Rumours!

[Dave Homewood]

Very interesting. I had heard ofhe Oxfords at Marton. there was/were photo/s in an old NZ Wings magazine. I think the aircraft guys from 1960's MOTAT were well aware of this site as some aircraft such as parts of the Vildebeest (now at Wigram) were found there, from memory and I have an inkling that some of the material that Wigram has from Oxfords may have come from there too. Not certain though.

Interestingly the placename Tutaenui translates into English as Big Shit! ;D

The possible Hudson/Ventura interests me a lot more. I wonder if Denys knows more about this one? It would be superb if another one turned up, especially a PV-1

[shorty]

The Marton Oxford was NZ 2156 and it went there in 1954 and Ken Jacobs got it in 1972 so Lord knows what has happened to it since then.

[thomarse]

.....or "a lot of shit" which my post ain't!

;D

My Marton Oxford is not to be confused with all the bits that are/were buried in the river bank in town (although it may have been part of the same lot originally), Tutaenui is a wee way out of town.

[shorty]

hye stuff that was buried in the river bank in Marton ( by the rail bridgewhere the Squash Club is now)didn't include any Oxford stuff. It was all purchased by Production Engineering (who now build all the petrol pumps at service stations) Most of the aircraft they got is shown on the records as "reduced to produce".
I go down Morven/Glenavy/Waimate and there isn't a Station in Mirven. Got any other clues? The name Gluyas rings a bell from my wreck hunting days but I need to see if I still have my notebook

[thomarse]

Barnetts Road maybe? I wonder if it has been renamed?

Quite close to SH1 from memory.

White Pages only brings up 15 entries for Gluyas in the South Island, and none are near there.

[Dave Homewood]

A slim possibility is Mr Gluyas may not be there any more but perhaps family is. If his daughter married and they took over the farm it would be in a new name.

[waimo]

The Gluyas family left the district a long time ago.i remember some of the air craft remains at a local engineering workshop 40 +years ago.Mark Rollinson may know what happened to them.

[Peter Lewis]

Sept 26, 2010 11:20:28 GMT 12 shorty said:

The Marton Oxford was NZ 2156 and it went there in 1954 and Ken Jacobs got it in 1972 so Lord knows what has happened to it since then.

How about this TradeMe ad from 2005:

"EX-RNZAF WWII AIRSPEED OXFORD AIRCRAFT PROJECT

* No reserve No reserve
* Closed: Sun 21 Aug 2005, 8:49 pm
* Listing #: 33506626


EX-RNZAF WWII AIRSPEED OXFORD AIRCRAFT PROJECT. Here is a rare opportunity to bid on a genuine WWII warbird aircraft project based around the remains of ex-RNZAF Airspeed Oxford NZ2155 (ex-RAF PG942) Items include a Cheetah engine, wheels, two cowlings, control column and wheel, rudder pedals, seat components, instruments, two engine bulkheads, outer wing spars, engine support frame, control pedestal, throttle quadrant, undercarriage components, fuel tank, tail wheel leg and fork, various switches, lights, panels, foot plates, engine components, and other items too numerous to list here.

If you are wanting to rebuild an Airspeed Oxford (flying or static), build a cockpit, or just want to own a warbird project for future sale/swap/trade, this auction should interest you! With a realistic and attractive $3900.00 reserve, this is a great opportunity to own your piece of New Zealand WWII aviation history. For the successful bidder, I will provide a full history of how the aircraft was recovered and also give details on where you might be able to acquire other Oxford components.

The photographs show NZ2156 (an Airspeed Oxford one serial after NZ2155 and an example of what a complete aircraft looks like), the Cheetah engine, and part of the collection of components (including control column, rudder pedals, engine bulkheads, undercarriage parts, panels, etc). "

www.trademe.co.nz/Antiques-collectables/Militaria/WWII-earlier/auction-33506626.htm

Chris Rudge ?

[Dave Homewood]

Peter, I believe that aircraft (or pile of remains)was sold by Chris Rudge to someone who then worked with Glyn Powell. He posted about it a few times on the FlyPast Forum but it has gone quiet now.

[curtiss]

The C47 data plate was in a box of bits that I got from a relation of a local resident who passed away recently. Apparently they were involved in the scrapping of the Dakota's plus some Mosquito's. Sorry if the term "picked up" confused people.

Strangely the box also contained an Air Ministry bomb distributor panel which I have only seen fitted in Lancasters. Perhaps it was also used in something in NZ.

The development of Marlborough for Vineyards has resulted in a lot of the old farms being cleared with all sorts of stuff being dumped.

Some small items continue to turn up but nothing like the amount that was here when Shorty was about....

Regarding the material dumped at the back of Woodbourne. Some parts were uncovered when the power cable for the new control tower was put in. We had a real good scratch about but everything was so badly corroded it was really difficult to even work out what was aircraft and what was general rubbish. The only bit we positively identified was the remains of a cylinder head ( and a bunch of old food cans). I would really doubt that there is much worth recovering.

[denysjones]

I've only just caught up with this thread and it's a personal interest in a couple of ways.

I went to school with Bill Gluyas who's father was F Gluyas of Morven. Of course at that time I didn't have an interest in Hudsons (equally I never worried too much about the one in my uncle's yard at the same time). Ah for hindsight!

I haven't had any contact with Bill Glyuas since school (pre 1969) but the school roll reveals that both his sons have recently been resident in Te Kuiti so I doubt you'll get a handle on the Hudson's fate from family unless you look to Te Kuiti.

Curtiss..you mention a bomb distributor panel. Any chance of a picture as Hudsons have a bomb selector switch panel which I've seen people label as AirMin PNo 5D/372 ro 5D/656

[errolmartyn]

I would guess that 'F Gluyas' in the above is the same man who had a close call in RNZAF service as featured here:

'For Your Tomorrow - A record of New Zealanders who have died while serving with the RNZAF and Allied Air Services since 1915 (Volume Two: Fates 1915-1942)':

Sat 17 Jan 1942
Far East
Enemy air raid on Singapore
205 Squadron, RAF (Seletar, Singapore)
Catalina I Z2151/Y - at about 1100 two enemy fighters strafed the Squadron’s Catalinas moored at Seletar. Catalina ‘Y’ and another burst into flames and sank, while two others were badly damaged. Two airmen aboard ‘Y’ were killed during the attack, including a New Zealander whose body was later recovered and buried in the Bidadari cemetery, but later reinterred at Kranji. Also on board was LAC F Gluyas, RNZAF, who, although wounded, succeeded in swimming away from the sinking Catalina.
(Flight Rigger): NZ391096 LAC Frank Frederick EDWARDS, RNZAF - Age 26.

And from Vol Three:

Amendment - EDWARDS, F F – he was actually on board Royal Netherlands East Indies Naval Air Force Catalina Y.54. Gluyas, slightly wounded in the attack at 1110, was on board the other Catalina sunk (Z2151), acting as a ‘boat guard’.

From other records:

NZ391250 Francis Gluyas enlisted in 1939 and sailed from NZ for Singapore as a Fitter IIA on 2 July 1941 on the Roggeveen.

Errol

[Dave Homewood]

I knew that name Gluyas rang a bell, Frank Edwards was the first airman from Cambridge to lose his life in the war. That is interesting that he was actually onboard the RNEINAF Catalina. It is still correct that Frank was attached to No. 205 Squadron RAF, isn't it? He and many others found themselves stranded after the Singapore Ferry Flight left with the Short Singapores headed for Fiji. I believe the groundcrew were attached to No. 205 Sqn to help out and await further orders as to their return home. In the end they practically had to take matters into their own hands and when they arrived back in NZ were treated quite poorly by Air Headquarters.

[errolmartyn]

Re Frank Edwards (who sailed with Gluyas):

'For Your Tomorrow - A record of New Zealanders who have died while serving with the RNZAF and Allied Air Services since 1915 (Volume Three: Biographies & Appendices)':

EDWARDS, Leading Aircraftman Frank Frederick.
NZ391096 (prev A391096); b Esher, Sussex, England 5 Aug 15; to NZ 1920; Cambridge DHS; motor mechanic - Wilkinson & Co, Cambridge. RNZAF Hobsonville as Flight Rigger 23 Oct 39, 1TTC 16 Nov, Hobsonville 24 Jan 40, remust as Fitter IIA & 2FTS 7 Jun 40, att RAF & emb for Singapore 2 Jul 41, arr 4 Aug 41, 205 Sqn (Singapore, Catalina), killed in air raid 17 Jan 42. Kranji War Cemetery - 37.B.1, Singapore. Son of Frederick William & Minnie Edwards, Leamington. [phot. TWN 4.3.42].

Errol

[errolmartyn]

Sept 28, 2010 15:19:38 GMT 12 Dave Homewood said:

Frank Edwards was the first airman from Cambridge to lose his life in the war.

Depends if (a) you mean 'air' only (possibly Army/Navy losses also?) and (b) what is meant by 'from' Cambridge. At least seven other air force men who were either born or resided in Cambridge died prior to Edwards.

I'll leave you to seek them out in my Vol Three of 'For Your Tomorrow'!

Errol

[Dave Homewood]

Thanks for that. Of course the ground staff of the Singapore Ferry Flight were attached to No. 205 Squadron for administrative only initially and they worked as a seperate unit restoring the Singapores toflight. In fact RAF staff joined the NZ unit in this, rather than the kiwis joining in on the RAF work. But once the Singapores had left, that is when they were at a loose end and wondering how they could get home. They then began working with the RAF chaps on their work with the Catalinas. An interesting period. It's sad that Frank and his cobber were killed as the rest all got home to NZ, and many of them went on to No. 8 GR Squadron.

[Dave Homewood]

Depends if (a) you mean 'air' only (possibly Army/Navy losses also?) and (b) what is meant by 'from' Cambridge.

Yes airman only. Cambridge suffered Army and Navy losses before Frank's death, Archie Shaw was killed on Achilles in the Battle of the River Plate, for example. But Frank Edwards was reported in the Cambridge newspaper as the first Cambridge RNZAF member to die overseas. I originally thought this must be correct but now that you have forced me to think about it and investigate, the paper is wrong. Thanks!!

At least seven other air force men who were either born or resided in Cambridge died prior to Edwards.

Hmm, yes. Now that you've made me think about it...
Arthur 'Chum' Jessop died on 11 Sep 1940 when he walked into a propeller at Rongotai - not overseas

Brian McNamara was killed in a Wellington (air accident) on 10 Jan 1941

Brian Miller was killed in a Hampden (air accident) on 10 Oct 1941

Don Law was killed in a Spitfire (air accident) on 19 Oct 1941

Bill Hewett drowned in the Atlantic after his troopship was sunk on the 12th of January 1942, so definately before Frank

Daniel Clifford died the same day but logic tells me some hours later

That is six I can think of. Who have I missed? The earlier statement I made was of course wrong, it was half-remembered only and I should have checked my facts. But the newspaper did report him as the first Cambridge airman killed overseas, which is also wrong. I would guess they meant 'in action', but I would argue that Bill Hewett was killed in action, since his troopship was sunk by a German U-boat.

There is a question over whether Daniel Clifford ever lived in Cambridge, and I know you've raised that before Errol. I have not yet found documentation to prove he lived in the town but his wife certainly lived there during the war so it was the place he wrote "home" to. Te local museum reckons he did have a connection but I've not yet fouind it.

[errolmartyn]

Dave,

My Vol Three (Bios & Appendices) records 23 Cambridge-born men (1 WWI, 21 WWII and 1 Post WWII), three of which not on your pre-Edwards listing, plus a number of others connected to the town by way of education or employment.

Errol

[pjw4118]

Still going through my "junk" and came across a list of airframes/parts existing in 1963.The AHSNZ then had a few branches and the Auckland one about 20 members including Don Noble , Bunny Darby, Bob Mc Garry , Lynsay Mayo etc.
Lyndsay was at the Engineering School then based at Ardmore and from a shed there we did pull a new crated Allison engine out for the proposed rebuild of NZ 3009 at MOTAT.
Any way we compiled a national list , each entry had to have been verified by a member using eyeball or camera.
If it is of interest to anyone I will post a list.

[Richard Wesley]

Sounds like a great list, would love to see it!