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Post by meo4 on Jun 3, 2012 20:30:57 GMT 12
Got older version on fwd mast suppose to have one on aft mast behind 2DR ANSPS49 radar not added to cut cost.  |
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Post by ngatimozart on Sept 26, 2012 14:16:46 GMT 12
The Endeavour replacement favoured is the Joint Support Ship which is part AOR and part sealift like Canterbury. The RCN have a JSS project in development now. The Dutch are building a JSS vessel Karl Dorman which looks interesting, but has a displacement 1000 tonnes greater than the RAN LHDs meaning it is too large for RNZN needs. However I wonder if it could be half sized and built in a Korean yard? That would bring displacement down to 13,500 tonnes.[/quote] The RAN is to lease the Spanish Armanda Navantia built AOR Cantabria A15, with Spanish crew, to give it a going over to see what it's good and bad points are. Whilst the ship is in Australia for RAN assessment, it would make good sense to have a NZMinDef / RNZN assessment team present at the same time to do an assesment for the NZG / RNZN. Before everyone says it's to big for RNZN, the Cantabria (good name too - should paint it red and black) is not first of class. I realise it is not a JSS but like I say worth looking at. Patino Class Auxiliary Oiler and Replenishment Ship - Naval Technology Crew 148 Aircrew Accommodation 19 Additional Accommodation 20 Length 170m Beam 23m Height 8m Displacement 5,780t Engines The ship is fitted with two Navantia / Burmeister and Wein 16V40/45 diesel engines rated at 17.6MW sustained power. The engines drive a single shaft with a five-blade controllable pitch propeller supplied by Lips BV of the Netherlands. PatinoDisplacement: 17,050 tons full load Dimensions: 175 x 23.7 x 8 meters (574 x 77.5 x 26 feet) Propulsion: 2 diesels, 2 shafts, 21 knots Crew: 162 + 19 transients Aviation: aft helicopter deck with hangar for 2 helicopters Cargo: 9,000 tons (6,800 DFM, 1,650 JP-5, parts, ordnance & food) Radar: combined air & sea search EW: intercept, 4 SRBOC Armament: 1 20 mm Meroka CIWS, 2 20 mm AOR-type ship designed in cooperation with Netherlands. Endeavours specs: Standard Displacement: 7,300 tonnes empty 12,300 tonnes laden Length Overall: 138 metres Beam: 18.4 metres Draught: 4.5m empty 7.6m laden Speed: 14 knots Range: 10,000 nautical miles Complement: 50 Officers and ratings (13 Officers, 10 Senior Ratings, 27 Junior Ratings) Propulsion: One Mann Burmeister & Wain diesel (5,300 hp) Minister for Defence and Minister for Defence Materiel – Joint Media Release – The Deployment of Spanish Armada Ship Cantabria to Australia in 2013
30 June 2012The Minister for Defence, Stephen Smith, today announced that the Royal Australian Navy (RAN) would participate in a unique deployment to Australia of the Spanish Armada Ship, SPS Cantabria, with a series of training exercises in Australia from mid-February until November 2013.
The Cantabria deployment will strengthen the bilateral relationship between Spain and Australia, as well as providing important training and capability assessment outcomes for both the Spanish Armada and the RAN.
The Cantabria is a modern Auxiliary Oil Replenishment ship, similar to HMAS Success, which is capable of supplying fuel, food, stores and ammunition to ships underway.
This will be the longest deployment undertaken by Cantabria and will allow the Spanish Armada to trial the ship’s full range of capabilities including through activities involving both Cantabria and RAN ships and helicopters.
This training program will also include an exchange program between personnel from Cantabria and RAN units.
These exercises with RAN Ships and helicopters will culminate with Cantabria’s participation in the Australian International Fleet Review in October 2013.
The Cantabria’s deployment will also provide a valuable opportunity for the RAN to conduct early training for personnel earmarked for service in the Australian Navy’s new Canberra Class Landing Helicopter Dock (LHD) ships and Hobart Class Air Warfare Destroyers (AWD).
Many of Cantabria’s systems are the same as the LHDs and AWDs, which are based on Spanish ship designs.
The deployment will provide a unique opportunity for Defence to undertake an assessment of the capability offered by Cantabria as Defence considers the replacement of HMAS Success and Sirius.
The deployment of Cantabria will also reduce the capability risk during Success’ next major maintenance period in 2013.
Cantabria will augment the afloat support capability provided by HMAS Sirius. Sirius is currently in maintenance at HMAS Stirling, which is due for completion next month.
The RAN and Spanish Armada will work together over the coming weeks to finalise the details of the deployment.
The Chief of Navy, Vice Admiral Ray Griggs, will travel to Ferrol, Spain, next week to represent Australia at the launching and naming of the second LHD, the future HMAS Adelaide.Finally someone put this up on the shipbucket site which I don't frequent. J ust an other Damen Enforcer type vessel, this time a Landing Support Dock. designed for the New Zealand navy to replace HMNZS Endeavour (A11) fleet tanker from 1988.
Platform HMNZS Wellington A54 Laid down: 2012 Commissioned: 2015 Lenght: 170 m Beam: 27,8 m Draught: 6,5 m Displacement: 18,400 tons Speed: 15.0 kts Economical speed (20.0 kts max) Range: 11.500 at 12 kts Crew : Standard: 150 Combat: 185 + 220 troops Guns 1x 30mm bushmaster MK44 1x RAM CIWS (fitted for) 1x 20mm Phalanx Block 1A CIWS 2x 12,7mm Hitrole automatic machineguns 4x 12,7mm M2 .50 cal HMG Helicopters 1 Landingspot on deck + space for 2 NH90 in hangar , standard 1 stationed onboard. Boats 2x 14.2 m Landing Craft for 3 ton cargo or 22 troops 2x 7.4 m RHIB for mob/fast interception Landing dock for 2 medium sized Landingcraft up to 25 m.  Australia also showed intrest (sic) to buy 1 vessel to support future combat operations for the Canberra class amfibious warships.
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Post by meo4 on Sept 26, 2012 20:33:07 GMT 12
What about all the Spanish ships the Aussies are getting - almost the same distance as the UK away? I guess these are mainly filled with US equipment? Yep, lots of US systems including a fair proportion that are common to all the RAN's major surface combats making it feasible to support them in depth in Aus: Mk 41 VLS, Mk 45, LM2500, ESSM. Also the Aus content in terms of fabrication and fit-out is pretty high for the AWDs and even the LHDs, meaning the local shipyards will have the expertise to support them long term. I don't think the DoD even considered any truly "European" options for the AWD program e.g. Type 45, Sachsen or Horizon. Interesting to note all the Australian Navys 4 FFG and 8 FFH ANZAC frigates LM2500 gas turbines (basically the land marine version of the GE CF6 )are overhauled at Air New Zealand engineering workshops. Hopefully they get contract for AWD destroyers and LHDs. I think all the ANZAC frigates LM2500s were assembled at Air New Zealand.  |
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Post by richard1098 on Sept 26, 2012 22:39:12 GMT 12
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Post by ngatimozart on Apr 20, 2013 21:41:36 GMT 12
A RFI has been issued for the Endeavour replacement with entry into service by 2018. NZ Issues RFI for Naval Tanker Replacement | Defense News | defensenews.com The intended vessel is a Maritime Projection and Sustainment Capability (MPSC). The RfI calls for: - carrying a minimum of 8,000 tons of ship fuel and a minimum of 1,700 tons of aviation fuel, - a requirement for operating medium-sized helicopters (such as New Zealand’s SH-2G Seasprites and recently introduced NH90) and a costed option for operating a CH-47 Chinook, - the capability for lift on/lift off operations (up to and including 25 tons) to transfer embarked cargo and provision for upper deck stowage of embarked vehicles and a minimum of 12 shipping containers, - a minimum of 260 lane meters for vehicles and the MPSC also is required to operate two 65-ton landing craft, - a minimum 8,000 nautical mile-range at 16 knots, with a top speed of 18 knots, - a nominal ship’s company of 70, plus up to 50 passengers, - a minimum service life of 25 years, - the maximum fully laden design draft is not to exceed 26.2 feet, - it should be able to operate (from December to March) in Antarctic waters as far south as the McMurdo Sounds, - armament includes “an appropriate number” of manually laid 0.5-inch machine guns and/or space and weight for a close in weapon system such as Phalanx. I am not sure what to think about this Maritime Projection and Sustainment Capability concept. NZDF is not in a financial position to trail blaze a new vessel type. This has been talked about for a while and a senior Defence official does state that this RFI is just to find out what the costs may be. I note that the Canadians had a look at this as a JSS and after 20 odd years of toing and froing the JSS has morphed into an AOR. Joint Support Ship - JSS Project - Canadian Navy - AOR Replacement - Replenishment at Sea - Auxiliary Oiler Replenishment - CASR Background - Project Managment - Design Contacts - ALSC Project - Afloat Logistics Sealift Capability - Protecteur AOR - So I wonder why NZDF are steering this course. |
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Post by kiwirob on Jun 28, 2013 1:57:20 GMT 12
The Hobart class are AWD destroyers not frigates. The ANZAC replacement will be a frigate not a destroyer and the way technology is progressing it is probable that Aegis will fit into a frigate hull, especially now that the radar is AESA so one would assume that since a similar radar fits into an F15E Silent Eagle, or a RAAF Wedgetail, it'll fit into a frigate. The radar beams are now steered electronically rather than mechanically, as it was on the original USN Aegis crusiers and destroyers. So since the radar array size has dramatically reduced in size, it means that it can be fitted into a smaller hull. The RNZN doesn't have a need for Aegis capability so why pay for something we don't need. The advantage of Aegis for Australia is that it gives it ABM capability considering that it is a target. Aegis does fit into a frigate hull, Norway operate 5 of them, the Nansen class built by Navantia in Spain, they are essentially a cut down F100. The Spanish also consider the F100 class air defence frigates, it's only the Aussie who call them destroyers. |
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Post by richard1098 on Jun 28, 2013 14:15:04 GMT 12
This is a useful summary of the differences between the Hobarts and the original Spanish design: www.ausawd.com/content.aspx?p=97Some of them shouldn't be underestimated, such as ERGM capable Mk45 guns and Cooperative Engagement Capability. |
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Post by ngatimozart on Jun 28, 2013 14:24:21 GMT 12
If the ADF call them destroyers then that is what they are known as in ADF service. They are 7000 tonnes displacement which is overly large for a frigate. The Navantia F100 Alvaro de Bazan Class Frigate is 5,800 tonnes displacement which is really getting into destroyer displacement. the Nansen class are 5130 tonnes displacement. All these figures I obtained from Naval Technology.
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Post by macnz on Oct 10, 2013 1:19:53 GMT 12
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Post by beagle on Mar 15, 2014 12:54:53 GMT 12
Was reading an article yesterday somewhere and it was saying that the Endeavour replacement will have to be in service by 2017 as after that Endeavour will not be permitted in foreign ports.
So what will happen, Hello Mr Abbot, can we borrow your tanker for a few weeks, yeah right.
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Post by Dave Homewood on Mar 15, 2014 16:50:20 GMT 12
Our ships seldom get far out of our ports now without turning back broken so what is the difference?  |
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Post by beagle on Mar 15, 2014 19:11:59 GMT 12
you have to have the faith there Dave.
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Post by phil on Mar 16, 2014 15:06:54 GMT 12
Our ships seldom get far out of our ports now without turning back broken so what is the difference? TEM seems to have managed just fine over the last nine months, carrying out anti piracy patrols in the Gulf of Aden. |
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Post by meo4 on Mar 16, 2014 21:35:08 GMT 12
Our ships seldom get far out of our ports now without turning back broken so what is the difference? Seems like Otago made it to the ice with no problems last Xmas while Te Mana was chasing priates. Wellington just returned from sub Antarctic. |
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Post by ErrolC on Jul 9, 2014 18:50:09 GMT 12
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Post by macnz on Jul 24, 2014 16:46:22 GMT 12
Any further update on this? The UK MoD awarded their contract in 2012 for the construction of four 37,000t Tide-class (MARS) tankers, with the first ship to be delivered in October 2015, and final vessel due in April 2017 by Daewoo Shipbuilding and Marine Engineering, South Korea.
If our MoD is waiting until 2015 to tender and only making final recommendation by mid-2016 - then there does not seem any time planned to get the contract awarded, vessel constructed, sea trialed and into initial operation before the HMNZS Endeavour reaches end of life in 2018? Or are they looking to buy second-hand or a commercial lease to fit the time window?
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Post by macnz on Jul 24, 2014 18:34:25 GMT 12
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maytaj
Leading Aircraftman
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Post by maytaj on Aug 20, 2014 19:37:36 GMT 12
Someone mentioned about the RAN leasing a spanish tanker/replenishment ship. Thought they only had HMAS Sirius a few years now. Are they looking at another one as well.
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Post by macnz on Oct 7, 2014 16:09:32 GMT 12
Yet more woes for Canada's navy. Lets hope NZ MOD avoids this predicament with NZDF's own Endeavour replacement. At the end of September reported that having left too late(read: procrastinated) their decision on buying ships to replace their dated replenishment vessels. The Canadian Navy now have to ask to NATO and US to help bridge the gap because their 2 existing 'Oilers' have 'run out of steam' and cant be put back out to sea to support the rest of their fleet. To add insult to injury, 2 guided missile frigates also had to be parked for similar reasons. Canada To Seek NATO, US Support For Naval Air Defense, Resupply www.defensenews.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=2014309270029Jane's article: www.janes.com/article/43693/royal-canadian-navy-to-retire-four-ships-early |
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Post by macnz on Apr 2, 2015 16:46:18 GMT 12
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