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Post by Luther Moore on Jan 28, 2012 20:13:44 GMT 12
Who is this guy Dave?never heard of him.
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Post by ngatimozart on Jan 28, 2012 20:29:18 GMT 12
Who is this guy Dave?never heard of him. If you are talking about Upham. Charles Upham was an Infantry Captain in the NZ Army and a North Canterbury farmer. A very quiet fella who didn't like the limelight or being in the public eye. He is the only person to have ever won two VCs in combat. He won both of his in North Africa when he served with Tiny Freyberg and his 40,000 thieves a.k.a 2nd NZ Armoured Division. He died a few years back and is buried in the churchyard at the corner of Harewood Rd and Papanui Rd, Papanui, Christchurch. By all accounts he was a ferocious fighter but he very rarely talked about it himself. He was taken prisoner and found out about his second VC in the POW camp. I'mdoing thisfrom memory so I think that's about right. I am sure if you google his name you will get a full history. |
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Post by ngatimozart on Jan 28, 2012 20:35:34 GMT 12
My father in law was an RAF medic (just turned 18) and went ashore at Normandy on D+5. He was on the first 2nd Tactical Air Force airfield that set up on normandy and his sqn was flying Typhoons. He went & saw Saving Private Ryan with at the other Normandy Vets in the Auckland area and came out with tears in his eyes. He said that the only thing missing from the first 20 minutes was the smell. Everything else was as he remembered it. He & I watched it a couple times since and he passed away 21/2/2011.
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Post by Dave Homewood on Jan 28, 2012 20:37:25 GMT 12
Not quite true, he was the only person to be awarded two Victoria Crosses in WWII. There were two previous recipients of a VC and Bar, and none since. One of Charles Upham's was for his actions on Crete, the other in North Africa. His commander stated he actually deserved the award at least seven times over. He was fearless and ruthless when it came to the enemy.
And there was no NZ Armoured Division in North Africa. He was in the 2nd Division, NZEF.
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Post by corsair67 on Jan 28, 2012 20:37:53 GMT 12
In my opinion, "Saving Private Ryan" should have been a short film of around 20 minutes - as after that point the good points get fewer and fewer...  |
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Post by Dave Homewood on Jan 28, 2012 20:44:15 GMT 12
See here for the three recipients of the Victor Cross and Bar: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Victoria_Cross"Three people have been awarded the VC and Bar, the bar representing a second award of the VC. They are: Noel Chavasse and Arthur Martin-Leake, both doctors in the Royal Army Medical Corps, for rescuing wounded under fire; and New Zealander Charles Upham, an infantryman, for combat actions." And for Charles Upham himself: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_UphamI am sure some memebrs of the forum here probably knew Charlie Upham personally. I'd love to hear any memories people might have of him. i have met a few veterans who knew him, one served with him from day one of the war through to the same POW camp. |
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Post by Dave Homewood on Jan 28, 2012 20:47:49 GMT 12
Craig, you make a good point, it did make it's biggest statement at the very beginning. But I do like the film overall, and I am pleased it is a landmark in film in terms of changing the direction that films about war have been made. Up till then there were very few good, big budget war films that didn't have some over glorified aging actor in the lead, performing over the top heroics and making the whole thing into a bit of a farce.
One of the best war films ever made in my opinon is The Way Ahead in 1944. It's not about war, it's about the men who went to war.
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Post by Luther Moore on Jan 28, 2012 20:53:36 GMT 12
Has anyone ever seen Dive Bomber ?
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Post by corsair67 on Jan 28, 2012 21:02:13 GMT 12
Has anyone ever seen Dive Bomber ? Yeah, I saw that a few years ago - lots of shots of Douglas Devastators and Vought Vindicators.  Hey Dave, "1941" is a great war movie.... ;D |
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Post by baronbeeza on Jan 28, 2012 21:07:37 GMT 12
I rate 1941 ahead of Pearl Habor.
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Post by corsair67 on Jan 28, 2012 21:11:52 GMT 12
I rate 1941 ahead of Pearl Habor. I rate anything with Lindsay Lohan in it ahead of "Pearl Harbor"! ;D |
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Post by Luther Moore on Jan 28, 2012 21:13:14 GMT 12
Has anyone ever seen Dive Bomber ? Yeah, I saw that a few years ago - lots of shots of Douglas Devastators and Vought Vindicators. Hey Dave, "1941" is a great war movie.... ;D Dive Bomber is great! I love 1941! Let me hear your guns son yak yak yak yak yak! |
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Post by ngatimozart on Jan 28, 2012 21:14:25 GMT 12
Not quite true, he was the only person to be awarded two Victoria Crosses in WWII. There were two previous recipients of a VC and Bar, and none since. One of Charles Upham's was for his actions on Crete, the other in North Africa. His commander stated he actually deserved the award at least seven times over. He was fearless and ruthless when it came to the enemy. And there was no NZ Armoured Division in North Africa. He was in the 2nd Division, NZEF. As I said was doing it from memory. I stand corrected. Thanks. |
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Post by Dave Homewood on Jan 28, 2012 21:40:05 GMT 12
Dive Bomber is indded a very good film. The coloured footage of all those lovely old divebombers in formation are something to behold.
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Post by Luther Moore on Jan 29, 2012 0:41:16 GMT 12
My father in law was an RAF medic (just turned 18) and went ashore at Normandy on D+5. He was on the first 2nd Tactical Air Force airfield that set up on normandy and his sqn was flying Typhoons. He went & saw Saving Private Ryan with at the other Normandy Vets in the Auckland area and came out with tears in his eyes. He said that the only thing missing from the first 20 minutes was the smell. Everything else was as he remembered it. He & I watched it a couple times since and he passed away 21/2/2011. Thats a very interesting story, thanks for sharing it.I heard alot of vets thought it was very spot on and a bit too realistic.Sorry for your recent loss. |
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Post by sparrow on Jan 29, 2012 8:32:11 GMT 12
Not quite true, he was the only person to be awarded two Victoria Crosses in WWII. There were two previous recipients of a VC and Bar, and none since. One of Charles Upham's was for his actions on Crete, the other in North Africa. His commander stated he actually deserved the award at least seven times over. He was fearless and ruthless when it came to the enemy. And there was no NZ Armoured Division in North Africa. He was in the 2nd Division, NZEF. As I said was doing it from memory. I stand corrected. Thanks. You quoted 'only',that probably comes from the fact that he is often referred to as the 'only combatant soldier' to be awarded the VC twice. Of course it all comes down to if you consider an un-armed medic to be a 'combatant' soldier or not. |
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Post by baz62 on Jan 29, 2012 9:50:45 GMT 12
I rate 1941 ahead of Pearl Habor. I rate anything with Lindsay Lohan in it ahead of "Pearl Harbor"! ;D Craig you stirrer! ;D |
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Post by 11SQNLDR on Jan 29, 2012 12:31:33 GMT 12
I rate 1941 ahead of Pearl Habor. I rate anything with Lindsay Lohan in it ahead of "Pearl Harbor"! ;D In that case you'll enjoy the other version of this film, aptly named "Saving Ryan's Privates"  ;D |
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Post by paddy on Jan 29, 2012 17:05:41 GMT 12
See here for the three recipients of the Victor Cross and Bar: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Victoria_Cross"Three people have been awarded the VC and Bar, the bar representing a second award of the VC. They are: Noel Chavasse and Arthur Martin-Leake, both doctors in the Royal Army Medical Corps, for rescuing wounded under fire; and New Zealander Charles Upham, an infantryman, for combat actions." And for Charles Upham himself: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_UphamI am sure some memebrs of the forum here probably knew Charlie Upham personally. I'd love to hear any memories people might have of him. i have met a few veterans who knew him, one served with him from day one of the war through to the same POW camp. One of my father's friends was in the same POW camp as Charles Upham and his opinion was that Charles Upham was very much disliked by the other prisoners. Reason being that, every time Charles Upham sank the boot into the germans, the other prisoners paid the price with various punishments inflicted on the whole camp, not just Upham. Not a judgement but what I was told by one that was there. |
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Post by shorty on Jan 30, 2012 6:24:36 GMT 12
I heard the same thing and it also applied to Douglas Bader.
Upham used to live just up the road (at Conway) from where I am living.
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;D