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Post by pepe on Oct 31, 2022 9:54:37 GMT 12
This may be a little bold but I suggest some A4K Skyhawks as our Canberra replacements. They are getting some great reviews. |
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Post by gibbo on Oct 31, 2022 12:12:57 GMT 12
This may be a little bold but I suggest some A4K Skyhawks as our Canberra replacements. They are getting some great reviews. LOL... finger-eye co-ordination issues!  Rather topical subject with C-130H going u/s on the ice.....sigh, all good though, new C-130J-30 a couple of years away, pity we won't have enough of those either! |
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Post by retiredav8r on Oct 31, 2022 15:16:00 GMT 12
The issue of "we never have enough" or "we need more" or "always breaking down". First of all, NZ is a rinky dink country with a population less than an average city in many countries. Aircraft break down on the ice all the time, it cold down there don't forget. I would offer a bet that when we get the -30, they will have failures also. When the PM was there, the C17 broke down, did the world end?
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Post by dutchkiwi on Nov 2, 2022 4:02:22 GMT 12
Was wondering if any surplus former RAF C-130J could be a option. Just wishful thinking : )
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Post by fiftythree on Nov 22, 2022 18:54:23 GMT 12
I thought that the B757 now goes to the ice with limited load so it can return without landing? Unfortunately not, even with a full fuel load there's still a PSR prior to overhead the airfield. |
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Post by fiftythree on Nov 22, 2022 19:13:53 GMT 12
I guess the NZDF / MinDef etc may have 'sent a letter' but I'd think it'd be very cursory at this stage given the B757 replacement project has been pushed back to approx 2028 & therefore I dare say hasn't got off the ground yet (excuse the pun!). Having said that who knows if behind the scenes Govt is considering pulling the project forward again but I somehow find that difficult to believe. I'm a firm believer the B757 replacement must have a combo option... the KC46 tanker has I think 100 seat capacity but it's a hugely expensive beast to use for a purely pax run with 100 pax... so unless it offers a half / full cabin pax option plus underfloor freight I'm not a fan. Whilst I would dearly love to see a RNZAF KC46 tanker the above points do still apply IMHO as tanking isn't likely to be given a high priority by Govt. Whilst it could be used to 'tank' something smaller to the ice it'd be better off to get something that can itself make the ice & back... but then the points above about combo capacity etc apply outside of the ice runs. On the subject of ice runs... we all believe the B757 replacement will be capable of a return flight without touchdown... but I wonder if it's now more 'preferred' than a non-negotiable requirement. If the latter is true then why would we continue to use C130 & B757 now... they could continue with the C130J one-way if they felt they really had to so that then suggests to me it's unlikely tanking will be a drop-dead of the B757 replacement (yes agreed it is a preferable capability tho!). Another option may be the A330-MRTT as per the RAAF but I'm fairly certain there's (standard MRTT) do not have a strengthened floor so only has pax role in the cabin and with tanks underfloor it's freight capacity must be limited!?! Of course one of the key requirements of the B757 replacement will be the ability to operate to/from as many south pacific island states as possible...that also puts yet another set of blinkers on the requirement, so it seems whatever replaces the B757 it's going to involve compromise...nothing new there for the RNZAF! I'd also say that project must be stretched to 3 operational airframes. Good luck to the project team trying to tick all the boxes! KC30 has full seating upstairs (RAAF runs 270 seats in business/economy split) and can take up to eight 463L pallets in the cargo holds. There's a height limit to the pallets down stairs but they can be built to max weight. It's not a rig change situation like the RNZAF B757 is which would result in better aircraft availability. There would be a capability limit in local and Pacific airfields that it could access, but New Zealand would have a true strategic air lifter. No PSR to the ice and the biggest pax capacity in Antarctic airlift (by a long shot) plus the bonus of in flight refuelling capability and this aircraft offers a lot to our allies and great potential for NZDF use. As for VIP, you could have the VIP seating fitted all the time and still exceed the number of business and economy seats that the B757 offers. |
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Post by johnnyutah on Nov 30, 2022 21:46:02 GMT 12
How about second hand A330s like the ones the RAAF bought?
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Post by Deleted on Dec 1, 2022 16:45:37 GMT 12
How about second hand A330s like the ones the RAAF bought? Not the KC-30s? (I'm unclear as to whether they're new-build or converted A330s). |
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Post by Mustang51 on Dec 1, 2022 17:41:56 GMT 12
Two (I think off the cuff) former QANTAS machines converted.....Mr Hallen shall correct
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Post by delticman on Dec 2, 2022 10:33:17 GMT 12
Two (I think off the cuff) former QANTAS machines converted.....Mr Hallen shall correct Well I just looked up ADF serials. Easy to find with Mr Google. 01 = converted new in Spain. 02-05 = converted from new by Qantas, Brisbane. 06-07 = ex Qantas airliners- converted in Spain. |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 2, 2022 16:13:26 GMT 12
Well I just looked up ADF serials. Evidently I'm having an off week!  |
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Post by kiwirob on Dec 3, 2022 5:53:33 GMT 12
I guess the NZDF / MinDef etc may have 'sent a letter' but I'd think it'd be very cursory at this stage given the B757 replacement project has been pushed back to approx 2028 & therefore I dare say hasn't got off the ground yet (excuse the pun!). Having said that who knows if behind the scenes Govt is considering pulling the project forward again but I somehow find that difficult to believe. I'm a firm believer the B757 replacement must have a combo option... the KC46 tanker has I think 100 seat capacity but it's a hugely expensive beast to use for a purely pax run with 100 pax... so unless it offers a half / full cabin pax option plus underfloor freight I'm not a fan. Whilst I would dearly love to see a RNZAF KC46 tanker the above points do still apply IMHO as tanking isn't likely to be given a high priority by Govt. Whilst it could be used to 'tank' something smaller to the ice it'd be better off to get something that can itself make the ice & back... but then the points above about combo capacity etc apply outside of the ice runs. On the subject of ice runs... we all believe the B757 replacement will be capable of a return flight without touchdown... but I wonder if it's now more 'preferred' than a non-negotiable requirement. If the latter is true then why would we continue to use C130 & B757 now... they could continue with the C130J one-way if they felt they really had to so that then suggests to me it's unlikely tanking will be a drop-dead of the B757 replacement (yes agreed it is a preferable capability tho!). Another option may be the A330-MRTT as per the RAAF but I'm fairly certain there's (standard MRTT) do not have a strengthened floor so only has pax role in the cabin and with tanks underfloor it's freight capacity must be limited!?! Of course one of the key requirements of the B757 replacement will be the ability to operate to/from as many south pacific island states as possible...that also puts yet another set of blinkers on the requirement, so it seems whatever replaces the B757 it's going to involve compromise...nothing new there for the RNZAF! I'd also say that project must be stretched to 3 operational airframes. Good luck to the project team trying to tick all the boxes! KC30 has full seating upstairs (RAAF runs 270 seats in business/economy split) and can take up to eight 463L pallets in the cargo holds. There's a height limit to the pallets down stairs but they can be built to max weight. It's not a rig change situation like the RNZAF B757 is which would result in better aircraft availability. There would be a capability limit in local and Pacific airfields that it could access, but New Zealand would have a true strategic air lifter. No PSR to the ice and the biggest pax capacity in Antarctic airlift (by a long shot) plus the bonus of in flight refuelling capability and this aircraft offers a lot to our allies and great potential for NZDF use. As for VIP, you could have the VIP seating fitted all the time and still exceed the number of business and economy seats that the B757 offers. Paul you know full well the NZ government isn’t going to buy an MRTT. |
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Post by The Red Baron on Dec 3, 2022 11:13:32 GMT 12
This about all we can currently afford...One previous owner,in need some minor repairs,was airworthy when last flown,comes with a trailer so when it breaks down you can tow it with a Ministerial Limousine...could see all the Cabinet Ministers queuing up to use it.  |
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Post by machina on Dec 8, 2022 18:05:09 GMT 12
Putting aside the likelihood of the NZ Govt. purchasing the requisite platform, I’d be interested to hear from those who have been there done that about the risk of our current aircraft flying to the ice without the option of AAR.
Obviously it’s been carried out until now without it, and I’m not sure if the other nations who fly from CHC use it but when I think about the PSR and committing to flying out into the ‘effin nothingness it gives me the willies!!
I would think that AAR might also benefit the P-8s by keeping our limited number of airframes airborne for longer.
Interested to hear people’s thoughts.
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Post by beagle on Dec 13, 2022 21:02:26 GMT 12
KC30 has full seating upstairs (RAAF runs 270 seats in business/economy split) and can take up to eight 463L pallets in the cargo holds. There's a height limit to the pallets down stairs but they can be built to max weight. It's not a rig change situation like the RNZAF B757 is which would result in better aircraft availability. There would be a capability limit in local and Pacific airfields that it could access, but New Zealand would have a true strategic air lifter. No PSR to the ice and the biggest pax capacity in Antarctic airlift (by a long shot) plus the bonus of in flight refuelling capability and this aircraft offers a lot to our allies and great potential for NZDF use. As for VIP, you could have the VIP seating fitted all the time and still exceed the number of business and economy seats that the B757 offers. Paul you know full well the NZ government isn’t going to buy an MRTT. still 3 B777-200's in desert that would be pretty cheap |
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ajmcg
Flight Sergeant
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Post by ajmcg on Jan 12, 2023 19:41:50 GMT 12
How about the government buying the RAAF BBJ’s due to be replaced as VIP, media and trade transports and 3 new Pegasus KC-46 transport and tanker aircraft to do strategic transport and extend Poseidon P-8 and other aircraft ranges. Win win with new second hand-me-downs from Australia and new FMS KC-46 from the US to last the next 40-50 years.
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Post by snafu on Jan 13, 2023 8:33:10 GMT 12
How about the government buying the RAAF BBJ’s due to be replaced as VIP, media and trade transports and 3 new Pegasus KC-46 transport and tanker aircraft to do strategic transport and extend Poseidon P-8 and other aircraft ranges. Win win with new second hand-me-downs from Australia and new FMS KC-46 from the US to last the next 40-50 years. like everything they are getting old and prone to malfunction at inappropriate times. Can you just imagine the who-ha if the new secondhand aircraft broke down? smedefence.com.au/2022/11/10/defence-quietly-replacing-vip-jets/#:~:text=Defence%E2%80%99s%20intent%20to%20replace%20the%20737%20BBJ%20fleet,%E2%80%98approved%20enhancement%E2%80%99%20to%20the%20RAAFs%20air%20mobility%20fleet. |
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Post by madmac on Jan 14, 2023 19:35:16 GMT 12
Paul you know full well the NZ government isn’t going to buy an MRTT. still 3 B777-200's in desert that would be pretty cheap Off the top of my head, isn't AirNZ's 777-200ER's odd balls. If you think mil reg 757's are bad for parts issues, try a mil reg odd ball sub variant. That is if we operate the parts side much like we have, if we brought a half dozen spare airframes broke 2 in NZ and parked the other 4 in Alice well maybe, but we would still have simulator issues. |
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Post by alanster on Feb 2, 2023 6:06:07 GMT 12
All the Pacific states NZ deals with have modern airports with full runways which Boeing 747s can land on. Samoa and Fiji could even have A380s land there. I’m not sure why this is seen as an impediment to anything.
The only one which doesn’t have an airport at all is Tokelau.
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Post by Peter Lewis on Feb 2, 2023 8:28:02 GMT 12
The only one which doesn’t have an airport at all is Tokelau. Reactive Sunderland NZ4115 from MoTAT? |
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