Post by ngatimozart on Sept 26, 2012 14:16:46 GMT 12
The Endeavour replacement favoured is the Joint Support Ship which is part AOR and part sealift like Canterbury. The RCN have a JSS project in development now. The Dutch are building a JSS vessel Karl Dorman which looks interesting, but has a displacement 1000 tonnes greater than the RAN LHDs meaning it is too large for RNZN needs. However I wonder if it could be half sized and built in a Korean yard? That would bring displacement down to 13,500 tonnes.[/quote]
The RAN is to lease the Spanish Armanda Navantia built AOR Cantabria A15, with Spanish crew, to give it a going over to see what it's good and bad points are. Whilst the ship is in Australia for RAN assessment, it would make good sense to have a NZMinDef / RNZN assessment team present at the same time to do an assesment for the NZG / RNZN.
Before everyone says it's to big for RNZN, the Cantabria (good name too - should paint it red and black) is not first of class. I realise it is not a JSS but like I say worth looking at.
Crew 148 Aircrew Accommodation 19 Additional Accommodation 20 Length 170m Beam 23m Height 8m Displacement 5,780t Engines The ship is fitted with two Navantia / Burmeister and Wein 16V40/45 diesel engines rated at 17.6MW sustained power. The engines drive a single shaft with a five-blade controllable pitch propeller supplied by Lips BV of the Netherlands.
Patino Displacement: 17,050 tons full load Dimensions: 175 x 23.7 x 8 meters (574 x 77.5 x 26 feet) Propulsion: 2 diesels, 2 shafts, 21 knots Crew: 162 + 19 transients Aviation: aft helicopter deck with hangar for 2 helicopters Cargo: 9,000 tons (6,800 DFM, 1,650 JP-5, parts, ordnance & food) Radar: combined air & sea search EW: intercept, 4 SRBOC Armament: 1 20 mm Meroka CIWS, 2 20 mm AOR-type ship designed in cooperation with Netherlands.
The Minister for Defence, Stephen Smith, today announced that the Royal Australian Navy (RAN) would participate in a unique deployment to Australia of the Spanish Armada Ship, SPS Cantabria, with a series of training exercises in Australia from mid-February until November 2013.
The Cantabria deployment will strengthen the bilateral relationship between Spain and Australia, as well as providing important training and capability assessment outcomes for both the Spanish Armada and the RAN.
The Cantabria is a modern Auxiliary Oil Replenishment ship, similar to HMAS Success, which is capable of supplying fuel, food, stores and ammunition to ships underway.
This will be the longest deployment undertaken by Cantabria and will allow the Spanish Armada to trial the shipâ€™s full range of capabilities including through activities involving both Cantabria and RAN ships and helicopters.
This training program will also include an exchange program between personnel from Cantabria and RAN units.
These exercises with RAN Ships and helicopters will culminate with Cantabriaâ€™s participation in the Australian International Fleet Review in October 2013.
The Cantabriaâ€™s deployment will also provide a valuable opportunity for the RAN to conduct early training for personnel earmarked for service in the Australian Navyâ€™s new Canberra Class Landing Helicopter Dock (LHD) ships and Hobart Class Air Warfare Destroyers (AWD).
Many of Cantabriaâ€™s systems are the same as the LHDs and AWDs, which are based on Spanish ship designs.
The deployment will provide a unique opportunity for Defence to undertake an assessment of the capability offered by Cantabria as Defence considers the replacement of HMAS Success and Sirius.
The deployment of Cantabria will also reduce the capability risk during Successâ€™ next major maintenance period in 2013.
Cantabria will augment the afloat support capability provided by HMAS Sirius. Sirius is currently in maintenance at HMAS Stirling, which is due for completion next month.
The RAN and Spanish Armada will work together over the coming weeks to finalise the details of the deployment.
The Chief of Navy, Vice Admiral Ray Griggs, will travel to Ferrol, Spain, next week to represent Australia at the launching and naming of the second LHD, the future HMAS Adelaide.
What about all the Spanish ships the Aussies are getting - almost the same distance as the UK away? I guess these are mainly filled with US equipment?
Yep, lots of US systems including a fair proportion that are common to all the RAN's major surface combats making it feasible to support them in depth in Aus: Mk 41 VLS, Mk 45, LM2500, ESSM. Also the Aus content in terms of fabrication and fit-out is pretty high for the AWDs and even the LHDs, meaning the local shipyards will have the expertise to support them long term.
I don't think the DoD even considered any truly "European" options for the AWD program e.g. Type 45, Sachsen or Horizon.
Interesting to note all the Australian Navys 4 FFG and 8 FFH ANZAC frigates LM2500 gas turbines (basically the land marine version of the GE CF6 )are overhauled at Air New Zealand engineering workshops. Hopefully they get contract for AWD destroyers and LHDs. I think all the ANZAC frigates LM2500s were assembled at Air New Zealand.
Post by ngatimozart on Apr 20, 2013 21:41:36 GMT 12
A RFI has been issued for the Endeavour replacement with entry into service by 2018. NZ Issues RFI for Naval Tanker Replacement | Defense News | defensenews.com The intended vessel is a Maritime Projection and Sustainment Capability (MPSC). The RfI calls for: - carrying a minimum of 8,000 tons of ship fuel and a minimum of 1,700 tons of aviation fuel, - a requirement for operating medium-sized helicopters (such as New Zealand’s SH-2G Seasprites and recently introduced NH90) and a costed option for operating a CH-47 Chinook, - the capability for lift on/lift off operations (up to and including 25 tons) to transfer embarked cargo and provision for upper deck stowage of embarked vehicles and a minimum of 12 shipping containers, - a minimum of 260 lane meters for vehicles and the MPSC also is required to operate two 65-ton landing craft, - a minimum 8,000 nautical mile-range at 16 knots, with a top speed of 18 knots, - a nominal ship’s company of 70, plus up to 50 passengers, - a minimum service life of 25 years, - the maximum fully laden design draft is not to exceed 26.2 feet, - it should be able to operate (from December to March) in Antarctic waters as far south as the McMurdo Sounds, - armament includes “an appropriate number” of manually laid 0.5-inch machine guns and/or space and weight for a close in weapon system such as Phalanx.
The ANZAC replacement will be a frigate not a destroyer and the way technology is progressing it is probable that Aegis will fit into a frigate hull, especially now that the radar is AESA so one would assume that since a similar radar fits into an F15E Silent Eagle, or a RAAF Wedgetail, it'll fit into a frigate. The radar beams are now steered electronically rather than mechanically, as it was on the original USN Aegis crusiers and destroyers. So since the radar array size has dramatically reduced in size, it means that it can be fitted into a smaller hull. The RNZN doesn't have a need for Aegis capability so why pay for something we don't need. The advantage of Aegis for Australia is that it gives it ABM capability considering that it is a target.
Aegis does fit into a frigate hull, Norway operate 5 of them, the Nansen class built by Navantia in Spain, they are essentially a cut down F100.
The Spanish also consider the F100 class air defence frigates, it's only the Aussie who call them destroyers.
Post by ngatimozart on Jun 28, 2013 14:24:21 GMT 12
If the ADF call them destroyers then that is what they are known as in ADF service. They are 7000 tonnes displacement which is overly large for a frigate. The Navantia F100 Alvaro de Bazan Class Frigate is 5,800 tonnes displacement which is really getting into destroyer displacement. the Nansen class are 5130 tonnes displacement. All these figures I obtained from Naval Technology.
“People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf.” ― George Orwell
Was reading an article yesterday somewhere and it was saying that the Endeavour replacement will have to be in service by 2017 as after that Endeavour will not be permitted in foreign ports. So what will happen, Hello Mr Abbot, can we borrow your tanker for a few weeks, yeah right.
Defence Minister Jonathan Coleman says the Government has given approval for the NZDF to seek a replacement for the naval tanker HMNZS Endeavour.
“To operate effectively the NZDF needs to provide fuel and logistical support to its deployed ships, helicopters and vehicles,” says Dr Coleman.
“This capability is crucial given New Zealand’s vast maritime area, and our security and disaster relief responsibilities in the South Pacific. Without it NZDF operations would be limited in duration or dependent on our partners.
“The new tanker will be a significant enhancement in capability. It will increase the NZDF’s ability to support and sustain Navy, Army and Air Force operations at home and further afield.
“The tanker will be able to store a large amount of fuel, including aviation fuel, store supplies and ammunition, and accommodate an NH90 or Seasprite helicopter.
“This capability is needed as the NZDF has more ships which can embark new helicopters, and it is crucial that the tanker can support the Joint Task Force as set out in the 2010 Defence White Paper.
“Possible winterisation features will also be considered which could enable the tanker to resupply bases in Antarctica.”
HMNZS Endeavour will reach the end of her service life in 2018. Maintenance costs are increasing, and the vessel will face non-compliance issues with new international maritime regulations.
The request for tender is expected to be issued by the Ministry of Defence in early 2015. A final recommendation will be made to Cabinet in mid-2016.
Any further update on this? The UK MoD awarded their contract in 2012 for the construction of four 37,000t Tide-class (MARS) tankers, with the first ship to be delivered in October 2015, and final vessel due in April 2017 by Daewoo Shipbuilding and Marine Engineering, South Korea. If our MoD is waiting until 2015 to tender and only making final recommendation by mid-2016 - then there does not seem any time planned to get the contract awarded, vessel constructed, sea trialed and into initial operation before the HMNZS Endeavour reaches end of life in 2018? Or are they looking to buy second-hand or a commercial lease to fit the time window?
The Australians were lucky they picked up the HMAS Choules in time (and at a bargain) to replace their "end of life" landing ships HMAS Manoora and HMAS Kanimbla. Lets hope NZ avoids such a similar predicament occurring over our replenishment vessel.
Yet more woes for Canada's navy. Lets hope NZ MOD avoids this predicament with NZDF's own Endeavour replacement.
At the end of September reported that having left too late(read: procrastinated) their decision on buying ships to replace their dated replenishment vessels. The Canadian Navy now have to ask to NATO and US to help bridge the gap because their 2 existing 'Oilers' have 'run out of steam' and cant be put back out to sea to support the rest of their fleet. To add insult to injury, 2 guided missile frigates also had to be parked for similar reasons.
The tender specifies a range of 6,450 nautical miles at 16 knots (Endeavour has a range of 10,000 nautical miles and can attain 14 knots) and requires the new ship to spend up to 160 days at sea each year and 60 days alongside...