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Post by strikemaster on Feb 3, 2013 20:23:24 GMT 12
Just a quicky as I'm working on a pre Kahu Skyhawk kit and have the obligatory black low viz roundel's that came with it. Was there ever a RNZAF Skyhawk with the hump and black roundels? Maybe early Kahu? I've not seen any pics anywhere so I'm guessing not. If not I shall have to do an 80's paint scheme and try and find some suitable 1/72 decals. Not the end of the world, but I have a 2 week comp deadline.  |
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Post by Calum on Feb 3, 2013 20:45:53 GMT 12
Not to my knowledge
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Post by strikemaster on Feb 3, 2013 21:08:19 GMT 12
That's what I thought. Bit crazy giving out those roundels with the A4-E.
Anyone know of a good source of RNZAF/RAAF decals in Australia?
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Post by saratoga on Feb 3, 2013 21:08:44 GMT 12
A-4k with humps in the early euro scheme,but that was with the blue/red roundels.
The same scheme was kept when they converted to Kahu,minus the humps.
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Post by mumbles on Feb 3, 2013 21:46:29 GMT 12
Just a quicky as I'm working on a pre Kahu Skyhawk kit and have the obligatory black low viz roundel's that came with it. Was there ever a RNZAF Skyhawk with the hump and black roundels? Maybe early Kahu? Just to add to the other comments, I'd say definitely not. The two are separated by at least five or six years if not more. |
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Post by mumbles on Feb 3, 2013 21:48:30 GMT 12
That's what I thought. Bit crazy giving out those roundels with the A4-E. Anyone know of a good source of RNZAF/RAAF decals in Australia? Ventura do sheets of both hi and lo vis RNZAF kiwi roundels in 1/72 and 1/48. 'lo-vis' being the red/blue ones, not the 'lo-lo-vis' black ones. |
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Post by strikemaster on Feb 3, 2013 22:01:07 GMT 12
Cheers, guys. Is there a link for Ventura, Mumbles? Were the pre Kahu cockpits the same as the RAN/USN versions of the Skyhawk? Were all the RNZAF Skyhawks originally G variants? Or just the Aussie ones? I thought the USN models were older. Wiki seems to be near useless on the subject.
"Ten A-4K single-seaters, and four TA-4K two-seaters, were purchased by the Royal New Zealand Air Force in 1969 as English Electric Canberra replacements, and shipped to New Zealand aboard the assault carrier USS Okinawa in 1970.[9] The A-4K is broadly comparable to the A-4F and G, although featuring extra avionics in a dorsal "hump"."
A4-F and A4-G, correct?
Wish I had Dons book now.
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Post by mumbles on Feb 3, 2013 22:29:30 GMT 12
Cheers, guys. Is there a link for Ventura, Mumbles? Were the pre Kahu cockpits the same as the RAN/USN versions of the Skyhawk? Were all the RNZAF Skyhawks originally G variants? Or just the Aussie ones? I thought the USN models were older. Wiki seems to be near useless on the subject. "Ten A-4K single-seaters, and four TA-4K two-seaters, were purchased by the Royal New Zealand Air Force in 1969 as English Electric Canberra replacements, and shipped to New Zealand aboard the assault carrier USS Okinawa in 1970.[9] The A-4K is broadly comparable to the A-4F and G, although featuring extra avionics in a dorsal "hump"." A4-F and A4-G, correct? Wish I had Dons book now. Both the K and G were customer specific variants of the F model, which was the final new-build version for the USN. Further confusing the issue is that the first batch of G's were actually built as E's, and the second G batch supplied from existing USN stocks of F's (explaining why four of the final RNZAF A-4 fleet were vietnam combat veterans). The avionics hump in the K never had the avionics fitted, so the G and K are closer than they initially appear, although there are other obvious visual differences like the braking parachute for land-based ops and the squared off fin for the K. As I understand it the cockpit fit outs pre kahu were very similar if not basically identical, but there are others who know more than me about that. Ventura link: www.venturapublications.com/store/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=82&zenid=uumr7f9u90c200phaldfqrb0e7There is a better than average run-down on the A-4 variant history here, although it repeats the error that the K hump had the extra avionics fitted. "Fitted for but not with" was the case. |
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Post by strikemaster on Feb 4, 2013 0:39:38 GMT 12
Man, this is getting harder than I thought. Bit of an education though.
I think I need to pinpoint an era and stick to that. Probably 87-88. The kiwi flyer roundels I have will wind up on an F-16.
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Post by strikemaster on Feb 8, 2013 0:28:21 GMT 12
THe body is done and the pilot sorted, shaping the body a bit better now. Not perfectly accurate but better than it was. What would be the best paints for the 3 tone colour scheme of the early 80's?
What weapons load would be most common back then?
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Post by flyjoe180 on Feb 9, 2013 9:53:25 GMT 12
The SEA scheme, was two-tone green (FS34079 and FS34102) and tan (FS30219) with grey (FS36622) undersides, white undercarriage and under wing racks. The low visibility scheme, researching the forum and other sites, is two-tone green (FS34079 and FS34102) as previous, with dark grey (FS36081) replacing the tan of the old SEA scheme. You can convert the FS numbers to match your favourite paint manufacturer using various online or pdf charts. You can try using www.paint4models.com/ Can't comment on weapon loads, but I hope the colour advice helps. |
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Post by strikemaster on Feb 9, 2013 10:05:16 GMT 12
I think the SEA scheme is the one I have in mind, cheers flyjoe. Found some decals, so that is sorted. That chart looks helpful too, cheers. Progress.
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Post by phil on Feb 9, 2013 11:02:16 GMT 12
The SEA scheme is the Hi viz 4 colour scheme, so far you've asked about the Euro 1 scheme, which is the wrap around two greens and a grey (FS colours as noted above).
Weapons, well for both those eras you would want AIM-9Gs (or more correctly CATM-9G acquisition rounds), Mk82s were common, either parent rack mounted or on MER/TERs.
PMBRs were probably the most common thing carried, but I don't think they are available in model form in any scale, although I'd be happy to hear otherwise.
In the SEA scheme you could have the 4 shot zuni pods, or the 6 or 19 shot rocket pods. With the later Euro 1 scheme the LAU5002 6 shot pod and the 19 shot LAU5003 pod. The 6 shot pods were by far the most common.
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Post by strikemaster on Feb 9, 2013 13:48:11 GMT 12
Cheers Phil, I'm thinking of going back to the early 80's as that was my era and also one I built with dad. 4 colour will probably be the answer, its also easier to get decals for too.
I'll look up the armaments, thanks. I have boxes of spares so might be able to cobble something together. What is PMBR?
Edit: got it, Practice Multible Bomb Rack
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Post by steveh on Feb 10, 2013 13:27:28 GMT 12
If its the hiviz scheme with the SEA colours you go for, the following are matches from the humbrol range.
FS 30219 Tan = Hu118
FS 34079 Dark Green = Hu116
FS 34102 Green OD = Hu117
FS 36622 Grey = Hu28
Steve.
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Post by strikemaster on Feb 10, 2013 17:52:35 GMT 12
I am using Mr Hobby and Tamiya acrylics, so far settled on Dark Green, Tan, medium grey and Nato green. I think they are pretty close. Half way done. The lads Sabre is proving to be a lot harder.
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Post by strikemaster on Feb 10, 2013 18:35:48 GMT 12
Another quicky, none of the Aussie A4's ever got the hump installed, did they? It was only the original lot delivered on the Okinawa?
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Post by phil on Feb 10, 2013 18:36:43 GMT 12
Mr Hobby make the exact colours you need.
I'd suggest that Nato green isn't a match for anything in that scheme, being too dark for the light green and too light for the dark green, although it's closer to the dark green. Neither is any kind of medium grey (except for the cockpit). The underside grey FS 36622 is very pale.
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Post by strikemaster on Feb 10, 2013 18:50:46 GMT 12
I noticed that, is it closer to a duck egg colour? I have a semi gloss blue that is VERY light that looked to be a close match to the pics I have seen. The NATO I plan to lighten up a bit. Some of the pics I have seen its pretty hard to distinguish between the greens at all.
Just checked the grey I got, got the wrong damned on, it was in the wrong row on the shelf. It is dark sea grey, I might lighten it with the blue I think. Only have a week left to finish it off. I'd guess the only two I have that are spot on are the dark green and tan.
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Post by phil on Feb 10, 2013 19:52:07 GMT 12
Blue? No, I wouldn't put any blue in the grey at all, not for the underside. I'd use white, darkened just a little. Seriously, the underside grey is very pale, lighter even than Light Aircraft Grey.
Actually I'd just use the pot of Gunze H311.
If you are using Mr Hobby the codes you need are:
Dark Green H309 FS34079
Light Green H303 FS34102
Tan H310 FS30219
Light Grey H311 FS36622
Model master also make the correct colour in both enamel and acrylic.
Much better than messing about with Tamiya, who don't really make any of the correct colours at all.
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