 GMT 12
seriously though I'd really like to know why big bus camper vans were allowed to line up in rows by the flightline? I'm not sure who was in charge, but I felt there was a definite lack of experience shown in organising the on-base parking. For a start it was filled up back to front, filling from the entry on rather than the crowdline back. The latter I feel is much more efficient, and safer, in that you aren't driving down rows of people unloading cars, often oblivious to the cars still coming in. We had to pause to avoid running over small children while their parents unpacked at one point. Backfilling from the crowdline as every other show seems to do does not remove this hazard entirely, but goes a long way toward mitigating it. We also felt the lack of any control where incoming cars and pedestrians mingled at the food stalls on Runway 15 created a definite hazard. Again pausing to avoid running over oblivious pedestrians en masse was in order, and this would have added to any delays down the queue. This was managed much better at the end of the day. Also bemused to note the "carpark must be vacated by 1645" notices that caused some amusement at the forum meet. We cleared the carpark at 1655, with hundreds of cars still behind us |
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gebbw
Pilot Officer
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Post by gebbw on Apr 1, 2012 14:51:19 GMT 12
A really great show!
The highlight for me was the 773 landing and it taking off again at the end - what a gorgeous sight she is!!!!!! Really enjoyed seeing the Avenger and I particularly enjoyed the NH-90. We thoroughly enjoyed ourselves, and it certainly was worth the long hike from Auckland.
Sorry to hear that the traffic was bad and people had a hard time trying to get in. I don't know how we fluked it but we were parked at the base at 8:45am. The only queuing we got was from Bulls to the main entrance - all up about 10~ 15mins - and that was after leaving our camp in the Kaimanawa State Forest Park at 6:00am. It took us longer to get out the base that get in.
Over all a really great day, only down-side for the day was a guy getting a bit huffy and deciding that because he had been waiting then he should leave first, even though 1000's of others were ALL waiting as well.
Oh and the fact that the RAF were a no-show. sigh. I was really looking forward to getting up and close to that Airbus.
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Post by phil82 on Apr 1, 2012 15:14:49 GMT 12
The traffic management thing makes me so cranky, because it will reflect badly in the media on the RNZAF - when the RNZAF obviously aren't solely to blame for this problem. A number of complainants in online newspapers comments sections have stated that at no point did they see any Police directing traffic at any of the main choke points - which if true, is not a good thing to hear at all. And as to the comment about Air Force man/womanpower shortages possibly being an issue, weren't there local Rotary or other voluntary organisations on duty too helping with parking marshalling, etc? If not, then maybe next time they should look at getting these organisations in to assist? Also, it is sad that this occurred as we know that the RNZAF can put on a cracker of a show at Ohakea to a similar sized crowd, with seemingly very little or no traffic chaos at all. Anyway, I hope no one in the Air Force is hung out to dry over this to save someone else's arse - but I do hope that the mistakes made in this PR disaster can be learnt from and the next air show runs more smoothly. Also, I'm interested in Phil82's comment about some rather pink looking Air Force personnel that had been standing out in the sun all day without hats - do RNZAF personnel even get issued with wide-brimmed hats nowadays, or only the baseball caps? Hats? Yes they do but it's a matter of choice on whether you wear it so it seems. Given NZ has one of the highest rates of skin cancer in the world I would have thought wearing a good old Aussie hat I bought at Avalon would make sense! By chance this morning I happened to bump into a former Chief of NZ Defence, who I know was in the VIP area because I spotted him there! He tells me the traffic problem was not down to the air force, which would confirm why, on the back roads around OH at 0830, I noticed people frantically erecting directions! |
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zolteg
Flight Lieutenant
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Post by zolteg on Apr 1, 2012 15:18:01 GMT 12
The point re the RAF not being there was one I made yesterday IRL. Given the origin of the RNZAF, it was a real shame not to see any official RAF presence.
Re traffic - RNZAF should out the commercial concern that put together their traffic plan. Did not deliver value for money.
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Post by phil82 on Apr 1, 2012 15:20:58 GMT 12
Just a note I received by email tonight from Brendon Deere, he says there were no issues with his Spitfire, just that the airshow co-ordinators considered the show was running too long and so cut the Spitfire two-ship flypast and Sean's display. Umm, wow . Possibly one of the worst on-the-day rescheduling decisions I can think of. I can think of at least two nothing-to-do-with-the-RNZAF displays that could have been chopped instead. Technical issues I can handle, but that is just poor. It was not only poor, but pointless when they still found time in the schedule to allow two allegedly grown-up boy racers do donuts on the runway in the faint hope of perpetuating the myth that anyone actually gives a stuff about Holdens and Fords! |
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Post by saratoga on Apr 1, 2012 15:22:01 GMT 12
The point re the RAF not being there was one I made yesterday IRL. Given the origin of the RNZAF, it was a real shame not to see any official RAF presence. Re traffic - RNZAF should out the commercial concern that put together their traffic plan. Did not deliver value for money. Did not deliver,full stop! |
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Post by sqwark2k on Apr 1, 2012 15:22:46 GMT 12
God bless Australia! That F/A 18 four ship was tighter than a fishes arse!
I'm just waiting for someone to say, "the Skyhawks would have been lower!"
Did the four perform an airfield attack or two vs one engagement after their display?[/
[\blockquote]
Negative, a very good, tight formation display which ended with a low high speed pass with the northern most a/c passing directly overhead the crowd at about 250'agl with cans wide open and bright with afterburner. Show highlight for me, followed closely by the solo F/A-18 display... that dude pulled some serious G! |
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Post by corsair67 on Apr 1, 2012 15:24:33 GMT 12
Hats? Yes they do but it's a matter of choice on whether you wear it so it seems. Given NZ has one of the highest rates of skin cancer in the world I would have thought wearing a good old Aussie hat I bought at Avalon would make sense! I never go to an air show without my trusty Akubra!  |
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Post by phil82 on Apr 1, 2012 15:27:10 GMT 12
More observations.....
The RAF weren't there, but all the "Seedcorn" RAF aircrew wearing huge Union Jack patches and 5 Sqn badges were evident, as were a Dutch Air Force Officer, and aFrench Air Force Officer, and another possibly Italian unless there was a Gilbert and Sullivan show on in Palmy as he would have fitted in quite nicely! "I am the very model of...I am the very model of a modern Major-General,I've information vegetable, animal, and mineral," with apologies to the "Pirates of Penzanze"
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Post by mumbles on Apr 1, 2012 15:34:41 GMT 12
Apologies for stealing your pic Flyernzl, but I looked at it, then remembered seeing the Warbirds DC-3 arriving from the traffic jam on Tangimoana road so had a closer look at it:  I was a bit sick of looking at the back of that red Falcon by the time we got in. We overnighted in Palmy so I could get to the forum meet, and I am glad we did. The more I read the luckier I feel at only having to deal with the above jam on the way in. We left Palmy at 0750 (about 20 minutes later than I had planned to), and were getting out of the car on base by about 0915. Someone said the normal time to get from Palmy to OH is 45 minutes; it isn't, more like 20. We did it in about 15-20 min, and encountered only light to medium traffic before turning left at Sanson and heading to Speedys Road, as advised in the publicity material. Once on Speedys we passed traffic entering from an already jammed Fagan Road, before hitting the jam proper on Tangimoana. I wasn't particularly impressed, especially on realising the routing ran right around the base, but had no idea how much worse it was getting around the area. We were relieved to be on and get out when we did, although my planned time for looking at the static and hangar displays had now vanished. In hindsight I think we were lucky to leave and arrive when we did: my commiserations to those who thought they had enough time and didn't make it in. I'm as experienced a show go-er as anyone, and feel like I dodged a bullet yesterday. Couple of points to note: -While contracted traffic management may have been planned and in place, the only people I saw directing traffic at any point were either NZ Police of NZDF personnel. No civilians. If they were out there, we never saw them. -No signposting from Sanson directing traffic to Speedys, and no signposting at Speedys to alert Air Show traffic. Both of these have been the norm at OH Air Shows past, and lacking them may have been a significant contributing factor to yesterday's problems. Having been to many shows at OH, this is the only one I have ever heard of having traffic issues of this magnitude. Something has clearly changed or gone awry somewhere. Also having a continuous display with no lunch break is okay for some, but for those whose main interest is in the flying displays, it makes it hard to go and have a look at whatever else is at the show. Also having no detailed programme available didn't help in planning the day either. I'm left wondering if some corporate knowledge in show planning hasn't been forgotten in recent times. The show itself was great, it just seems a shame that what should have been little stuff seems to have gotten out of control (and not necessarily the fault of the RNZAF, as some lesser informed commenters elsewhere seem to be assuming). |
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Post by saratoga on Apr 1, 2012 15:40:07 GMT 12
Highlight for me was the F-18 solo, he really threw that plane around.
First time seeing the C-17 was good ,though does anyone else think it suffers from 'bumble bee' syndrome?
The Hunter, from being roared over as i struggled to inch toward the gate.
low point(s), traffic, queues,queues and queues.
My usual 2 hotdog minimum not happening this time,40-50 people in each foodstall queue!
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Post by phil82 on Apr 1, 2012 15:45:12 GMT 12
My lunch comprised a coffee and an energy drink, and it wasn't till we hit Otaki on the way home that I realised I had forgotten lunch completely!
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. Possibly one of the worst on-the-day rescheduling decisions I can think of. I can think of at least two nothing-to-do-with-the-RNZAF displays that could have been chopped instead.
